Need help with Oil based primer?!
D.J. Doss
5 years ago
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Is primer necessary over oil-based paint when repainting?
Comments (16)I'm glad to know you guys don't like deglossers over sanding. I'm a professional decorative painter and always choose hand sanding on furniture pieces but have been tempted a few times to try a deglosser. I also agree that sanding and thoroughly cleaning trim in preparation is not a fun job, lol. A few years back I had a client who had a paint crew come on and put latex over oil painted trim...absolute disaster....ended in a lawsuit. I have pretty good luck with sanding and a bonding primer like 123 or C2... But a recently repainted a cabinet that had been done in oil and I did have some adhesion issues....I remember wishing I had just repainted the darn thing in oil. I believe one of the companies makes a non smelly oil based primer now, but I tried one and didn't care for the way it laid out...brush strokes. 123 levels out nicely, which is why I use that a lot. I would think using an oil based primer would be another way to eliminate sanding, though. Many of the oil primers say they can be topcoated with latex. Which always seems odd to me too! Maybe because they dry to a flatter sheen, gives the latex something to grip. I agree that the easiest thing is to thoroughly clean and repaint with oil like Ben Moore satin impervo, but aside for the yellowing factor, the op was considering a zero voc paint so oil is not gonna give you that....and the whole hassle of cleanup, of course. Oh, and when you see a primer that says it requires no sanding- ignore that. If you want to ENSURE latex sticks over oil, sand, and clean well. I was lazy painting over my own oil trim with 123 primer, and where I sanded it stuck well, and where I omitted the sanding, it didn't....See MoreTrouble with oil base primer
Comments (7)When I did my FPE sample boards, I just used two coats of C2's SAP (Sandable Acrylic Primer-Latex) a couple hours apart, and let them sit 'till the next day. These sanded-off nice. (You can use Zinsser's 123 primer as well.) You CAN do 2 or 3 coats of primer to give yourself SOME grain-filling function and sanding-cushion. I then did two coats of FPE's ECO-series (Latex) White....WOW! Bottom-line...you can thin primer. Cans often state "No thinning" 'cuz sometimes people use the wrong stuff, or way too much, etc. * A very good "relaxer" for Oil primers is XIM's X-tender for Oil paints & primers. There's a version for Latex paints/primers too. * You won't need it with FPE stuff though! * Most SW stores have some XIM stuff. I've got it @ the ACE where I work, but ACE itself doesn't carry it. We've got to order lots of stuff directly from vendors. Faron...See MorePratt & Lambert paints and primers? And: oil-based enamel paints
Comments (15)wryorwhite -- Don't be scared by all this talk of yellowing. It's exaggerated. Bear in mind that oil-based paint was essentially all that was used in American homes through the 1980s -- so unless you're a teenager, you were around when any house you'd walk into (including the one in which you grew up) had its walls painted with oil-based paint. Trust yourself and your own experience...do you ever remember walking into a house and thinking to yourself "My, these walls are awfully yellowed!"? I sure don't. When's the last time you've heard someone say "Oh, look at those walls! They've gone from looking like snow to looking like Big Bird! This is certainly oil-based paint!"? Never. Yes, oil-based paint yellows very slighly with time. So do all oil-based products, including the clear polyurethane with which wood floors are most often finished. This "yellowing" effect is minimal, and it's not something that jumps out at you or is offensive or anything like that. You have to actively look for it, and the only people who do that are (a) homosexuals, and (b) people who work in the marketing departments of latex-based paint companies. The drawbacks of latex-based paint have largely been resolved in the past few years. The latex-based paints of 2008 are a far cry from the ones of 20 years ago. This is especially true with the high-quality brands like Pratt & Lambert. Modern high-end latex pains bond to drywall well, hold up to moisture and cleaning well, etc. However - latex-based paints aren't as good as oil-based paints when it comes to moisture and dirt resistance, standing up to scrubbing, and bonding to wood. They never can be, because oil (unlike latex) naturally resists water, and naturally soaks into wood (rather than just sitting on top like a skin). Think of what happens when you mix oil and water -- they don't mix; instead, they just separate and keep apart. So moisture and dirt don't bond to the oil-based paint, so it's very easy to clean without damage. In addition, oil-based paint soaks into wood -- unlike latex-based paint, which forms into a skin that you can peel off. This is one of the big drawbacks of using latex paint on high-traffic wood items (like kitchen cabinets). My house has latex-based paint on the walls and ceilings, and oil-based paint on all the wood trim (including the doors and windows and cabinets) -- this is a time-tested and popular arrangement, and it has held up very well for me and my neighbors. Speaking of polyurethane -- there are two types, oil-based and water-based (latex-based) - same as paint. ALL of the manufacturers -- Minwax, Cabot, etc. -- recommend strongly in favor of using the oil-based polyurethane on floors. It's tougher, it holds up better to traffic and moisture, and this "yellowing" effect that the self-proclaimed experts yammer on about are so minimal as to be non-existent. The same is true with the oil-based vs. water-based (latex-based) paints. Again, trust yourself and your own experiences -- how many times have you walked into a home and thought to yourself that the painted walls and ceilings, or the wood floors, were yellowed?...See MoreSuggestions For Oil Based Primer
Comments (8)Thanks, Faron. I truly appreciate all your help. I called around and found a local store that will order it for me. I should have done that before, thanks for the kick in the pants. I am usually pretty good about things like this, but I guess I got set on finding it in stock and plum forgot to just order it. If you don't mind, I have two more questions. 1) I am going to use either Benjamin Moore Waterborne Ceiling Paint Ultra Flat Finish #508 or Benjamin Moore Muresco #258. Do you recommend I prime with the Odorless before I paint the ceiling too? The ceiling is popcorn finish. 2) Do you mean I should sand each coat of Primer, or once after the second coat?...See MoreD.J. Doss
5 years agoHALLETT & Co.
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5 years agoThe Kitchen Abode Ltd.
5 years agoD.J. Doss
5 years agoThe Kitchen Abode Ltd.
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5 years agoPatricia Colwell Consulting
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