I"m a professional artist and my book is all about color in my chosen field. Trust me when I say that cool gray counter doesn't work with the warm tones of your cabinets. LWO is correct.

I'm also sorry you're upset about the granite not working the way you wanted. I wanted my busy quartzite all going in the same direction and it meant I had to have 2 full slabs to get it to work for my purposes. I slab just for my 84" x 42" island. That is the only way to get it all going in the same direction.

There is nothing wrong though with the two solutions the fabricator came up with for you. You just don't like it. You're wanting a champagne look on a beer budget which I do understand. I was in your position for many, many years.

If I were you, I'd go back to the stone yard and find something that has warmer tones in it and maybe a busy stone that you like where it's less obviously so directional.

" ...venetian ice is everything that's wrong with granite. It's the ugliest thing I've ever seen…

… Upon closer inspection, quartz does not look much different to me than laminate; it looks like someone took a photo of stone and printed it on heavy duty plastic."

Honestly these comments are uncalled for. If you don't like them, fine but there's no reason to disparage them and make someone who does like them feel badly for doing so.

Did anyone on here recommend that you get Venetian Ice or quartz? You've received a lot of good advice and people are trying to help. To be honest, I would hold off on this kitchen reno until you can get what you want. Do not try to keep up with the Joneses, your house is not for them, and that mindset never ends well. Save for what you want, do not feel locked into this stone. I would still argue for a refund as it sounds like communication with the granite yard probably was not the best it should have been.

they need to refund your money.

Tracy, take a step back.

Your attitude is really off putting. The fabricator did nothing "wrong" and it was good that you got to see the template before the stone was cut. I had several friends that got granite have the same issue with the movement not going in the direction they wanted. One of my friends didn't realize the problem until they brought the pieces in for installation. I have also seen threads on this forum where posters have complained about the change in direction of the movement - at least your templater was trying to keep everything in the same direction.

That's fine that you don't like laminate and quartz but your comments make you sound like a petulant child. And the comment about people in the 90s having money? Well, I graduated college in the 90s and still have student loans, and will when my high school junior goes to college in a couple of years. I waited 8 years to get new countertops. Sometimes, that's what happens - life. None of us are entitled to anything.

I won't comment on your color choice because you're obviously dead set on not hearing any constructive criticism.

Talk to the fabricator again. Maybe they can get the movement in the direction you want if they use more seams (ie. have smaller pieces).

Maybe take another tack?

Clearly there was a miscommunication, and it is the responsibility of the pros to communicate the facts of life about stone that has movement to any customer, especially one on a tight budget. No one told you at the time you made your purchase. How lucky are you that they told you before they cut the stone?

Thank them for not moving ahead, ask for a full refund because they should have told you, and they really aren’t out any money (unless I’m wrong and there are costs I’m unaware of).

You have a point and you are clearly disappointed, but even if you feel you’ve had the bait-and-switch, there was no malice involved or they would have delivered the orientation you don't want, and then told you you needed another slab. Try to hang in there, remember the disappointment is better than having a counter you hate, and move on. If you’re out some money in the end, it‘s the price of a learning experience.

Oh my! So much anger and angst!

You're not the first person who has wanted what they cannot afford. In 1984, when we bought the house in which I still live, the kitchen was awful and we bought it intending to gut it. After buying it, we discovered what a new kitchen costs and it was out of the question. I also hated all the cabinets available. I'm a designer and I DO have "champagne taste"; my now late-husband was a secondary school math teacher so our budget might have been more "water" than even "beer"!

We had ugly wood cabinets but at least they were plain. We painted them - twice over the years We got new pulls (brass ones!), we added cabinets and moved the sink to under a window and also replace the window with a huge bay. And we got new countertops. In 1985, Corian had just come out and was the "new, hot thing". It came in 3 shades of white and I chose Glacier White. One of the best decisions I've ever made! Over the next THIRTY-TWO years, we replaced the peel 'n stick tile with solid vinyl tile, and later with site-finished hardwood. We replaced the ceiling fixture with a fan/light fixture and later with pot lights. We put in plug-in under-cabinet lighting; later it was replace with hardwired under lighting. We replaced the drop-in double stainless sink with a huge single integrated Corian sink. We bought a new fancy faucet and 19 years later, replaced that with a higher quality one. We put an stainless sheet behind the stove and used wallpaper as backsplash elsewhere. That was replaced with DIY cheap tile job behind the stove, which later was replaced with nice subway tile on most of that wall when the hood was replaced, a new refrigerator was purchased and two cabinets were removed.

