Since you're questioning the legality of an unwritten deal in which it appears you may have come out on the short end of the 5.65 acre stick, I'd recommend having a new survey of your property done.

The "property shift" was obviously a hassle-free solution for the original neighborly parties and I doubt it's binding.

Talk to a real estate lawyer.

Hire a surveyor to stake your property lines first. He will research your property lines to do that job. That will show any discrepancies in the field. Then you know from where you are working from and what issue is at stake (if I can use that term).

The surveyor is a licensed professional that knows and does more than sticking stakes in the ground. He should be able to discover a problem, if one exists. If he stakes out the property and the others are encroaching, it is up to them to disprove his survey. It is possibly that they have encroached for long enough where they could claim the land as adverse possession. That is twenty years where I am and has to be done without the agreement of the land owner letting them encroach. The law uses terms like "hostile" and others which sound like the claimant is stealing the land (because that is essentially what they have to do). It is alomost that if you overtly steal it and get away with it for twenty years you get to keep it. On the other hand, you can't steal what you were allowed to borrow. I also don't believe that you can verbally convey land. When land is conveyed it needs to be recorded. In my state that is done at the county "Registry of Deeds". I'm sure there is an equivalent in Wisconsin.

If and when the surveyor identifies a problem or a conflict with the survey that an immediate abutter has with your property, bring in the attorney. If you bring in the attorney first, he will bill you at a much higher rate than the surveyor for the lot line research and then you'll have to hire the surveyor in the end anyway.

Part way down this page is a link to where you can access records and do some research on your own. It might be difficult without experience, but you might want to do some homework on your own.

Here is a link that might be useful: Your county's registry

I'll second laag's advice. You need to first figure out exactly where your property lines are. A survey and (probably eventually a lawyer) won't be cheap, but the longer you let the situation go, the more you are tacitly agreeing that the former arangement was OK with you.

We completed a property line adjustment last year. We wanted to buy a ditch between our property and a decommissioned railroad bed. We learned more about the history of our property than I wanted to know. We discovered, for one thing, that our property ran along, not just the railbed right-of-way, but part of the land set aside for the siding. In other words, a big chunk of what we thought (and many previous owners had thought) was our property actually also belonged to the neighboring farmer. Talk about opening a can of worms. We could have gone the adverse possession route, but didn't want to get into an adverserial relationship with our very nice neighbors. We purchased everything that we had previously thought was ours, plus the original ditch we wanted.

Laag is also right that any real property line adjustment will be recorded, as will any purchase of the property and the sale prices. I now know every previous owner of our property from a couple of afternoons looking through all the big old ledgers recording transactions.

Have fun!
Kelly

Taking property by USA laws follows three possible routes; the Iowa law, Maine Law, and other. In Iowa you can take land if you unknowingly occupy and improve it. In Maine you must have the intention to take someone's land, and for other something less than the Maine Law. Interestingly a no tresspassing sign under the Iowa law would demonstrate that the land is owned by others, so one could not unknowingly take it. Conversely by the Maine law, a no tresspassing sign demonstrates that you know that land is not yours. In all cases the "taker" must improve the property somehow (i.e building, cultivation) and just not proclaim ownership. Under some laws the pocession must be for >20 years or more and the "taker" must be paying property tax on the land all along. After all if you want it and it's "yours" you must pay property tax on it.

So the take home message; if you are concerned that someone is trying to "take" your land check the tax records and see if someone is paying taxes on part of your property.

You can get a survey done and your neighbors' can get a survey done and they might not agree. And when you go to hire an attorney, don't get just any old attorney, get one that deals with property. In Ohio they are connected with title companies. Good luck.

I have had several property line discrepancies on land I have owned in California. I have learned the hard way it is best to get a survey before purchasing the property and I am always present when the survey takes place if possible. I have the corners clearly marked and I keep them marked while I own the property.

Prescriptive easement in this state is 7 years. At one of my properties, I consulted a real estate attorney and he suggested I work out the discrepancy with the neighboring property owners as it would cost me much more than it was worth to make the distinction using a lawyer. We had only owned the property at that time for 6 years, short of the prescriptive easement law. Even if we had claimed prescriptive easement we would have had to apply for quiet title to claim the land. The lawyer told us that prescriptive easement was the use of the land and improvement while excluding anyone else from using it including the owner, such as putting up a fence a gate, improving a driveway and putting up a sign saying no tresspassing. Conversely if you let your neighbor use your land or driveway and don't want them to take your land by prescriptive easement, then you can put up a sign saying "right to pass can be revoked at any time", in this way users cannot claim the land as theirs.

At this same property part of our driveway was on the neighbor's land. We came to an agreement whereby they could use the top of our driveway so they could have a circular driveway and we got to use the lower portion so we could get in and out of our property without putting in a new driveway.

At another property we purchased a storage shed was partially on a neighboring lot, we came to an agreement whereby the lot line was adjusted and recorded so the shed was on our property.

We had a property in Arkansas where a highway ran through part of the land some of it was on one side and some on the other. We eventually sold the part on the other side to a property owner on that side. Our property also had a driveway through a forest company land but had never been recorded. We approached them for a recorded easement to make things legal and they did the survey and recorded it all for us for a nominal fee - we lucked out on that one.

At our current property we had a survey and told the owner of the land next to us that we would remove the fence and put up a new one on the property lines once we moved in. He has cows and wanted a barbed wire fence with a hot wire. We don't have cows and wanted to block out his collection. We both put up a fence - but in order for both fence posts to be put up, each of us had to move the posts in a small amount so they wouldn't touch and we could install the posts - so there is a sort of no man's land between the two fences. We still are keeping the stake well marked in the middle of the no man's land.

