Did not know your location or soil, so use your best judgement. We are each gardening in different areas and a master gardener in your location is probably your best source. Usually when you buy a new rose with a small root system (grafted, 1 gal or less ownroot) they suggest a daily water the first spring summer and most say do not depend on drip as that does not get water deep enough for roses with immature roots. I am just regurgatating the directions they send with their roses not telling what you should do. Good dirt, good drainage, and water make for happy blooming plants. Mine is a north garden and I chase the sun so I am always experimenting to find the best shade tollerant roses. I get good blooms with only 5-6 hrs sun but bright light the remainder. some only get 4 but they bloom less. . If your beds are on a slope I wonder if the moisture might be limited to only the first couple of inches. Might want to check by digging a deep hole a bit away from a plant. Trees can suck moisture from roses at lower depths and tree roots travel a long way from the trunk. They say the 3 most expensive hobbies a person can have are equestrian, yachting, and gardening. Good luck.

Amount of sun needed to grow successful roses is also affected by how far north you are. Though it's hot as heck and very sunny here in the height of summer, at other times our sun will be weaker in our very northern latitude than Georgia or Alabama, and our growing season will be shorter. We really need that full 6 hours of sun to grow good roses. I can't think of any rose I grow that does well with less than this minimum of sun hours here. Evelyn is just awful in too much shade. Diane

Diane is completely correct and I always forget to mention those important details.

I also agree Severe_novice with your assessment. For the time, money and effort growing roses require you could do better purchasing beautiful bouquets of hybrid teas at any grocery store in town. I personally love getting some from publix.

I think most people who grow roses, unless they are in the florist industry do it for the “gardening part” and not just bloom yield. There are easier ways of having beautiful cut flowers arrangements than growing enough roses for the purpose, specially with suboptimal sunlight and high blackspot pressure.

Dianela,

I hope to extract a bit more bloom for landscape effect - I have a small bed on the left side of the driveway - and I'd love to get the hang of them in pots, so I can see them from the kitchen, on my deck. For vase though - it's definitely not worth it. Just the occasional bloom here and there.

Do you grow any in pots? If yes, do any do particularly well for you? You are close to my area so we pretty much have the same conditions.

Roses are not covered with blooms continuously. Roses that are called continuous blooming will usually have a large flush in the spring and then a few blooms here and there MOST of the time. Some will have smaller flushes during the season as well but I don't know of any rose that stays covered in a huge flush of blooms all season.

Seil,

This has been my experience too based on what I have seen, not just with mine, but in general. Yet some people do state their roses have blooms spring to fall. I suppose the amount of bloom at anyone time varies - but some have said theirs is never without some bloom.

I would even take that. :)

Then you need to find the ones that bloom best for you. We can all recommend some that bloom very well for us but the only way to know how well they bloom in your garden is to grow them. It takes a lot of trial and error and time to figure that out so you need to be patient.

The ones that bloom the most for me are Home Run, Watercolors Home Run, Bull's Eye and Champagne Wishes. Julia Child is very good too but she does take a rest now and then. It also helps to keep them deadheaded. I do some hybridizing so I occasionally leave hips on to ripen for the seeds. I have found that that will delay rebloom significantly on those roses.

I have both, this is their first year, so they are still babies. Bolero always has some blooms/buds

Olivia is the same way. It has been super hot here and they still have little blooms on it

Mary Rose on the other hand does flushes. She is getting ready for her second flush. she is also my best Rose (maybe bc in a pot?)

also, all of them got a shot of fish fertilize/kelp. amazing growth right after! So I would recommend!

I know I posted saying if one deadheaded the same shrub @ slightly different times instead of all at once, would it also delay if the next flush would be (all the same) or different in development due to this. It's hot as h3ll lately so from what I understand, roses go dormant anyhow when it's hot. So while they are on Pause, depending on when temps fall, even staggered pruning may still = same bloom time. Anyone have any insight.

a1an, the rose sends out hormones that triggers tne growth. It does that to the whole plant not just the spot you pruned. That's why I tell people to dead head however they want. The rose will grow where and when IT wants to regardless of how we prune it. All the pruning does is trigger the sending of the hormones.

Awesome read Seil. I guess it really doesn't matter on timing of much get's deadheaded. Does deadhead.

I've been doing deadheading as soon as I start to see stuff fade. Keeps the surround area clean vs. petal drop everywhere..

Erasmus I absolutely adore your ballerina under the tree. I had two under a giant oak that I lost to RDD and I am still missing them. I have a small Juniper tree in another location I keep eyeing for another ballerina.