So, I am VERY aware of wanting one thing, not being able to afford it, DIY and making do. I can assure you that life went on, I cooked some amazing meals in that kitchen and raised my children from 12/14 to adulthood. I actually came to like my kitchen and the results, both the first color scheme and the later one. Here's a picture of what it looked like the 2nd time.

Was it what I wanted? No, but it was also not an embarrassment and this house is in one of the most desirable neighborhoods in my town.

Finally, after 32 years and 12 years after losing my husband, I got a new kitchen. I love it! I did it on a very tight budget - no walls moved, no plumbing/gas lined moved - only the refrigerator. I even kept all my appliances. And guess what? I kept and reused those wonderful Glacier White Corian countertops! I love them and have done so now for 35 years!!! I considered marble and then realized that would be a mistake. Instead, I used honed Carrera marble large subway tiles for my backsplash.

The key to "making do" is to fix the things you hate the most. For me, painting those cabinets solved that problem. I was lucky they were simple.

I would strongly advise you to try to get as much of your money back as possible. Then go ahead and paint your cabinets. If you use a high gloss or semi-gloss oil-based paint for the cabinets. They wear far better than an acrylic and/or satin finish.

Then consider putting in a Glacier White Corian countertop and integrated big single Corian sink. If you can afford tile for your backsplash, do it; if not, use wallpaper until you can. You can easily removed the 4" Corian backsplash that will be installed if no tile is used.

Then make a cup of tea or pour a glass of wine and sit back and admire your improvements and remember to be VERY grateful that you have a nice big house in which to live, even with your Dad in the basement. Remember, he might have put you there in order to share the house with him! You will fix it up as you can afford to do so, and in the end, you will thoroughly enjoy all the improvements you've made over the year.

My late husband and I did not have children; I had two from a previous marriage. For us, the house and the garden were what we "created" together and I love living in that creation.

Forgot to show you pictures of the new kitchen from 3 years ago!

First: yes. The things I said no to were recommended in comments further up in this thread. I didn't just start bashing Venetian Ice or quartz in general; I was responding to suggestions. Did I do so kindly? No. I'm clearly upset so I'm responding in the fashion of an upset person. Further, this is my thread, not a thread written by someone ASKING about Venetian Ice or quartz. I didn't go onto THEIR thread and tell them they made a stupid choice. But some of you did come onto my thread just to pick apart an unrelated-to-my-question response. So I ask those of you who did that to reconsider your approach to forum interactions. That's not what I asked about, so why you are responding to it is beyond me other than you want to make me angrier. Congratulations--you won on that front. I hope you are happy and that fulfilled some sort of empty hole in your life.

I agree that it is fortunate that they did the template images before they cut the stone. I cannot imagine how enraged I would be if they simply showed up with it cut that way at install; I would have lost it more than I already am. So perhaps someone in the future can take that lesson from THIS thread. Hey future people reading this: never agree to granite unless you can see what it will look like laid out BEFORE they cut the stone.

That being said: I did not sign up for a $1,700 class on what-not-to-do when trying to DIY contract your own kitchen reno (additionally, I am now missing out on a day's pay on Thursday for the install-that-will-not-be, which is a not-insignificant amount.) So sinking that cost is unacceptable to me. Nor should it be to anyone.

And yes, I'd LOVE to talk to the fabricator again. They are not getting back to me. And I've been nothing but sunshine and smiles.

Edited to add: this is NOT a case of me wanting a thing I cannot afford. This is a case of me PAYING for one thing and being given another.

I have nothing nice left to say to any of you.

Wishing you the best of luck.

Sorry you're going through this mess. I understand your anger.

On the positive side: They sent you a template prior to cutting and bringing the stone for installation, so you were able to at least identify the issue before they showed up.

On the negative side: You are angry and probably frustrated. You've mentioned that you may end up losing your deposit, and to boot, you are going to miss work on Thursday for the cancelled installation.

Some suggestions:

1. If you are going to miss work on Thursday anyway, AND if the stone yard/fabricator isn't getting back to you via phone and/or email... Can you go to their place of business on Thursday to discuss the issue in person with the salesperson, their manager, or the business owner (if that's yet another individual)? If they are not getting back to you, I would suggest going there pretty much as soon as they open up for business on Thursday (or as soon as you can get there on Thursday). Bring or wear your walking shoes, in case it becomes a question of walking through the yard looking for an alternative stone (or stones) meeting your budget, desired palette, and movement within the stone pattern. I'd also suggest bringing something to occupy your time for a bit in case the manager you need to speak to isn't immediately available.

