Searched on "4 O'Clocks" and this discussion came up. Nice old discussion! In my area (Maritime NW) I have never seen 4 O'clocks in the nurseries and big box stores. I'm speculating that's because most of their flowers are sold in bloom, and 4 O'clocks bloom when larger. They probably don't bloom in little 6-packs or even in 1-gallon containers. I'm guessing about that. Also, if the flowers are not reliably open when the stores are open, people might not buy them. I bought seeds via the internet. Feeling nostalgic about gardening from my childhood, and these 4 O'clocks were part of that. I grew some about 10 years ago and as I recall they did OK here. I'm more into gardening now than I was then, so maybe they'll grow better. Plus I have a deer and rabbit problem, and maybe they'll be resistant to those animals. Maybe. I read start them 6 to 8 weeks indoors before the last frost, for cool climates like mine. They can also be planted in the ground, but maybe will start blooming later. A packet has plenty of sees, so I can try both. Nice discussion! I've lost the experiences of older gardeners in my family, and it seems there aren't a lot of gardeners in my neighborhood, so it's up to me to discover what works and what doesn't. Pass-along plants like these are worth preserving for the next generation!

I have four o'clocks too and love them. After a while, with successive reseedings ours all turned white, but they make a mass of foliage and flowers and look good and full of bloom when not much else is happening in the garden, and without water. I appreciate the dangers Anita cites, but I don't see them getting out of hand in our environment, where there's enough water for other plants to grow, and where mowing does the rest. We've had Jalapa mirabilis (four o'clocks) for years, and they've stayed where we wanted them and not strayed. On another subject, I like your freewheeling garden, Jackie. Ours is another that gets only a reasonable minimum of control, though it isn't as lush as yours--yet. And we have weed problems, which are at their worst this time of year. We're working at it, though! Melissa

Hi Fluffy, know how it feels to be in you position (with a new house and what not, we're going to move soon too)...tell you what, I have four o'clocks (yellow, red, shite and lots of pink and some unknown coloured ones, I'll give you a mix of everything), some petunias, some orange calendula and some balsam impatiens. I'll send you a bit of each if you send me a SASE. I also have some semi-wildflower mix for atracting butterflies and hummingbirds if you'd like some

I hear so many complaints about four o' clocks... how they are so invasive. For me, they are cheep filler, they hide the ground until I have more cannas, dahlias and glads. It's easy to dig up a tuber, and plant it somewhere else. They do great in pots. The plant may wilt, even appear to die, but a week later, you will see it emerging again. I have dug up near football sized tubers, which can grow plants nearly 5' tall. And overwintering...My mother in Idaho (it's rather cold in winter) doesn't dig up her tubers, they reseed themselves every year, or just grow back. An easy, tough, perfumed, lovely plant and all my hummingbird freinds agree. boomchuckchuck