Daniel, do you have plants yet?

Jennie Sims

9 years ago

It is planting time for your zone. Did you get plants?

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Comments (47)

daniel_nyc
9 years ago
Who... me...?

Errrr... lemme think...

Well...

...

Ok, I'm joking, NO, I didn't plant yet.

These days I plan to visit a few nurseries + Home Depot, Loews...
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
9 years ago
Ok, Daniel. Hurry up! The LI Ferry is leaving . hehe

Sey
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I planted all my veggies in March but I had covers on them. I have cherry tomatoes and basil, that I started from seed, in pot's that were covered with plastic wrap but are now out in the open and doing great. Well, the tomatos are great the basil is okay, they have a few brown leaves from the cold temps the last couple of weeks. I think they'll be okay though, they already look like they're recovering. I also have, cucumbers (from seed), Rutgers tomatoes, red, green, and yellow peppers (transplants) snow peas and pole beans (from seed) that I planted in the ground in March. The tomatoes had milk carton covers on them until April and the cucumbers had water bottle covers on them until this week. The cucs are still pretty small, probably waiting for the warm weather. The tomatos and peppers are doing great they're about a foot and a half high. The snow peas are 2 ft high and the pole beans about 3. I was anxious to get started this year because I didn't move into my house until the end of May last year and didn't get to plant anything until June. When I did plant, I didn't have time to prepare the beds and was ony able to put in a couple tomatos, peppers, and cucs which all did pitiful. I think I ate all of three tomatos 2 peppers and one cucumber from my garden last year. I'm hoping things go better this year but after I planted I realized that my stupid chimney on my house is situated just perfect to throw a shadow on my bed from 2:30pm onward. I'm already planning my new garden for next year. A 3ft x 20ft raised square foot garden, made from cinderblocks and painted a beautiful terra cotta, filled with gorgeous soil that I'm going to make from compost, with a trellis on the north side for my vining crops, and a buried soaker hose, which will get sun from 9am until sunset, and may be made into a cold frame in the winter. It's all in my head right now so it may never come to fruition but a girl can dream can't she?
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I wouldn't worry if the soil is compact. You can grow tomatoes in clay if you really want to (and there are both pros and cons to this). If your area is arid, you might not have problems with fungal diseases from mud splashing on your leaves, either. With all that ground cover from the grass around, I'm guessing you wouldn't need to worry about that as much, though. That said, however, if you have really loose soil atop clay, tomatoes may hesitate to venture into the clay, and just fill up the loose soil. I've seen this happen in a container with about half clay (on the bottom) and half potting soil (on the top). The clay was almost untouched, by comparison. One thing you can do is grow your tomatoes out bigger before you plant them outdoors (give them more light indoors for faster, stronger growth). You don't need a special grow light (CFLs will work, even if they're not 6500k, but higher color temperatures are better for leaf growth; lower ones are better for flowering and protecting your seedlings from damping off disease, but they'll help leaf growth, too). Then, you can use a post hole digger to dig a narrow, but deep hole, and plant the plant. Because it'll be deep, competing with weeds shouldn't be much of a problem insofar as nutrient competition goes, unless the grass or weeds have deep roots or are parasitic. Tomatoes will also grow roots all along the buried stem. Normally, tomatoes don't need to be planted particularly deep, but it does help them get more water and nutrients. More nutrients doesn't necessarily mean bigger tomatoes. You have to keep in mind that the nutrient balance also matters (not just the pure amount of a certain one). Deep tomatoes seem to be easier to dry farm. However deep you plant them, though, make sure there's lots of foliage up top, still. If you plant them super deep but only leave a few leaves up top, they might take a long time to grow big, but if you have plenty of leaves up top, they should grow fast. If you want big tomatoes (since I brought it up) get a variety that gets big in your climate and conditions, and make sure it gets enough potassium, phosphorus and magnesium. Not all tomatoes are the same, and many have different requirements. Where do you live? I recommend saving your seeds every year (from tomatoes with the traits you like the most) and regrowing them, because it should help whatever variety you're growing to adapt better to your conditions. Landracing could be even better, but you might not have room for that. :) As someone mentioned earlier, container gardening can also be great. I know someone who said she got about 100lbs of tomatoes from one Early Girl tomato plant in a container with nothing but Miracle Gro potting soil. She may have fertilized with Miracle Gro, too, but I think the only fertilizer was that which the soil came fertilized with. The problem with containers is that they can dry out fast in at least some climates. Having a narrow opening at the top may decrease evaporation (but unless your soil drains well, it may make watering take longer).
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Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
9 years ago
Daniel,
Whats going on ? Have you got what you wanted ? Hope you have.

