12x12 Deck construction tips, concrete blocks on packed soil? 12x6?
Comments (9)
PROGN Builders L.L.C
4 years agoRelated Discussions
Building a Pea Gravel Patio
Comments (40)I don't know how big your yard is, but I would start small, with the gravel, meaning, just big enough for the seating at first--the point being, you can always expand, but you will never remove the gravel once you've got it in (I'm making assumptions about what you will or won't do in the future based on human nature, the nature of gravel removal, and your post!). Also, will be an issue for the next (owner?)--if you will be responsible for future sale of the property, then that is one reason to avoid some forms of home improvement that may be seen as drawbacks. If you are the least bit inclined to "gardening" and to enjoy a bit of greenery, you might be able to plan and install some pockets of groundcover for the same price as covering everything with gravel--it is possible to build up soil areas without a lot of digging and leveling, particularly for planting one of the tough groundcovers (not for growing tea roses right away!). There would be some upkeep to establish the plantings but again, you could start small-- an area 3x3 or 4x4. You might approach your yard by mapping out quadrants or areas and tackle one or 2 , but leave the rest bare until you phase in the whole plan. The return would be that you would not be trying to establish a lawn from scratch under poor conditions but you would have some green space. You haven't said whether you have any trees in your yard or overhanging your yard--leaves, cones, acorns, maple seeds-- but that is an issue for pea gravel--you don't want a lot of gravel if there is going to be a lot of organic debris falling on it, requiring constant raking and upkeep....See Morebarn floor: dirt, clay, concrete
Comments (35)Ok; back in February I mentioned rebuilding/replacing the floor in the old barn. There has been a delay in posting but the finishing touches on the floor/drainage were put in last week. As usual, first there was the plan, then there were the assumptions and then there is what actually happened. Got the old floor dug out early spring and installed 1 run of drain tile with sock. Drain tile set about 18" sloping to 10" deep under stall side of barn and run to daylight. After digging out the old manure and leveling the floor, we installed 8-12" of #10 crushed limestone over the native clay. This resulted in the interior floor about 8" higher than the surrounding. The new floor is completely level compared to the existing (sloped) exterior grade. Last week we finished installing the exterior drain tile with sock; due to drainage/slope the tile is only about 6-8" below finished grade but since the problem has always been surface water not underground I am as yet unconcerned. One exterior run of tile is tied in with the interior run and they continue to daylight; the back side has its own run. Both exterior runs have stub-ups for gutter tie ins but since we left the top gravel (#57 blue stone - 3/4 - 1-1/2")exposed I may not install the gutters. If so, I will cap the openings with Fernco's. Water dripping off the roof hits the gravel, enters the drain tile and runs out away from the barn to the existing drainage swale. Have not had much rain yet but seems to work well with what we got last weekend. The new floor has been blocked off and stock limited to first 20'; the crushed limestone is easy to maintain and there does not seem to be any difficulty with odor or manure drainage/removal. Next stop - replacing/reinstalling wood ends, sliding doors and damaged siding ... and new lightning protection for all of the structures....See MoreRaised Veggie Bed
Comments (22)I am definately not planting until next spring, which is why I am getting started now, so that I am ready. My plan so far goes a little something like this: I am thinking of building a landscape timber border, to provide boundries, neatness, and most of all, a foundation to install fencing. I mainly have problems with rabbits, but also have some chipmunks, and the occasional ground squirrel, but they are rare. I usually trap the chipmunks and relocate them to the woods a couple miles away, because the tunnel in the yard too much. Anyways, I plan to set the landscape timbers a bit below grade, and go two layers. From there I will anchor posts for chicken fencing, which will remain permanent. I'll make removable fence panels for access. Once the border is finished, I'll kill the lawn by solarizing it with clear construction plastic. I plan to build a compost bin of some sort, so I will have a batch of compost ready to work in come spring time. I'm also considering mixing in a bit of partially decomposed pine bark fines, to drop the pH a bit. I'm going to buy a bow rake too, for obvious reasons, and one of those tine tillers that you push in and twist, so I can bust up the top and work in my compost. I am pretty siked to get this garden ready for next year, because I'm sick of screwing with containers. Thanks for the tips so far, and please feel free to add any more stuff to my plan, or point out anything that is not necessary if there is a better idea. Joe...See Moreblueberries and rasberries in tiny yard??