2. Different yards price out their stone differently, as I suspect you've found out. Some price for the actual square footage used. Others by the slab. And still others charge by the square foot, but require that you pay for all of the stone accessed on the long side of the slab. For example, the average/typical slab is roughly 5.5' on the short side and 9.5' on the long side. Now imagine you need a piece that is 3'x6'. That's 18 square feet. The yards near me charge a square foot price along the linear edge. In this example, to get that piece, they would charge for a piece that is 5.5' (the length of the short side) by 6'., which is 33 square feet. Let's say the cost is $80/sf. The yard using a true square foot price would charge you $1,440 for the actual stone being used. The yard along the linear line by the square foot would charge you $2,640. Huge difference. It's a frustrating experience trying to determine how each yard/fabricator chooses to determine their price. If you decide to shop around with other yards, keep the above in mind when comparing costs.

3. When looking at stones with movement, and when you are finalizing a stone's selection, ask the salesperson to show you how they plan to cut the stone using the measurements you have available. Yards around me will actually mark it out on the stone with a special marking pen that wipes off, so that you can envision where the cuts will be made for the counter surface, backsplashes, sink cutout, waterfall cutover, the way the movement's direction flows, etc. If you go back to this yard, ask them to do if you are able to look at some other options. Yes, it's a monumental waste of your time having to possibly go through the selection process all over again. But it's either take a breath and work through this process again (at this or another stone yard)... or stick with the laminate you've got.

4. If you paid your deposit via credit card and decide not to move forward with this yard - consider disputing the charge, as there was an issue with the service they provided, and you have not been able to have the matter satisfactorily resolved.

5. Consider strongly what you want to achieve as a resolution.

A. If in fact the stone slab you selected will not provide the results you want regarding the direction of the movement, then logically there are only a few choices.

(1) - Choose a second stone for the island - either of the same type so that it blends in, or of a complete contrast.

(2) Use stone only for the perimeter, and choose a different material for the island, such as butcher block.

(3) Ask/tell the manager that you expect the template that they previously prepared to be applied to whatever replacement stone you might select.

B. If you believe the stone you selected should be able to provide the results you want... ask to go back and see that stone again. Have the salesperson or manager essentially map out the sections on the stone so that you can see how it might flow, just in case there was some sort of miscommunication regarding the stone. (That almost happened to us in a double bathroom renovation... the salesperson and one of the fabricators almost mixed up the two different stones we'd selected. Thankfully, they called and we got it straightened out). Strange things happen.

Either way.... good luck however you decide to proceed.

I think you should forgot the granite and pick out a solid man-made quartz slab. It will all be uniform, you won't have any directional graining issues and it will look much better. Busy granite is going out of style.

People suggested other materials because they were trying to help you. Sheesh!

Wow. Lashing out at people who have been nothing but kind and considerate to you is pretty gnarly and uncalled for. You are clearly angry, but you’re taking it over the top to a level that is cringe-worthy. Good luck in your renovations. I genuinely do hope that they all work out to your satisfaction.

First: yes. The things I said no to were recommended in comments further up in this thread. I didn't just start bashing Venetian Ice or quartz in general; I was responding to suggestions.

There is a way to respond and that wasn't it. People here are graciously giving of their time to try and help or at least to tell you reality.

Did I do so kindly? No. I'm clearly upset so I'm responding in the fashion of an upset person.

No an upset ADULT does not respond like that. A child does! An adult would realize that while it's not the answer you wanted, people were being honest with you and in the case of offering suggestions for other materials were trying to be helpful.

Further, this is my thread, not a thread written by someone ASKING about Venetian Ice or quartz.

This is a thread on the internet on a site with thousands of people. You're free to accept or not accept others ideas, but to bash other ideas because they don't meet your definition of what you like or don't like, is just RUDE!

So I ask those of you who did that to reconsider your approach to forum interactions.

The only one who needs to reconsider is YOU!

That's not what I asked about, so why you are responding to it is beyond me other than you want to make me angrier. Congratulations--you won on that front. I hope you are happy and that fulfilled some sort of empty hole in your life.

Well then you have real issues if this is what is making you angrier.

And yes, I'd LOVE to talk to the fabricator again. They are not getting back to me. And I've been nothing but sunshine and smiles.

I can see why the stone yard is not returning your emails and phone calls. If you were even 1/4 as rude to them or as nasty as you've been on here, I wouldn't return your call either.