Sey
daniel_nyc
9 years ago
No, I didn't.

A few months ago somebody made a big cut on the side plastic of the greenhouse (see picture bellow.) Looked pretty ugly from the street.

I neglected the issues, and few weeks ago the village send me a letter that I have to take down the structure - which I obviously did. 3 years I had no problem...

Beside, like I said in the past, I have 2-3-4 VERY important projects, so growing tomatoes, right now, it's NOT a priority for me. Maybe in the near future.. Yes, I will be late, but...

Meantime I'm enjoying seeing your work guys.

Again, good luck all ! Especially those in the Brandy Boy contest.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
Neibors started asking me, when they will get tomatoes - like it happened in the last few years.

Well...

I miss my tomatoes...
Jennie Sims
Original Author
8 years ago
Daniel, I am really sorry you have things going on in your life that you can't have your tomatoes this year. You will have lots of time to dream and prepare for next year, though. I won't have a garden next year as we are moving. We will have the house on the market in the spring and won't buy a new house until this one sells. So unless the timing is perfect, I probably won't have tomatoes next year. I miss them already!

Jennie
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
Well , we make choices in life and set our priorities.
In economics there is a concept called utility and marginal utility value.
A kid has 50 cents to spend: He can buy bubble gum, an ice cream, a soda .. he can afford only one of them. To one kid bubble gum might offer more utility value and to other a nice ice cream cone. Had he have a buck, he could've had more choices.

Sey
Jennie Sims
Original Author
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
say, it is called life happens and has nothing to do with any economic concept.

Jennie
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
Jennie, I did not say it is the economics. BUT a concept. used in economics
Sey
hudson___wy
8 years ago
That explains it Daniel - hope you will continue to participate in our threads while you are taking a break!!
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
Yeah, well...

Meantime missing the whole thing.

The yellow tomato in the picture bellow was super-yummy.

The only problem is that I NEVER planted color tomatoes.

This year I planned to have many color tomatoes, but...
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
I think that Daniel has a secret garden but won't reveal it. hehe

Sey
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
Sey, I
wish I have a secret garden, but unfortunately, I… don’t.

But, as I
mentioned in shijitake’ thread - do I need to mulch my tomatoes? is it OK that they're growing on grass - I do
have… two volunteers this year.

One month ago - on July
22 - they looked like this:

Which make
me think that they showed up in early- mid July. I have no idea why they came
so late.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
On those locations last year I had: on the left – Early Girl – and on the right – Brandy Boy. While there is no guarantee that these plants (2015) are the same varieties as the plants there last year, chances are pretty high, imo.

So the rules for my experiment were:

For the plant on the left - I tried to mimic shijitake’s experiment condition:

● No cleaning the grass (technically “weed” in this case)
● No fungicide
● No mulching
● No extra water – except the water for the grass / lawn (1 in. weekly)
● No fertilizer

For the plant on the right:

● No fungicide
● No mulching
● Yes, cleaning the grass a little bit
● Yes extra water
● Yes fertilizer; I used Liquid Kelp Natural Seaweed Fertilizer (GS Plant Foods)
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
The “right”
plant grew nicely.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
As you
can see, today, August 26, the plant on the left is not doing very well; no flowers even – and it’s
pretty late.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
On the
other hand the plant on the right, well… different story.

It’s
doing pretty well: flowers…

and even
a small tomato.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
With A
LOT of luck in mid-late September, I will have some tomatoes.

I’ve
prepared a frame for the tomato on the right ( I didn't have a smaller one.) I used that frame last year for Cherry tomatoes. The Cherries went all the way to the top.

Obviously
I don’t expect the plant to reach the top of the frame – 12 ft. high – but it
might grow 6-7 ft. tall. If the plant would have shown up one month earlier - June instead of July - most likely the plants would have grown over the frame.

Anyway, the
frame allows me to organize the way I want all those branches, to make sure all
the leaves receive maximum of direct sun light.

As you
can see the branches are not crowded, so some diseases are also avoided.