Comments (57)Ben - Thanks for reporting back. It's always nice to see how projects have worked out! Your beds look great and the plants in them happy. A few suggestions: Put in edging between your grass and beds because if you don't, the grass will move into the wonderful soil in the beds you have created, and it's difficult to get out once established. You can cut a v shaped ditch that you renew once or twice a year; or get the heaviest duty black commercial edging and sink it to the rim so the grass hides it; or if you can find Trex type of stuff cut thin for edging. I've read that steel edging isn't kid friendly, and rocks won't do a good job of keeping the grass out. You might also want to make your beds about a foot wider to give your blueberries enough room to grow and a place to move your strawberries to when the blueberries start to shade them. (As it is you may have to prune the back side of the blueberries when they get larger to keep them from rubbing the fence.) Widening your beds needn't require the same difficulty in digging if you follow Diggingthedirt's suggestion: "You can start layering organic material in a swath - this is called the lasagne method and it works really well in areas where digging is difficult. You can search on garden web for more info about this system - just about everyone loves it and writes about their methods. The thick mulch of "stuff" - fresh (free) manure, used coffee grounds, newspapers, grass clippings, dry leaves, etc, will slowly break down, enriching the soil around your rocks and encouraging earthworms to loosen the soil for you. If you start creating this now, by next spring you'll have wonderful soil that will be much easier to dig." You can do this right over your grass if the bottom layer is a bunch of layers of newspaper or unwaxed corrugated cardboard. I'll add to the votes to swap out the pine tree for something that doesn't get so large so fast. Probably the most common mistake people make in planting is putting in plants without sufficient thought to how large the plant will ultimately be and then having to deal with the problems created further down the road. I figure you've got perhaps 10 years before it gets to the point that it's going to need a professional to get it out unless you have experience felling trees with a chain saw in tight quarters. I live in an area where white pine is native, and we have lots in our woods, and in the woods or as shade trees in our pasture I love them. At our previous house we had them near the house. They dropped pitch on the cars or whatever else was nearby, and dropped large branches when we had wet snow or heavy wind along with rain. In wet soils with heavy snow or rain and wind, the entire tree sometimes tips over, damaging whatever is in their path. When it's a 70 or 80 foot tree, that can be quite a bit of damage! It doesn't need to be removed this year or even next, but the longer you leave it, the more accustomed you will get to its screening affect, and the more you will miss it when you have to remove and replace it. (And realisically, it isn't a question of whether you will need to remove it, just a question of when and how expensive it will be; pruning the west side won't solve your problem.) Some research here on the conifers forum or the trees forum or at the American Conifer Society's website may give you some ideas more realisically sized for your site. Are you looking for year-round screening or just during warm weather? That will help determine whether you get a deciduous or evergreen replacement. You may be able to plant a replacement now several feet away, and not remove the white pine for a couple of years to let the replacement gain some size. Good luck and congratulations on a great start to your gardening. (Warning - it can be addictive!)...See MoreM J
4 years agolast modified: 4 years agoResummarizing here because it wont let me edit my main thread, with photos.. plywood is often used for observatory builds because its a smoother surface to seal off, i assumed it was ok..
Summarizing again:
I've tried using some online deck building tools to generate the materials needed for what should really be a simple build for this, but i'm getting weird results and had some questions. I thought home depot had an online one, but only found an offline tool, lowes online did work, but in both cases they generated ridiculous materials lists and prices close to $10k.
I know that a build like this should only cost $300 to $400. (with everything i have below and $69 to ship, its around $480 as of now, so higher than planned)
On top of the deck will be the nexdome with 2 bay (astronomy plastic dome weighs around 300lbs i think).
The first issue is the soil/ground. I have to make things level, so that i dont need extra height on a concrete pier, to keep the whole structure say 12" off the ground and not need a railing.
Here is a shot of my ground so far, i wasnt sure if i should just get a bobcat and push it forward till level, or if tossing the extra dirt that is "high" on the upper part, to the lower part would suffice or cause a settling issue later?
Either way, once down to level, i figure ill either just leave it as just dirt under, or put down plastic to block weeds and cover with a thin layer of gravel.Back to the deck build itself:
12x6 vs 12x8:
I've seen many do the 12x6 route, but I wasnt sure, so for now i have it figured as roughly 12-13 12x8s?
I have two 4x4x8's figured, but i'm thinking there will be at least 6 posts, with the deck surface at least 12" off ground, may need a few more to go into cement block
Onto the blocks (going with blocks instead of posts in the ground, so when we move, we can just take the whole thing and go, or disassemble):
I think these are the right concrete deck blocks? But now that i'm thinking about these, it looks like they are really meant to go under the 12x6 going longwise? So perhaps for the posts that will be 12-14" tall, i need something else here? (I figured 6-9 of these max)
One of the online builder tools generated the list using these wood to wood triple zinc framing angles, again i'm not sure these are needed?I know i need joist hangers, unsure on the quantity, but these 2"x2x18 gauge triple zinc face mount joist hangers
**the part on these i'm unsure on, is since this is low to the ground, how ill go about attaching these,since the floor needs in place, so i guess i need to tilt the whole structure to do this
Many regular decking forums dont suggest using plywood for the floor, but i've seen many nexdome floors done with it, i was assuming it was this plywood:
Severe Weather 3/4 inch common square southern yellow pine sheathing 4x8's $39?
I was estimating i need 3 of these.
Then I was figuring using all deck screws and not nails (in case i need to remove them), or maybe nails (which type?) for the hangers. These #8 2" ceramic I thought were the right ones? (or maybe 2.5")
Here is the view of the joists as generated by the home depot offline tool, generally i was figuring a joist every 16, not sure about the extra ones near the pier location:
Another question is on the underside, in the one online generator it shows these things that i'm not sure on, ie: the posts have those brackets and there are i think the right angle brackets:
The other part i think i'm missing here are "toggle?" bolts that go into the posts? With nuts on the other side of some size?
Any thoughts on all this so far, is this a pretty accurate list of things to do this simple deck?- PRO
GN Builders L.L.C
4 years agolast modified: 4 years ago M J
4 years ago
seabornman
4 years agoI don't know if you're still wanting advice, but here's my take. Joist hangers are a pain to install and expensive in the right finish. Those special blocks are expensive. The simplest and cheapest deck to build is a cantilever deck like the attached photo. You don't need the double 2x beams like in the photo. The simplest way is to buy 2 4x4s 12 ft. long. Those replace the 2xs shown. Shim them up with solid concrete block pavers, the cheap ones at HD. Try not to put blocks on soil you've moved (more chance of settling). Place those block supports at 4 ft. on center along the 4x4s. Level it all up. You can shim with scraps of treated 2xs or 1xs. Then screw attach the joists to the 4x4's and the perpendicular rim board to the joists. No hangers. I found that 2x6 was the cheapest deck board. You may be able to go 2 ft. on center with your joists. I built the same deck with the 4x4 base for a temporary stage for a wedding. 8 musicians and their equipment all night. Solid as a rock.
seabornman
4 years ago- PRO
GN Builders L.L.C
4 years ago M J
4 years agolast modified: 4 years ago
millworkman