So I have learned getting a survey at the time of purchase, ironing out any discrepancies with the owners and adjacent property owners beforehand, is very important. Sometimes surveyors do a survey but only place corner stakes or no stakes at all (they may find a pin in the ground but don't flag it and on heavily wooded property it is nearly impossible to find or they may state found a witness tree) - if you have a piece of paper with survey points, degrees and angles on it and no stakes on the land then you may not be able to determine where your property line is. At our present property we had corners staked but the land ran up and and down a hill and we could not run a string line so we asked the surveyor to stake the middle of the line at the top of the hill so we could put up a fence. If the property is wooded a string line would not work. Surveyors can also be asked to flag the lot lines too - tieing red tape along the line to trees and shrubs that may be thee - but unless the line is marked more permanently, these flags fade and wither away and over time the property line becomes unclear again.

I would suggest checking with a local real estate office to see if they have a previous survey for your land and perhaps your neighbors properties. Then hiring a licensed surveyor recommended by someone other than the neighbors. Have the surveyor clearly mark the property corners and flag the lot lines. Then you can approach your neighbors about any discrepancies. Keep in mind, the cost of moving a fence may be cost prohibitative, depending upon the the type of fence and its use (are you receiving a benefit from the fence of your neighbor, is it containing your animals?). If you determine the fences show you with less land and it is significant and you don't want to have the fences removed, then perhaps your state has something similar whereby you can put up a sign stating that permission to pass can be revoked at any time facing your neighbors' properties.

Surveyors typically charge by the number of corners, and if the property is irregular then the survey can become more expensive.

Good luck.

What is your intention? To simply establish that you own the land? Or to make the neighbors move their fences? It is always useful to know exactly where the property line is, so get a survey. However these neighbors will most likely be your neighbors for a long time. Asking them to move a large fence over 10 feet because technically that land is yours is one way to gain 10 feet of land, and also create a neighbor problem for as long as you are there.

So get a survey to establish the boundaries. Then determine whether it's worth it to ask for anything to be moved. You could simply inform them the fence is in the wrong place, and when it becomes time to replace it (they all eventually rot) that is the appropriate time to move it.

It always amazes me that people are worried about upsetting people who are aggressively asserting control of land that does not belong to them. Real estate is usually the highest valued tangible asset that anyone owns. How can anyone just let it go because they don't want to upset the neighbors by stopping them from taking it away?

Set it straight right from the get go. You are not taking anything away from the neighbors. The closest thing to that was that previous owner took back anything he may have allowed when he sold you the land. He conveyed it to you. You own it. It is yours to decide what to do with, not the neighbors.

Assuming that you hired an real estate attorney to represent your interests during the purchase of the property, and at the closing, that attorney should be your very first contact...not a surveyor.

Yes, ultimately, a surveyor may, out of necessity, be a participant in the resolution process, but review of the legal documentation that was provided during the purchase process is the first avenue to be travelled.

It may very well be that agreements were 'negotiated' long ago between the previous owner and his neighbors, it may not be. It may be that those 'agreements' have legal standing, it may not be. But if the seller, from whom you purchased the property, represented something in the sale that did not include those agreements, and the size of the property being sold and purchased was something other than the number represented on the legal documentation, then your attorney is the first stop for you in the process of setting things right.

Understand that if there were 'agreements' and they do have some legal standing in your state, then what you purchased may indeed be much smaller than what was represented to you, and your only legal recourse may be lawsuits naming the previous owner and the realtors for misrepresenting the actual property limits and size. But only your attorney can help you identify those.

Yes, a surveyor may ultimately be called upon to check lot lines and documentation in the public registry, but no surveyor worth his salt will want to get in the middle of something that may be settled legally, with his help to set the lines on the ground.

Talk to your real estate attorney first. And if you did not use a real estate attorney during the purchase and sale, then find one.

These situations can get really ugly, very fast. And it's better to allow the legal begals to handle things, rather than be yelling over the fence.

Owning less than 5 acres instead of more may affect how your property can be divided up or zoned in the future. In our county, we can't build on less than 5 acres so a little land shaved off around the edges could make a big difference. My neighbor has a house on nine acres and wanted to sell off some of his land but he can't because each lot would have to have a minimum of five acres. He's a acre short of making a lot of money.
I think it sounds like the neighbors were taking advantage of the previous "nice" owner. It makes no sense that widening a road would have a domino affect and shift boundaries down the line. I believe they measure from the center of the road, not the edge.

Thanks to all for your feedback.
I've since gone to the county courthouse and gotten copies of surveys done. The 1994 surveys registered with the county were done using county monuments from the other direction than what my neighbor told me had been lost. The points referenced and the dimensions shown in the survey are all verifiable back to previous documents when the property was origially divided from the larger 40 acre parcel - well before the survey and before any current neighbors moved in. Therefore, I'm very confident that the markers are located where they should be. All I need to do is wait for the spring and find them to double check that the fences are at the markets and re-measure the lot dimensions.
The people at the courthouse were exremely patient and helpful. I recommend that be a primary stop in anyone's research.
Thanks!

Thanks for reporting back. It is a courtesy too few posters extend. I am sure the folks at the courthouse offered great insight into the sometimes overwhelming volumes of information available to all.

Working from a position of knowledge gives one a distinct advantage.

IronBelly

Good point herrknox - we own .98 acres, if we have 1.0 acres or more, we could subdivide the lot. Thanks for reporting back with your findings!

We are closing on a house and the property line for our place and the neighbor is very screwy. How difficult would it be after the closing to get the property line changed if both parties come to an agreement about the new line?

New question, start new thread.