I have nothing nice left to say to any of you.

Well you just proved you're a petulant child just as chocolate bunny suggested.

@helaurin93 thank you for your thoughtful and informative response. And yes, I am absolutely going to be there when they open on Thursday morning.

I had no idea about the charging for linear feet bit. Fortunately for the island I need almost seven feet, so paying for the extra two linear feet--or eight square feet--would not be unreasonable. That's good to know.

As for the options outlined (I love that you properly outlined) I feel my best bet is your option #3, though I am angry enough at this company to walk away and give up. I feel like spending $1700 to have nothing is better than spending $4000 on something I don't want.

Wow.

this is NOT a case of me wanting a thing I cannot afford. This is a case of me PAYING for one thing and being given another.

Actually, you're getting exactly what you paid for - the granite you selected, installed in your kitchen. If neither you nor the salesperson specified the direction of the movement, then that's not one of the things you paid for. Incredibly frustrating, to be sure, but there's no evidence that anyone is trying to cheat you. I know it's hard, but if you can adjust your mindset from the fury of "they're trying to take advantage of me," to the intense frustration of "I can't believe we had this misunderstanding and it's not turning out like I wanted," you'll likely get further with trying to resolve it.

Also, give them time. They emailed you last night; you emailed back today. I know that in our always-on world it's easy to expect an immediate response, especially to an issue that feels pressing to you, but I've learned that a lot of trades people check email about once a day or so, so I have to be prepared for a longer turnaround time than I'm used to getting for other things. And when you think about the fact that their jobs are physically working with materials, not sitting at desks, it makes sense. I also often get farther with a phone call than with email. I'm more an email person, but to get a quick response I often have to adjust.

I've absolutely been where you are, so I really do understand the fury you're feeling, and how hard it is when there's really no one at whom you can direct it. We have a really great builder and are working with really great subs on our new construction, but I've still felt that fury at things not going right many times. I have to take a deep breath, let it go, and focus on solving the problem. My husband and I will also tag team, and occasionally I'll be mad enough that I pass something over to him to deal because I'm too frustrated and upset.

Good luck to you.

Is this anger really about a slab of rock that’s going to sit on top of slabs of wood and get cereal and peanut butter spilled on it? What does this countertop represent to you that makes you so incensed when strangers on the Internet attempt to offer different perspectives and ideas to help you come to terms with an apparently unsolvable problem?

I wish I had a time machine so I could take you back to the original appointment with the granite salespeople and an invisibility cloak so I could be there and hand you a note telling you to ask if they can get it all out of one slab...or maybe I would just nudge your salesperson in the ribs and tell them to look at those measurements and that slab again and spell things out to you. While we were time traveling we’d stop and fix a bunch of mistakes I’ve made over the years that still make me feel shame and frustration when I think about them.

But, not being a time traveler, here’s my advice: Bail out now. Get your money and just stop and plan on hating the damn kitchen for quite some time. Even if the granite place could magic you up the perfect layout now you feel such bitterness about it that it’s going to be ruined anyway. Maybe throw a few hundred at some laminate and paint in some super trendy color scheme you’d never spend real money on, or maybe not. You might hate that kitchen till the day you die, or you might wake up two years from now with a whole new positive vision for it. But NO HOUSE PROJECT is worth the amount of bile and anger this is generating.

Feel free to blast me; I’m like a durable old avocado green Formica countertop...the marks are already there, nothing you can say will hurt me. :-)

Oooh, can we use your time machine and invisibility cloak to whisper advice about dealing with curly hair to my middle school self? I'd really, really like to go back and avoid the impressive frizz that's prominently displayed in years of pictures.

Let's all stop bashing about whether OP has anger management issues or is just very frustrated about the possible loss of money, time, wage loss for an install that's not happening, all while trying to do a renovation, which is often stressful even in the best situations... and clearly, this isn't the best situation.

We don't know the full backstory, and the amounts tied up in the countertop issue is a lot of money for many people. Yes, she's angry and frustrated. Whether it was due to a lack of salesman education, misrepresentation, lack of communication, incomplete customer preparation, or a combination of all of that - it's immaterial at the moment. She needs a path forward, to get through this debacle, and to get unstuck from the ineffectual pissed-as-hell mode she's in.

Bashing someone and comparing them to a "petulant child" rarely is going to get someone who is engulfed in anger to become less angry. Kind of like kicking a man in the groin when he's already down from having been punched there in the first time... it's not going to make the first groin strike hurt any less to get kicked there a second time. She's an adult; in the fullness of time, perhaps she might look back at this whole event, dissect it and decide how things could have been handled differently in case a similar event occurs in the future.