Severe_novice: I am just starting to grow some roses in pots and can't help you much with it. I have noticed however that for mass landscape color some times the roses with smaller/simpler blooms repeat faster. I grow Darcey Bussell in a pot and as long as she gets fed and sprayed she looks wonderful and is a near constant bloomer. In a pot she probably could be fed with bayer all in one to help with blackspot instead of spraying her.

I don’t have pictures of my pot in my phone but I also grow her in the yard. She DOES need spray to look her best

4 plants on 3rd year

I have a little polyantha Kendyl Marie that is a continuous bloomer also and she is clean no spray (2 plants on second year)

Iceberg is a continuous bloomer also with super bloom power, but requires spray.

The drift series provide the most color here in the landscape for zero maintenance. They could also be easily grown in pots.

Bordeaux is a continuous bloomer and does not need spray.

Petal drop? what's that? Diane

Dianela7b - Not to be the negative nanny here. AFAIK, the bayer stuff afaik, has imcropolid, which is not good for our pollinators. I'd do a read into that if you were not aware.

It's been a few years now since I started paying attention, but I am super mindful when I see a bee or butterfly in the yard. Each year, it definitely is less noticeable..

a1an: thanks for pointing that out. It is certainly true that it could affect pollinators. I use It on certain roses only. I do however want to mention than in my yard since I leave in a rural area I have many many butterflies, bees and hummingbirds and they do not really seem to visit the roses with many petals. They always prefer the salvias, zinnias and all the other companion plants as well as simple roses like Darlow’s enigma.

austinkisses2008z8a,

I am looking to get that product you recommended and I would like to get it from Amazon due to better shipping. The trouble is I am not sure this is the authentic product. The OMRI on the package is positioned differebntly and there was a customer who returned the product due to this difference. Do you think this is the same product or should I suck it up and roder from plantsuccessorganics.com ?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01G0PVZ98/ref=crt_ewc_title_huc_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A27K4A1IJ6225M#customerReviews

Apparently, this is an expensive product - never mind the skeptics who argue it doesn't do much anyway - those don't help either.

I use the Plant Success Granular on everything I plant, have done so for years. I buy the 16 oz. can /$19.99. My local nursery sells same can for $39 so it feels like a bargain. I even use it on annuals. Long ago I tried other brands of mycorrhizae that did not work as well. Plant Success has a combo of things, that when together, do the job. I once ran out when planting 4 sweet olives trees in spring, the ones without were actually 3' shorter by the fall, no kidding! I was shocked. I call it my secret ingredient. I just ordered the soluble and it was more expensive, thought I would try it on a struggling rose for an extra kick.. Good thing about soluble is you don't use very much so it should go a long way. The powder is so so easy you just shake all over roots,when you plant,; kinda like salting your dinner. I use a bit more than suggested because none of their products can burn. Honestly, the product goes a long way I use about a can a year and I plant a lot. I would just order directly from them but I do love the free shipping from Amazon. Amazon has us all spoiled. You will not regret purchase wherever you get it from.

Austin,

Thank you so much! The one you linked to is 19.99 for 4oz - but maybe that is the water soluble.

I will look for the can you mentioned - 16oz for 19.99.

PS: Ordered a bit of both.

Erasmus,

Your ballerina is beautiful!

Unfortunately, I am still hooked on full blooms with lots of petals. Some tree branches will have to come down soon. :)

Dianela,

The Drift series sounds promising for my front bed border and I would love to have Bordeaux. I just need to find the right spot for it. For the rose bed, I will not know much until I remove some tree branches.

But I am now looking for the perfect container rose. :)

Severe I only meant to send you to their general website. https://plantsuccessorganics.com/products/granular The soluble is for existing and the dry is for new bushes or transplants. The soluble seems to be more pricey but with the 4 oz pkg. you get 24 gal of mixture which does not seem too bad. if you pour it center of rose right on roots you could do with 2 gal for large bush. The granular that you sprinkle while planting is a once and done so good value.

continued...Did you consider adding perennial or garden phlox in back and between your roses for that constant summer color https://texassuperstar.com/plants/phloxjohn/index.html... https://texassuperstar.com/plants/phloxvictoria/index.html

I have John Fanick and Victoria and they are always giving impact (;like a petunia for flower powder but tall) They go nicely with roses. They go to ground in winter so they are either not around or tiny until summer hits in late May. This works for me because they are out of the way in Feb when I cut back and they are not competing with the huge rose display in spring. Mine get trashy looking at ground about mid summer so I use as background, the flower heads lean forward, the lack of leaves at ground level let lets sun get to base of roses for more basal breaks.. it works for me for no care constant color at rose bush eye level.

