Germain:

When you're in the cabinet business, you need repeatability. Repeatability breeds familiarity and familiarity lowers risk and raises profits. Any new thing that your shop hasn't done takes much more time and time is money and risk. Hence your shop's reluctance to deviate.

I really don't like the idea of having one shop build the cabinets, another drill for hinges, and maybe someone else installing. That's a little too much room for finger pointing when things go south.

Oops sorry I should clarify, these are for interior doors! Not cabinets!

The first floor doors are 2’8” by 8’ tall, second floor 2’8” by 7” tall, and basement doors 2’8” by 6’8” tall...

1 3/4” thick slab.

Thanks!

My guess is that you need find a commercial door installer.

I need my metal door frames welded to the wall frames. Commercial. Didn't bat an eye.

You are paying these guys to learn in the field, possibly ruin door or 2 if they don't have the jigs, etc. They are pricing accordingly.

Assuming hidden SOSS hinges are similar to Tectus: Given how adjustable Tectus hinges are (I have them for all my doors and hung them myself) I don’t understand why this would be more expensive to install than a regular hinge (which isn’t adjustable so if it’s slightly off, you’d have a much bigger problem). Making a deeper mortise isn’t difficult.

About the cost delta: Your calculation is relevant and attractive to the shop but as you can’t perform installing hinges yourself it’s rather meaningless to you.

It’s like Joseph said, extra $ for something different. Also, the market for extraordinary items for custom homes is often following an extreme supply/demand scenario. Supply = Minimal (you have difficulties finding a shop that does what you want), Demand = “I REALLY want hidden hinges”. So might as well try to get max coin from you.

No the SOSS, at least from what I read, is NOT 3D adjustable. Hence priced at half of the Sugatsune and about a quarter of the Tectus.

I’m willing to pay a reasonable upgrade charge for sure (or maybe a little premium) but at the same time not about to let anyone price gouge me (three times of what the “true” cost delta is).

Yes, your cost "delta" may be using the wrong baseline. I would expect, unless otherwise specified, a hinge costing about $10 …. per pair. The SOSS looks to be closer to $44 each, plus tax plus a few extras would give you about a $40-45 "delta" per hinge, at $120-180 per door for just materials, and the shop has to stop everything to do your special run, stop it again for anything missed, etc.

Now I wonder how much time to "3 way adjust" each of 4 hinges per door when I don't normally have to adjust any. I wonder the cost of labor to remove and replace each door for paint, flooring, etc. vs a door with pins.

Most builders try to accommodate clients wishes made after the home as been started to an agreed to set of specifications, but ultimately the builder committed to the original spec as they were confident their skills met that project.

I am starting another "modern" shortly, with a few more layers of detail beyond one I just completed. Our interior door selection cost may be increasing about $800 per door with the detail around the door adding another $250 per opening. Client gets to make that decision x 22 doors... the home isn't huge. You get the picture.

Many builders doing highly detailed projects use a "cost plus" model, while others used a "fixed". The latter involves change orders with a cost guarantee, the former you learn the real cost after the work is done, and its often surprising.

Thanks for the response Jeff. My assumptions weren’t totally off base, I used ~$8 per generic jamb as the baseline and $40 for the SOSS.

I also doubled the labor PER hinge to cut the deep mortises...... at most $4k so I really struggle to see how they got to $10k unless it’s one of those (we REALLY don’t want to take on something we’re not familiar with so let’s put a really high price).

Any non standard item you're inserting into a mfg process will have impact. They may not see it again this year. Maybe a few new tools/bits, stopping and resetting the fabrication and assembly line for this, restarting for any adds (always).

Many shops would just say "no" or "I can't" as you are certainly weeding out the common skills, tools and capabilities.

The more I think about these the more labor I see by several trades, installers, painters, etc.

This is similar to how government specified products or projects get expensive... they up specify, often at the suggestion of a manufacturer or special interest, until competition falls away and bids get expensive. Happens all the time in the defense industry, school & public housing, all govt construction.

Millworkman! Yes! I would certainly appreciate that very much. After reading through all the comments here, maybe my GC wasn’t that far off given the “non mass market” nature of these hinges. At this point it’s not even only about the cost now I’m also concerned about quality and precision... just like I wouldn’t want my brain operated on by a family doctor, I don’t want these concealed hinges done by inexperienced carpenters....

Will check in here every now and then to hopefully get a recommendation from you... I’m located in northern NJ, so any millwork in / around d NJ/NYC would work...

Thanks!

Hi, Germain,

Just wondering, if you are under contract with a general contractor, why you are doing all the legwork to investigate the cost and feasibility of the proposed change? Will your GC even entertain any other option than working with REEB?

Charles... yeah I know. What he tells me is that he’s not making money on my job and is basically not willing to do more leg work to help me find the perfect solution.

Hi @MillWorkman and all:

Now REEB is saying they CAN do it, but they are insisting that instead of the solid core Primed Hardboard I would have to switch to MDF for the SOSS hinges to work.

Honestly stumped because from what I read, MDF doens't take to screws well and is also heavier.

Does this make sense to anyone??

Thanks...

MDF will take screws better than the hardboard for certain in my opinion. As well as the fact that the hinge routing will be better in MDF especially since you are basically cutting out a box on the door rail.

Germain, I'm interested in how this progresses. Twenty days later and my client sent me a photo of an interior door with concealed hinges, set flush with the drywall, something that takes a unique jamb & drywall finish. Found the setup, its very high end, Italian.

Their baseline numbers are more than double what I can do a solid core, flush door, kerfed, exposed hinge.

Appears these finishes are getting exposure in new modern homes, with suppliers in NY, SF & Miami.

Concealed hinges – and concealed door frames / jambs in general – are difficult to pull off when all of the door components are not engineered and manufactured to work together. The 3-way adjustable hinges from TECTUS, Anselmi, or others are critical if you want to get consistent gaps on both sides of the door as well as be able to adjust the door plane with the finished wall. Here's an installation of a 9-ft tall Dorsis Fortius door system in a passive house in Boulder, Colorado:

The trick to getting this look is to have a rigid frame that you attach into your rough opening and then you bring the drywall to the door frame/jamb.