I'm sure many of us have some war stories about life events (including remodels, as well as more serious things) that while we were in the midst of, those events were far from funny... but days, weeks, months or perhaps years later... we could view those events with a somewhat calmer eye with the passage of time.

And of course, there are always some events where the anger never goes away... just simmers to a slow boil. I'm sure most of us have a few of those sitting in our psyches as well... I know I have.

I hope the OP comes back after she visits the stone yard/fabricator on Thursday, and lets us know if there was some mutually satisfactory resolution to this mess. Things like this are how we learn from each other's situations, no matter if there is fault or not.

Loads of people tried to help her onto the "path forward," and even that made her angry. Being angry at a situation and lashing out at those around you is not going to get you any sympathy.

@helaurin93 the comment where she told Cpartist to go to he** has either been deleted or flagged for removal. You may have missed that one. So, yeah, there’s no doubt.

Wow. I think we know why the fabricator is not returning OP's calls. Just Wow.

I was almost wondering if she was a troll. In all my years here I have never seen such a mean hate filled post. Whether she liked the advice or not she could ignore it like most of us do. It is NOT ok to come on a forum and verbally abuse the members so I disagree with you helaurin.

Maybe she needs to go see a counselor to discuss her anger issue. Sure I fully understand she is upset, we all would be. CP dealt with much more in her build and you didn't see her come here and bash those trying to help (and I am sure some gave advice she didnt want nor took). People here have tried to help her. She returned with nasty mean remarks.

She barely gave the fabricator time to respond. Maybe he will call her back today and all will end well.

I am doing a build. I have had disappointments and upsets but I do not feel the need to come on here and lose my sh** on people. I have zero sympathy when she treats others so terrible. NO EXCUSE. She owes the people on this thread an apology.

Not sure if you noticed, but I did not say "it's okay to verbally abuse members". What I did say is let's not perpetuate it or aggravate her by dumping on her even more. She's angry and frustrated, because things are going as expected. Got it. Calling her out on her emotions isn't going to help resolve the situation in the state she clearly was in. I validated her emotions, (but not some of the responses that were going on) and gave a logical framework to move forward.

If you go through the comments - at various times the OP recognized her anger herself:

" I'm sorry. I'm just so angry. I feel like this is information the sales person could have shared with me--like hey, you know, this may need to be cut this way. But then she would not have made the sale. That seems like VERY questionable practices to me. "

" First--thanks for your kind response even though I am being angry and irrational. Seriously. You didn't need to be nice and you were. Thank you. "

And she's clearly struggling with the renovation budget of her dad's house. And the very fact that she's renovating her dad's house, well, I'm considering the possibility that her dad is in very poor health or has passed on, and grief either way can be tough.

" Honestly, this house is more than we can afford to fix up. My dad built it in 1995. "

What I also saw were comments from people who said that her choice doesn't work:

" Because the granite doesn’t go with those cabinets. It’s too cold and gray. Pick something else and be happy you didn’t get that stone. "

" that cool gray counter doesn't work with the warm tones of your cabinets. "

And I suspect that comments regarding her chosen color combinations probably weren't helpful in the emotional state she is/was in. Rather than getting a path forward, she probably felt like she was being criticized for selecting a stone color that wouldn't work and having to defend her choice. And I can sympathize on that feeling... when I adopted a dog from a shelter, my best friend informed me that she was NEVER going to come to my house again because of the dog, whom she'd never even met. Suddenly, I was having to defend saving a dog that was scheduled for euthanasia in a high-kill shelter (at that time, they were euthanizing about 80% of all dogs). And I didn't feel very good about having to defend that decision - the dog was staying, period. My best friend eventually did come over again.... it just took months for her to realize that my dog was not a "shark on land with four legs and a huge mouth". But I digress... the point is, I suspect that adding a need to defend one's choice when they are already angry and frustrated isn't helpful to the situation. People who feel like they need to defend, often feel cornered - and cornered people often will attack as a response. Is it the best or most appropriate way to handle things? Yeah, no, probably not. But I think we are all human, and chances are that all of us have experienced at least one (or more) moments in our lives that we can look back and say "I could have handled that better". I know I have lots of those moments myself.

If she'd come on asking "Hey guys, I'm thinking of pairing this stone with these cabinets, what do you think?" - that's different than "Hey guys, I already paid a 50% deposit for this stone and if I were to choose a different stone I'll lose a hefty part of that deposit, and the way the yard wants to template it doesn't meet my expectations, what are my options" - that's really what she's asking.