Well, let’s
see how the experiment goes…

NOTE: my
experiment and shijitake’s experiment are a little different: she placed her plants ON the ground – and then covered them with dirt - while my tomatoes, for
being volunteers, have their roots IN the ground.

So
obviously, mine have better conditions. But, like shijitake, there is no
mulching and no fungicide – both things totally against my basic rules of
growing tomatoes. But… that’s why experiments were invented for – to break
rules.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
Technically, only the left plant grows in the lawn; the right one, not really.
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
Daniel, Have you figured out what variety your volunteers are?

We have one cherry volunteer that has lots of fruits and it is not even 2 ft tall.

Sey
daniel_nyc
8 years ago

Did a little cleaning: old big leaves were removed because they were making shade to the new growth. The old leaves were ok – no yellowish or brownish – but direct sun light for the new growth is important, imo.

The plant looks a little “bald” but in 2-3 days everything will be ok.

Sey wrote: > We have one cherry volunteer that has lots of fruits and it is not even 2 ft tall.

Wow, nice. Post a picture.

Sey wrote: > Daniel, Have you figured out what variety your volunteers are?

No.

goodground thinks the plant on the right is a Brandy Boy. Checking my last year’s notes, at that place last year was a… Brandy Boy. Maybe when the fruits will grow bigger, some could identify it better.

Regarding the one on the left, last year there, it was an Early Girl there. I think it could be a Cherry tomato. Again, I’ll have to wait.

Btw sey, the First Frost Date for my location is around November 1st. When do you suggest to remove the new flowers, that will not be able to make ripe fruits ?

Also, did you start the Missouri pruning for your tomatoes ?
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
An update of my 2 volunteers:

Volunteer on the left:

2 months ago:

1 month ago:

Today - September 23:

The volunteer on the right:

2 months ago:

1 month ago:

Today - September 23:

The volunteers came out very late - July 22.

I also had a problem: 2 weeks ago it was very hot here in Long Island, NY - a few days in the 90s + with that record breaking of 97' F.

So I watered, 2 times a week. Everything was fine, except after a watering, it rained 2 days in a row. Not a lot, but enough to soak the soil.

While the plant - stems / branches grew nicely - the tomato fruits STOPPED growing (in size.) So for more than one week the fruits didn't grow nor ripe. Pretty strange. Anyway, these days the fruits started growing again and some started to ripe.

I still don't know what varieties the 2 tomatoes are.

Looks like we will have at least one week / 10 days of nice weather so, I might be able to eat some tomatoes.

The tomato on the right is about 6 ft. high - which is not bad for a 60 days tomato.

If the tomatoes were earlier, well...
ddsack
8 years ago
Nice photo story, Daniel! I'm glad you'll be getting a few tomatoes to eat this year after all.
goodground
8 years ago
Hey Daniel,

Clearly not Brandy Boy. If it was, it did not come true :-(
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
Daniel, very nice pictorial report.

What did you learn from your experience ( twin volunteers) this year ?

Sey
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
Doing good here in Long Island, NY.

The
tomatoes are not very happy with the low 60s outside, but the plants grow nicely.

The fruits
keep growing (in size.) For the tomato on the right, I left the “red” small
tomato to compare how big the other tomatoes grew.

For the
plant on the left, I’ll have to wait for the fruits to ripe.

In early
September I removed ALL the flowers – more than 25 - thinking that they will
not have the time to ripe anyway. I think it was a mistake. We had a nice
September, and signs are that we might have a decent October, so even if they
don’t ripe, they could have grown big enough to have a nice size to be picked
up.

I also
removed many suckers. Unfortunately, I do not have a formula which says: for a
medium size tomato it’s needed 1 sq. ft. of leaves / branches. I estimated that
the current foliage might be enough for the 15 tomatoes on the vines.

Sey, I
will make soon a special post regarding what I’ve learned about growing the two
volunteers this year.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
I picked up the red tomato.

Pretty small, but very meaty and tasty.

The 2 in. of rain in the last few days, made the tom to split.
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
If the plant is PL, then probably it is Stupice
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
Update early
November:

Due to
the beautiful weather – for today Tuesday, Nov. 3, the forecast is blue sky and… 73’
F !!! - my 2 plants are going well.

Didn’t
think that the cherry tomatoes will grow over the 7 ft. tall frame.

Remember, the plants "showed up" in mid... July !

Fortunately, both September and October were nice, so...

The tomato
on the right grew nicely too (about 9 ft. and growing.)