John Fanick with Angle Face

John F shown in June. The petunia in front is Bubble Gum and it blooms like this all summer in our 100 degree heat with NO deadheading.

My phone said this was late June of the next year. I remember I had pulled out John F to add another rose but Victoria is to the left and look at BubbleGum petunia, just going to town. It was a left over from the previous year for some reason did not Freeze.

Point being you can have constant color year round except in freezes and my summer garden, though not as lush also has great beauty. I always have roses in bloom, except in freeze. This is a learn as you go hobby. So enjoy the trip and don't fret about it not performing to perfection when you are just beginning the journey. If gardening is your thing then learning is half the fun and rewarding in its own right.

Austinkisses,

I have been toying with the idea of adding other plants in front / among the roses - but I keep putting it off. It's hard to dig into this GA clay and I'd have to amend the soil quite a bit. I've been busy with so many other things in the garden that this seems to be something that's never a priority.

In fact, I'd love some perennials because I realized I hate planting annuals in GA clay. It's a pain to do it every year. This is why I lean more towards containers.

When I see those You Tubers demonstrating planting in their fluffy, dark soil...and saying "now we dig a hole" and they just move the soil a little bit to the side and push the plant in with one stroke...I want to scream.

It takes me forever to just make a small dent in the ground for a pansy. I must till, then mix with fluffy soil, then create a mound...it's a pain.

I dread the bulb planting this year but I got one of those bulb gadgets you attach to a drill...so we'll see.

I guess I am one of those gardeners who would like to see oceans of blooms with minimal time and effort...and I am probably unrealistic ...but I keep looking for solutions. :)

Here are a few photos from this spring, and I've planted none of it. Diane

Those are a small sample of Dara and coneflower, Jupiter's Beard with Munstead Wood, and snapdragons with Evelyn. The snaps are a reseeded natural hybrid, the coneflowers plant themselves everywhere, and I remove anything I don't want, which is very little work. Other self planters and reseeders are penstemon, alyssum, rudbeckia, Dara, orlaya, etc, etc, plus this one: Campanula rotundifolia or Blue Bells of Scotland. Diane

Thank you, Diane. So all of them are perennials or re-seeding types?

What do you do in the fall with them Do they die to the ground? I hope they would not make it harder for me to replace the mulch around the roses, etc.

Would I be able to plant some now, at this late stage in the summer? Or should I wait until next Spring?

Severe, you're not alone with the impossible to dig soil. I use a pick axe and a long, heavy gauge piece of rebar for prying rocks out. I know exactly what you mean about putting off planting because you dread digging the hole. I can't use the bulb hole maker things because in addition to cement hard soil, mine has rocks from bolder size to pebbles, all wedged against each other.

However, if you can get an area mulched, and keep it moist, you will find the soil will improve immeasurably in only a year. Get it weeded or covered in newspaper, cover with about 4" of mulch (wood chip mulch is most effective) keep it moist, and you will have a bed of pretty good soil to plant in next year. You'll still have to amend the holes, but it will be easier.

Get a few annuals and perennials planted in your improved soil, and you will have volunteers coming up, like Diane's.

Ok here is the deal Severe ... it all starts with GOOD DIRT. None of us has it. We all have version of your clay. I had back clay in houston have red in dallas. You cannot get good performance of the plants we picture unless “ya got that good dirt”.
We each amend our beds in our own way. I removed and hauled off all dirt down 2-ish feet, tilled in compost and amendments, added rose soil to that and building up for raised beds adding 5” stone edging to keep all in place. I add 2” of compost each fall as top dressing and 1 1/2” shredding hardwood mulch in late spring. This is probably more extreme that what others do but Dallas dirt does not grow anything but native Texas plants- which are not my choice.
Go back to the dirt and do one small area at at time but do it right. That is where a local master gardener is your best bet. Google Master Garden in you zip code. Rest assured your dirt is jo worse that the test of ours. If you are having sny results with rises in your native soil it beat the heck out of mine

Geeze please read through those typos on phone small screen.

And yes I could now “grow rocks” in my amended garden beds if I so chose.

Austin, you did it the right way. And, your roses look like they appreciate it. I wish I had done that to begin with.