I can't speak for the OP, but I know for myself, when I hit that point of overwhelming emotional angst/anger/frustration/helplessness..... telling me to "just calm down" isn't going to help, because until the logical part of my brain recognizes a way to make a situational change (or at least a possibility of such a change) .. my emotional side isn't going to "calm down". Insulting my choices isn't going to help either.

Hopefully, the OP will get a decent resolution to the problem, and then be able to come back and update with a clearer head from a less frustrated position.

Oh give me a break helaurin. Tracy may have been "thankful" but that is still absolutely NO excuse for treating forum members the way she has, especially telling CP, a long time contributor, to go to h E double hockey sticks. I usually stay out of the heated threads where the OP is being unreasonable, but I felt compelled to say she was acting as a petulant child because sometimes we need to be blunt. In a world where everyone is so freaking sensitive and everyone gets the participation trophy, I will call people out that are being rude. Frustration when dealing with remodeling is part of the deal; most of us have been there. But the amount of anger the OP has shown, over a piece of stone is concerning. So no apologies from me. Sometimes we cannot see the forest for the trees, or see how we are actually coming across. I'd be embarrassed if I posted like she did.

I'm sure many of us have some war stories about life events (including remodels, as well as more serious things) that while we were in the midst of, those events were far from funny... but days, weeks, months or perhaps years later... we could view those events with a somewhat calmer eye with the passage of time.

Of course we have all had things happen that got us angry. Heck go read my saga thread and you'll find I'm still having issues with my builder that making me a raging madwoman.

However I didn't come onto this forum, asking for help and when I didn't get an answer I wanted start bashing others or calling their choices awful like the OP did.

When I was designing my house, I'd ask a question and trust me, I privately thought that some of the answers were wack-a-doodle but I know I thanked every single person and never told them that I hated their choices or ideas. I actually took the time to try and understand why each person was making their suggestion to make my house better! And it even turned out that some of the ideas where my first thought was, "wow, this is wack-a-doodle" later turned out to have merit.

What's the old saying about honey?

@helaurin93 the comment where she told Cpartist to go to he** has either been deleted or flagged for removal. You may have missed that one. So, yeah, there’s no doubt.

Yes under her last comment last night, she made another post that absolutely did tell me to go to h*!!. I chose to ignore it then as I was tired and didn't want to post something that I would regret in the morning. :)

Helaurin, what you said is exactly why I phrased my post the way I did. I don’t think this is about the granite because I want to believe the OP is not that petty. I wanted her to think about what the granite symbolizes and why she’s projecting that frustration and anger to the point of being quite rude to people who are trying to help. None of us (not even you with your neatly outlined options...and I DO love outlines and bullet points) can make this granite problem work out perfectly.

What we can do is help the OP get out of her head a bit and reframe the options. Maybe granite running the “wrong” direction is a whole lot better than quartz or Corian? Maybe that contrast between cold and warm is something to think more about. She doesn’t have to agree that any of those options work for her, but she needs to pull up her big girl knickers and accept that they come from a place of good intent.

Right at this moment there are guys all over my front yard laying blocks and building forms to be the base of my new driveway and brick-edged ramp to my newly raised porch. I GET how the OP might feel because I have been all over the emotional map about this project. It’s not just some work that needs to be done to keep our property nicely maintained, it’s a very real admission on my part that my illness and disability are not going away and at age 56 I need a ramp to access my front door. I really, really hope if this starts getting to me to where I rant rudely at posters on Houzz that y’all will give me a gentle slap upside the head like the OP has received.

I also want to note that it appears the OP edited out a lot of her early angrier comments in her posts.

I'm hoping to not be in the same position some day in the future. I'm 57, woke up one day completely unable to get out of bed without help, and once standing up - found my left leg wouldn't take any weight. I needed a cane to hobble around on. Turns out that I have psoriatic arthritis - not super-evident on my skin, but definitely there in my joints and ligaments. Most days I have some pain, some days are pretty good, some days, not so much. And there are steps to get into my house, and then since it's a "bi-level" (some call it a raised ranch" as soon as you get in there's a half-flight of steps going up, and a half-flight of steps going down. I'm not excusing rudeness, but I do think some of the posts added fuel to the fire.

@cpartist definitely didn't see that comment. And maybe, instead of deleting it, if she realized she was in the wrong to put that there - she might ought to have left it and followed it up with an apology.