Some
fruits:

Picked up this morning. Not much, but still... something.
ddsack
8 years ago
Not bad for an unplanned no-work garden! Well, not entirely no work, since you did put up supports and prune and water. Did you ever add any fertilizer along with your water?
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
Yes, most of the times when I water the big plant (on the right) I added fertilizer.

I think the plant on the left - the cherry tomatoes - could have been done better if fertilized.
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
Daniel, you almost skipped 2015 season.

Any plans for 2016 season ?

I am fully booked with about 17 varieties (so far !!) . But I won't even start germinating seeds around mid March.

Sey
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
Sey, I
almost finished ONE of my projects. This winter I hope to finish another one –
or if I’m lucky, maybe two – so in the spring of 2016, hopefully I
will grow tomatoes again.

Like you
this year, last year I planted 35 varieties, to see what works well here, what
I like and so on.

Out of
those varieties, I have like 7-8 that I want to plant again – Brandy Boy,
German Johnson, Mortgage Lifter, Park's Whopper, Rose, Sweat Chelsea… Those worked well, and the taste was
good.

I will
NOT plant dwarf varieties again. In my limited experience, the plants grew
either too short (~ 1 ft. needing good mulch from day one) or too high (>3
ft. needing support.) I thought dwarf tomatoes grow ~ 2 ft. without need for support. Anyway, the
production and taste was modest, not even decent.

I will
NOT plant EARLY tomatoes again. For those interested, here are details why not:

- Early tomatoes - B.I.G. disappointment

- Late season tomatoes ripped BEFORE early season tomatoes

- How are your EARLY tomatoes?

I will
plant MANY cherry tomatoes.

I will
also plant MANY color tomatoes.

And I will
try some RUSSIAN varieties.

And of
course at least 3-4 varieties of BRANDYWINE (my # 1 favorite tomato.)

I will
plant 1-2 tomatoes of the same variety.

Around 25
varieties and 50+ plants.
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
Good news , Daniel. One down, one more to go.Good luck !

I like your tentative grow out : Around 25
varieties and 50+ plants.

That should more than compensate for one year of absence.Lol

I am cutting back for 2015 : around 17
varieties and 26 (+/-) plants.

Like you, I am also getting into colors other than pink/reds.

OK. I predict that 2016 will be a GURRREAT year. I don't care what the FA says. hehe.

Set
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
Picked up this morning:
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
Nice Daniel. It is almost December and you]ve got tomatoes from your plants.

Do you like them ? If so, are you saving seeds ? They are nice round cherry size.

I am now fully booked , growing 20 vars and probably 30 plants in 2016.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
Due to
the super-awesome weather we have here – currently blue sky and 54’ F !!! – my tomatoes are
doing well.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
Yesterday, the foliage looked like this:

Today, Tuesday, Novemeber 24 - after the low 30s last night - the foliage looks like this:

The forecast said 37' F, but I'm sure we had at least 5' F lower than that.

Well...
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
PRETTY STRANGE !

A few leaves went BEHIND the net, touching the bricks’ wall.

Those leaves were NOT affected by the freezing temperature.

Probably the bricks’ temperature helped them fight the low
30s temperature.
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
I cleaned the poor leaves.

I only left a few GREEN leaves that escaped the freezing temperatures.
pennypond USDA 10 Sunset 21 CA
8 years ago
Hi Daniel, I'm sorry to see the overnight changes. Was it the first night in the low 30s?
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
Yes pennypond, the first night.

Meantime, today Wednesday DECEMBER 2, 2015, the leaves / branches that didn't dry because of the freezing temperature, are doing ok.

They even have... FLOWERS. How about that ? In... DECEMBER !

Current temperature: 55' F !
Pumpkin (zone 10A)
8 years ago
Those are some hardy plants!
Peter (6b SE NY)
8 years ago
It is the brick keeping them warm. We had frost in mid October. I think most of Long Island did too. I hope you enjoyed some tomatoes.
Seysonn_ 8a-NC/HZ-7
8 years ago
Tomato plants are tougher than most of us think. Only a frost can kill them. They will survive temps in mid 30's fine, as long as the soil is 50F+. But the growth will be stalled.

Sey
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
Yes, I know, it's pretty hard to believe...
daniel_nyc
8 years ago
The picture bellow was taken TODAY, Thursday, December 31, 2015.

Daniel, do you have plants yet?

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