I see. That's what I figured. Must amend the whole area. Digging two feet in all over that bed, raising the bed with brick edging - that's a big project. I probably need to hire landscaping again. :) Thank you! At least now I know not to be silly to start digging small holes in the hard clay and add plants that way. Now we know why I've been putting it off. :)

To make all of this worthwhile, I first need to trim branches off that obnoxious tree in the area.

The bed is already mulched and doesn't have weeds...just my roses. Maybe a project for next year?

SNZ. Still plenty of time in the season before it get's cold. Mulch the heck out of it. Keep it wet. In fall, mulch the leaves. If the town does recycling.....go on a midnight trip and bring those leaves home from other houses, Run it over with the mower, weedwhacker in a bucket, break those leaves down. By spring of next year, the soil will be better. Maybe even hand diggable with ease.

Keep on adding the OM. Soil can be pretty easily workable with just a lil effort.

Does water pool when it rains. You would be amazed by just keeping ontop of the OM, how even this noticable different on no more pooling and better drainage happens !

a1an,

When you say mulch the heck out of it, does bark mulch apply? We add a layer every year.

I can't add leaves on top of the bark mulch due to esthetics and matching with the front bed - but maybe I should remove it, add leaves, and then add the bark back on top? How about grass clippings?

As others suggested, my fear is that, mulch or not, it first needs some ax digging, tilling and mixing with amendments all over that area. I need to hire someone for that as I absolutely cannot dig 2 feet deep into that soil. There are also quite a bit of root ends from that tree which, at this point, I wish I could cut down.

The water seems to drain OK, the bed is on a slight slope.

austinkisses2008z8a,

I read up a bit more on this project and I was wondering if I could do all that digging with a rented rototiller instead of hiring landscaping.

HD says that "10" tilling depth make it perfect for home garden beds."

I can't imagine digging as deep as 2 feet all over that bed. Is a 2 feet depth really necessary or I can get away with 10" depth and then add amendments/fluffy soil and raise the bed?

I got a boatload of tools so what comes to mind is not a manual shovel...but a Clay Bit on a SDS Max Hammer Drill. I don't till as I try to minimize disturbance on the soil so someone better versed can chime in. I do use Pink Bark myself as well.

Yes, you can pull the mulch back and add the leaf mulch. Will also help to keep it in place. Or just throw it on top an light rake of the mulch should allow it to sift in.

Pine bark takes forever to break down. So for something immediate, I'd just use shredded mulch, and as long as it's wet enough, it should break down with the season we have left.

I have had areas where after heavy rains, you will have depressions of water as the drainage was not so great. 2 Years Later, same area, no more standing water.

Thank you, a1an. This may be a topic for the Soil and Mulch forum but to be honest, I am still confused as to how I could plant anything there any time soon without digging in.

The soil is very compacted and hard to work with and I am thinking that just placing some rotted leaves on top would not allow me to set in plants any time soon.

When I planted my roses there I dug a hole for each one separately and I had to work my butt off for every one of those holes. Pick-axe, heavy, deep digging, fighting roots, rocks and huge chunks of extremely heavy, compacted clay - took over an hour for every hole.

The reason I mentioned tilling is because I thought this would allow for loosening up and aeration of the native soil and mixing it with amendments. With some kind of machine, I might be able to go over all that area. By hand, no way.

Otherwise, I might as well just pour 2 feet deep of good soil + amendments, mulch etc on top of the compacted native soil and just do a raised bed. But that would be both very expensive and undoable because I already have a few roses planted there in the native soil (with some amendments in their own hole).

I am probably missing something in trying to understand this amendment process. Then again, I am a novice and living up to my name :).

plant azaleas in raised beds with amended soil and compost not mulch as top dressing (they have shallow roots). Your shade, slope, and tree roots will not benefit rose growth. Get a master garden to verify!!!!

That's what I have in the front bed.

The rose bed is to the left of all that, across the driveway.

Helas, the rose bed in the picture above, next to the tree, is the only spot I have available for roses.

I am not even sure whether I will want to add any more there. I am thinking to focus on container growing after all. Apparently, it's a very difficult spot to grow anything in. Unless I cut down the obnoxious tree. Previous owners did have a small garden there, so it's possible. I just need to amend the soil somehow and I don't see how I can get away without tilling.

I'm z7a, 5700 ft high desert. Most of my roses are in raised beds and containers. I have lots of mature trees and the soil was covered with black plastic and 8 inches of rock for 62 years. I can't even image what would happen to a poor rose if I just plunked it down into the poor ground level soil filled with mature tree roots. Oh my.