Again - I am not trying to excuse rudeness. I am saying the OP was clearly already angry and frustrated; and some of the comments probably added fuel to the fire.

She also changed her user name, which used to be her first and last name. She knows she went off the rails.

She gave them a dimensioned drawing & I believe the vendor is a one stop shop, so this would be a shop/seller error.

I work with multiple show rooms and none would dare to take cash from one of my clients without asking. Most will hold materials for 2 weeks on request without a deposit.

There are however many retail establishments that will take money if they can get it. Some have falsely told clients they know me, etc.

be careful out there.

I am an fabricator. This shop did the right thing. most of the time, natural stone have cracks and chips on the edges. We need to cut away some part of all 4 edges. the slab will have waste. he see this problem before he cut the slab and let u know. i am sure he will give u back all u money, if u want to cancel the order. if they have an second slab for same lot, u should able to work out a deal to use part of the second slab. But u can not ask them to use two slabs and charge u the price for only one.

I don’t give SF price for years. quote only slabs cost plus labor. We only able get full slabs from wholesale. customer must pay for the cost of slabs. unless they could use our remnant. most of the leftover will going to the dumpster. Some customer will take the leftover.

Threads like this make really appreciate the person who posted a picture of her cute puppy and asked for name suggestions under Design Dilemmas. Go them.

Jeffrey, do you think it was a shop error, or a miscommunication? Neither the shop nor the OP thought to mention the direction of the pattern on the island or perimeter. As a consumer, I would want the pattern to run lengthwise, but I should clearly communicate that. If I didn't, yes I'd be disappointed but I'd blame myself as well as the shop. I'd also take the dimensions of the stone and lay out on graph paper where I think the pieces would go, and I'd probably see fairly quickly that my expectations couldn't be met with one slab.

The OP has said that she wishes she had communicated that to the fabricator, but insists on saying that their proposed layout is wrong. While everyone agrees it's not what she wants, not everyone sees the shop's proposed layout as being wrong.

And to accuse us all of responding as we did to "fulfill some sort of empty hole in your life" is just over the top.

Bringing this back on topic... IF you were my client and therefore invested in my advice, here is what I would tell you. Consider this a blessing in disguise. New countertops on your existing cabinets will only emphasize that they are out of date and that your island is out of proportion. You will not get the return on the investment you are hoping for. In fact, I believe you will be even more dissatisfied with the kitchen after you install these countertops. It is not money well spent. Take your time and live in the house for a while. Do some research about the costs of a kitchen remodel and then save over time until you can more thoughtfully transform your space, both in style and function. They did not cut the stone so I think they should give you your deposit back, given the confusion over your layout expectations (for which you are both at fault).

You're not my client so you can choose to ignore this advice if you want, but trust me when I say it is well intended and comes from years of experience working with people in similar situations.

Again - I am not trying to excuse rudeness. I am saying the OP was clearly already angry and frustrated; and some of the comments probably added fuel to the fire.

You did not see the actual threads. She cleaned them all up and eliminated the really offensive ones. All the threads she left are ones she edited. What she said to many of the members who tried to help was absolutely abhorrent!

And the comments didn't start AFTER LWO suggested that a warmer granite would work better. There are whole posts from her that are missing where she made nasty comments BEFORE he, Marie, myself and others suggested she might want to reconsider her granite choice. In fact each and every time people suggested that the stone yard did nothing wrong, she made a nasty comment.

She came here asking for help supposedly. What she wanted was for us to all agree that the stone yard was wrong and she was right and that she should go in there with guns blazing. When we didn't, she got even angrier and turned her anger on all of us in the thread.

I certainly would never have posted what I did to her one comment she left (and she left it because I had copy/pasted it into my comments) and I believe no one else would have if she hadn't been so angry and childish. There was a very good reason that you didn't see why Chocolate Bunny made her comment.

And I don't ever recall in all my years here on GW, anyone telling another poster to go to h*!! I think that comment speaks volumes about the poster.

@Chicagoans Its the professionals responsibility.when presented a plan and material.

if not, what is their next undisclosed surprise?

zero trust.

I am not going into the hate here. I used to work in a stone slab wholesaler and I believe that you should talk to your fabricator about a trade. Look through their remnants and see if they have a lighter coordinating stone that I would use, along with the first template, on the island and then the fabricator could keep the piece of stone from the template that was to be used on the island. This scenario should hurt less for both parties, because IMO both parties erred in this deal but the SELLER is obligated to make sure that the layman buyer understands what is entailed in the job...the number of seams, edges, and movement direction. Customers should not be expected to understand a complicated process such as fabrication.

I must be dumber than a sack of stone chips, but I still can't figure out what is 'incorrect' about the two layouts at the beginning of this whole thing.

I must be dumber than a sack of stone chips, but I still can't figure out what is 'incorrect' about the two layouts at the beginning of this whole thing.

You are not dumber than a sack of stone chips! Trust me my better half would never know either.

The stone is directional. In the first rendering the perimeter stone has the lines going horizontal and the island going vertically so they're not "matching".

In the second rendition, all the stone is going vertically and it appears the OP wanted all the stone going horizontally.

@Jeffrey R. Grenz, General Contractor I don't think there were any undisclosed surprises. In fact, I think the "surprises" were fully disclosed with the presentation of two layouts before anything was fabricated. The main parameter given by the OP was that she wanted all the tops cut from one slab and they showed her two ways to accommodate it. I think the fabricator will be at fault if they do not refund the full deposit, especially given that they are both the fabricator and the supplier. But otherwise, I do not see that the fabricator/supplier is in the wrong for not understanding that the direction of the vein was more important than using just one slab. Had they brought it up to her at the time of the transaction, I wonder what she would have done. Whatever it is, she should do that now.

weedmeister...
Stone is priced based on the rarity and movement on or of a stone. The pattern is what makes the stone unique and beautiful, having the pattern run horizontally is the goal...imagine wanting vertical stripes on curtains and having them custom made only to pick them up and they look like prison clothes. The counter is the most expensive piece because it is larger. A trade is her best option and the fabricator should do what needs to be done to satisfy her. Go back and look at the pattern more closely and you will see what is wrong.

Tracy A.
DON'T BUY ANOTHER SLAB. The fabricator will be keeping the remnants from your job. He (and all the other Pros) wants to make money and selling you another stone means that they can cut all the stone horizontally, and keeping the leftovers that they will put on someone's small kitchen or in their bathroom and will sell it twice. I worked in the field and know these types of people. It's about the money.

Greysister, I'm pretty sure that if you took dimensional cutouts of Tracy's counters and overlaid them on a dimensional drawing of her slab, there isn't a configuration that gives Tracy what she wants. This isn't about the fabricator trying to cheap out on her.

My take on this is a version of the trope "cheap, fast, and good--pick two." In this case, it's cheap (one slab), stone character (movement), and layout. My impression from the info provided is that Tracy discussed wanting to use one slab and wanting a slab with movement, but did not discuss layout with the fabricator--at least until receiving the proposed layouts. The fabricator developed the best layouts they could subject to the constraints that were discussed--one slab, and a stone with movement.

Following the "pick any two" principle, Tracy has these options:

1. Buy a second slab. I know she can't afford that now, but she could delay the project until she could save the additional cost
2. Choose a different granite. A granite without movement would make the question of directionality moot, and give more flexibility in layout.
3. Go with one of the fabricators suggested layout.

Tracy's mistake was thinking it was obvious (or that there was only one right way) how the movement of the stone falls on the various sections of counter. The fabricator's mistake was not to discuss the restrictions on layout that naturally follow with this stone (or any stone with movement) when cutting everything from one slab.

I am not understanding what OP wants to happen in terms of expectations. Remodeling is frustrating but there seems to be no damage done since the stone wasn't cut and therefore the issue isn't whether OP is going to be forced to accept the stone.

It's obvious the stoneyard/installer should refund the deposit and I am assuming will be happy to do so.

It seems to be a perfect example of mutual misunderstanding resulting in no contract formation - the classic case regarding the mistake in which ship named Peerless would be used to ship the cargo. Since there was no meeting of the minds, there was no contract :-). It's certainly fun when something that I learned in the first weeks of law school still has relevance in the modern world - I am waiting for a post on caveat emptor and medieval sexual enhancements :-).

Ruffles vs Wichelhaus

A good example that illustrates what is a mistake in contract law is the case of Ruffles vs. Wichelhaus. There was a contract to ship merchandise on a vessel named Peerless. However, the parties involved had a different understanding of each other. Each party was referring to a different vessel, and therefore, they did not agree when to ship the merchandise. In this case, both parties thought they were in consent until they realized were both misguided about each other’s different meaning. As such, an agreement was not formed since there was no mutual assent between the parties involved in the formation stage of the agreement. Like a unilateral mistake, the best practice to avoid a mutual mistake is to consult an experienced attorney to determine whether a defence of mutual mistake is a viable option for you.