A mature tree is an wonderful investment that somebody else made a long time ago that you get to have. I would never cut down a mature tree just for roses. And I am crazy about roses. I'd just focus on the magic of shade and shadow and do roses elsewhere.

One of the reasons I started focusing more on containers rather than just going without where I couldn't do a raised bed, it was from eating at a favorite cafe that has absolutely magical outside dining. It was the way pots of plants, even potted trees, were fitted within stone walls and pergolas and mature trees and string lights. And I realized how fantastic container gardens can look. I notice when I'm in someone's beautiful garden that my favorite spots are the ones where both ground plantings and container plants are combined. I love pots.

I even have a large climbing rose growing in a container. I cut out the bottom of the pot so it's open to the ground and filled it with amended/enhanced native soil. I just add compost/composted manure on top every year. Also I line the interior of my pots to stop root circling, which I sometimes think is the "secret sauce" to container gardening. And of course if the pot bottom is cut out, you create a kind of hybrid pot/raised bed environment.

When there's a will, there's a way. I'm originally from a climate and topography that's perfect for roses, and while I love where I'm living now, I absolutely sometimes miss the ideal growing conditions, where roses can grow like weeds. But my spouse always says "Oh please, ANYBODY can grow roses there...you're something special, here. " Haha!

As far as a continual blooming rose, the closest for me is a polyantha "Ellen Poulsen". It's a blooming machine with very little rest between flushes. After that I would say "Sexy Sexy" is my quickest rebloomer. The miniatures are a whole different league, the turnaround can be days instead of weeks. When you have enough roses, there is always something in bloom anyway and the anticipation for the next flush can be wonderful. Actually, I just now realized, Bonica is without a doubt the closest I've ever experienced as continual blooming. It always seems to have blooms on it. I forgot about Bonica! Sorry, Bonica, I do love you.

The only caveat I have about raised beds is if you build them within a trees drip line, that sometimes trees can be sensitive to the extra soil on top of their feeder roots and may possibly decline.

austinkisses,

Sorry to bring back this thread but I just wanted to say I purchased the Plant Success product you recommended, both for established plants and for new plantings - and I was wondering how often I should water in with that solution for established plants.

They tell you the proportions but not how often you should treat.

I know you mentioned you use some in powder form at planting but I wonder how often to treat already planted roses. Thanks for any tips.

I use on weak or slow to establish plants, ever couple of weeks but diluted more than suggested. You can put on weekly if need be, you cant burn your plant with too much or too often just waste product.

I would take to heart the advise of cactus above. Beside being well written it is stellar in content and gardening wisdom.

Cactus,

I LOVED your post, thank you! It makes a lot of sense. As I mentioned in another thread, we received a quote for trimming some lower limbs as well as one for cutting the tree altogether, and we decided not to cut it. Maybe some trimming in the winter.

I had the same inklings you mentioned: it is an old, healthy tree and it's really a shame to cut it down. I will add one other rose in that bed, all the way to the right, as far away from the tree as possible, but that's it.

I realized I really want to get the ropes of container growing because my deck is begging for it.

It is quite large and I look at it virtually all day long when I am in the kitchen, or at the kitchen table where I like to work, right next to the large windows that open onto the deck and our backyard. So it's worth filling up that deck with pretties because they are very visible.

By contrast, that rose bed under the tree is on a side of the house that is not at all visible from the inside. No point of putting more there if I can't see them; and they are not very visible from the street either, for landscaping impact.

I can fully relate to your sentiments about those cafes with outdoor gardens - I absolutely love them! I am from Europe and I often miss all those urban cafes with gorgeous potted flowers all over.

So interesting the idea of a bottomless pot sitting on amended soil! I may have to try it on this other side of the deck with a climber or something.

Also, did you mean Sexy Rexy?

@Artist-FKA-Novice Zone 7B GA, your deck is simply wonderful! It will be stunning with potted roses. A climber up your deck would be gorgeous.

Yes you are right, I did mean "Sexy Rexy", haha! Just now when I typed the name again, I caught that auto correct changed it; if I hadn't been paying attention, I would have said "Sexy Sexy" again. Funny :)

I started doing bottomless containers because I wanted climbers up into trees. One of my trees, by the front door, is an old pinion type that had many limbs cut off over the years probably due to drought-related circumstances. The tree is thriving now again but with a lot of bare trunk. The soil is too poor to plant roses "as is", and too full of tree roots to amend for a rose bed, and tree roots too shallow to cover with 18 inches of soil in a raised bed. Also it's a slope very similar to what your front yard has up against your beautiful home under the windows.

Anyway, I just got a big pot, cut out the bottom, and treated it like it was a raised bed, and so far it's working great. I recently got several more climbers and I'm going to be doing this to more of my trees. I do make extensive use of fabric landscaping fabric (I've also used packing blankets!) or most recently, I'm using root bags inside most of the pots, except for a few miniatures that I just was lazy about or don't really mind redoing, like in half barrels.

The pots I mostly use are plastic, so the intense sun can cook heat up the roots too much. IME (my anecdotal experience), the fabric keeps the roots cool, prevents them from circling the pot, and encourages feeder roots instead of anchor roots, so I have to repot much less. I have an own root Julia Child rose in the 5th year in a pot (classic tapered shape, 24" top interior measurement) and has yet to be repotted, and is thriving. Well, it WAS thriving, till a few weeks ago when I accidentally left the leaking sprayer dripping in the pot for several afternoon hours and the hose water got so hot I cooked the roots. I lost about a third of the plant. I'm sorry JC!

It's so hot and sunny here right now that roses aren't really doing much if anything.. Yesterday I went to the local public rose garden and every bloom looked fried and tired, if there were any showing up at all. I have blissful fantasies about my entire property being covered with white knitted 30% shade cloth.

You have such beautiful garden scaffolding already with your lovely home and trees and green grass and deck, the roses you add will be pure magic. :)

Yay.Happy Dance Emoji Here. Some buds are now starting to bloom again. The others maybe a week or so behind. We're winding down August. I guess I was wrong estimating 3 blooms. It was only about a month or so before it's previous flush (albit it was hot them). This 3rd flush might last longer but fingers crossed with a 4th Wave

One more comment -- if you have trees making shade, you also have trees with roots that will suck up your nutrients you intend for your roses! And, some trees get very good at sending out chemicals to discourage other plants nearby. I have a friend that keeps all of his roses in pots so they don't have to compete with the coast live oak roots. Me? I just keep trying new bushes until I have some that work. I have one bed that doesn't have oak roots in it, but it does get some dappled shade at different times of day. So I try to only plant roses that tolerate shade and just keep trying different ones until I find the ones that like my garden. The ones that don't like me I give away to friends and neighbors and watch them explode in blooms in someone else's garden. I know people on this forum rave about Julia Child, but she did diddly squat for me. I tried her twice. Gave both away, where they are thriving in new locations. All this to say -- the trees can create more problems than just shading the roses, and it may take a while to find the ones that don't care. I don't even try roses anymore unless they are rated as highly disease resistant, as I need vigorous little shrubs. And I don't spray -- so that makes it even more challenging!

I scrolled up to see when was the last post on this. I deadheaded roughly a month ago. Forget the 4th Wave. tsk tsk. I'm be looking forward to the 5th Flush. Wishful thinking ?

Deborah,

It was a process for me to understand that the rose bed I showed above, around the tree, is simply not a good place. None of my roses planted in that area did well this summer, despite by-the-book care, water, fertilizer, etc. They simply don't bloom enough, never mind Julia Child BS-ed quite a bit.

I realized it's the location. Too much shade in the summer (better in Spring), and probably the competition from tree roots matters a lot too. I do remember battling them when I was digging the holes.

So I don't plan to mess with that place anymore. I don't think I can keep trying new roses until one miracle hits.

What I plan to do for this area is to plant a row of Coral Drifts right outside the canopy, on the edge of that bed. That outer strip DOES receive quite a bit of sun throughout the day even though it's not evident in that picture (taken at a shady time). I hope the tree roots don't extend quite to that point, but l'll see about that soon. I already have a 1 gallon Coral Drift which I want to plant there sometimes this week. Depending on how this one does, I will add more next Spring.

Otherwise, I decided to focus more on containers on the deck, which are more rewarding for me, considering they are visible all the time from my towering kitchen. That - until we will expand a small dogwood bed on the lawn - and then I will add more roses in the right location, where they get plenty of sun.

I accepted this bed above is not going to give me much in terms of roses. Maybe a bit in Spring.

I will leave what I already have there for now, no point in digging them up - but over time, I may replace them with some easy shade plants.

Dear SN in GA: I think you've made a wise choice. Not just a good decision. Garden wisdom reminds me a bit of the prayer -- where we pray that we know what things we can change and what things we can't and the wisdom to know the difference! I hope you find some plants that you love for the challenging areas and enjoy your deck containers!

p.s. Your deck looks wonderful. Ideal for entertaining and cook-outs and GARDENING! :-)