Please Help Me Choose My 36" Gas Range (Big Chill; Smeg; Berlazonni)

Jimmy Row

6 years ago

last modified: 6 years ago

After extensive research on colored 36" gas ranges, we are down to these three:

Big Chill Classic

Smeg Victoria

Berlazonni Heritage

Leaning towards Big Chill. Ranges made to order and ovens built by Blue Star. Only four (albeit big) burners compared to 5 & 6 for Smeg and Berlazonni, but the BTUs are there (18K x2; 10K and 6K). Oven hits 30,000 BTU and infrared broiler cranks up to 15,000. Apparently, ranges can be serviced by any authorized Blue Star service co., which is a plus. And price point is solid ($5K compared to $6500 for Berlazonni; Smeg is $4500). Also allows us to select bronze finish for handles and knobs unlike the other brands, which only offer chrome. That said, I live in NYC and there is no floor unit I can see within Tri-State area nor can I find any reviews on this model (unlike the retro models).

This vid from Big Chill founder was helpful, though:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZcB00aFl_g

Thoughts or suggestions? Have I missed any brands that fit the bill? Not interested in Viking or Lacanche or La Cornu. Blue Star, regrettably, features stainless steel backing against the controls regardless of the range's color selection which does not mesh with our aesthetic. Many thanks!

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Jimmy Row
Original Author

5 years ago

Delivery Day!!!

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Comments (41)

User
6 years ago
No way would the last two ever make the finalists list. Looks not cooks. And poor customer service.
Jimmy Row thanked User
Jimmy Row
Original Author
6 years ago
EDIT: Big Chill 36"actually has six burners (18Kx2; 15Kx1; 10Kx2; 6K simmer)...so that's good.
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The comments about ten-power settings got me musing on the subject and about Amy's initial question about logarithmic power controls. Here's where that lead me. Nobody really has logarithmic power controls, but there can be power settings spaced to sort of approximate a logarithmic curve -- a number of settings at the low end with only a couple of additional points needed to define the steep side of the curve for really high heat. In theory, that can be done with a ten-step power curve and some folks do find 10 power settings fine for what and how they cook. Others do not. Is anybody else here old enough to remember the GE stoves and cooktops from 50's and 60's with ten mechanical pushbuttons for heat settings? Those pushbuttons were literally "digital" controls, meaning that you punched them with one of your digits. GE sold a lot of them for a couple of decades, so some people found them adequate. Some did not. 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As a practical matter, though, we mostly try to get the burner to the same relatively few settings. Searing is pretty much searing, isn't it? If you deep fat fry, how often would you care if if the oil were at 352° instead of 350°? But maybe somebody is working with sugar syrups where, say, it might matter if a syrup is at 325° and not 360° and then maybe it matters if the induction burner only has ten settings. That said, the subject of induction power settings and controls can be more complicated than just the number of settings. The need for finding "in-between" steps for induction cooking can reflect two different aspects of ways that manufacturers design induction burner controls. One consideration is the power cycling that all induction burners use for settings of less than full power. A technical term for this is "pulse width modulation. or "PWM." It is the same kind of thing a microwave does for low heat levels---momentary pulses of power that average out at a particular heat level. With most PICs as well as some brands of induction cooktops and ranges, the PWM is pretty crude. I've seen this somewhere described as firing up the burner for a second or two of omigosh hot and then switching totally off for three or four seconds. While these pulses average out at a certain heat level the timing can be problematic for, say, the srambled eggs that Amy mentioned at the outset. Combine that kind of "low frequency" PWM with the crude power controls found on many PICs, and you could have a reason that Amy would find herself wanting steps in-between power level "1" and "2" for scambling eggs. Some full size induction ranges and cooktops work this way. I noticed a lot of pulsing at the low heat settings on the Maytag induction range I saw demoed several years ago when I was stove shopping. From past threads on PWM, I gather than Whirlpool's induction ranges and cooktops (which include Maytag and Kitchenaid brands) have used crude PWM. For searching out past threads here on this subject try a search strings like "induction + pulsing + gardenweb" and "induction + cycling + gardenweb." A few of the expensive PICs (Cooktek, Garland, Vollrath) and many full size ranges and cooktops use much higher frequency PWM. Instead switching on and off for a second or more at time, the power switches on and off many times per second. The higher frequency of switching yields much finer power control that more closely approximates a steady heat level. The other design aspect that can lead to wanting "in-between" settings is in how the engineers program the electronic controllers to space the power settings on the appliance you are using --- that's the kind of logarithmic curve I thnk Amy may been thinking about when she posed her question in the original post. . 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PRO
User
6 years ago
Why not skip the added cost of the layer of Big Chill design and go straight for the Blue Star?
Jimmy Row thanked User
Jimmy Row
Original Author
6 years ago
We are foregoing the Blue Star because they do not wrap the range in your selected color, rather the controls/knobs are mounted against stainless regardless of whatever color you select for the rest of the range's front face. Since we are going with Black, the contrast btw the stainless and the black is a bit too sharp for our tastes and aesthetic. Check it out:

Meanwhile, here is better pic of Big Chill:
PRO
User
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
Ask them if they'd powder coat that piece as a custom order. The bigger window, and better burner configuration of the RNB might be worth the small bit of style sacrifice to the cook in the family! What hood are you planning?
Jimmy Row thanked User
Jimmy Row
Original Author
6 years ago
Excellent suggestion. Many thanks, The Cook's Kitchen!
PRO
Patricia Colwell Consulting
6 years ago
I happen to be a trained chef I run a small catering biz from my home and I have a Bertazzoni ,cooks like a dream , love the gas oven for pizza , bread and steaks. I have double electric wall ovens too. All the parts from the top of my Bert go in the DW. I have only had one service call in 10 yrs and I live in a tiny town and the service was awesome.
M Miller
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
Patricia Colwell - Bertazzoni ranges not made now the same as they were when you got yours 10 years ago. Unfortunately, they now should be avoided. It's not really fair of you to recommend Bertazzoni (as you do quite often on Houzz) and encourage people to spend their thousands on them, when your range is from 10 years ago, but they are no longer made that well.
PRO
Patricia Colwell Consulting
6 years ago
As a matter fact this is a reviwew from 4 months ago "I have the 36 inch pro version with the upgraded knobs etc. I absolutely love it, though I do agree that Berts are meant for those who enjoy the process of hands-on cooking over the set-it-and-walk-away type. It's a beautiful piece aesthetically, my kitchen is a historically-friendly design (1915 house) and this Bert adds an industrial flair that looks as upscale as a Wolf, Viking and the like. It is an all-mechanical unit - no digital display, no self-clean mode or pre-sets. I have not found it to be inconsistent in heating either - though I admit, I did have to learn and alter cooking times and oven rack placement on many of my recipes - so if in a test they made several items one time each, I can see where they were less than pleased. For instance,on cookies etc, I use the rack up high instead of the middle, and they turn out beautifully, on bread I use the middle position, and a little less cooking time.....but on my old oven I never moved the racks at all, for anything unless the item literally didnt fit. Bert, unlike the Viking I had a few years ago, also has different sized burner heads, one of which being a simmer burner that, when on low, WILL NOT boil food you are trying to simmer or keep very warm - that’s a big win in my book because that Viking brought everything to a boil no matter how low you had the heat”. IMO do not see anything to be concerned about in that review. All ranges take time to learn how to use them and this is no different . I too had a Viking before. I will continue to givemy opinion about my Bert and until I see reviews that have real problems I still love mine. I do not beleive these are made any different now than 10 yrs ago.
friedajune
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
That is a nice review to read. Here is a thread about Bertazzoni with 300+ posts. There are some positive reviews in there too.

[Thread called Is Bertazzoni Worth the Price?[(https://www.houzz.com/discussions/is-a-bertazzoni-range-worth-the-price-dsvw-vd~770422)
Jimmy Row thanked friedajune
User
6 years ago
The math doesn’t lie. It’s inferior in a lot of ways. My trusty appliance guru doesn’t lie either. He says it’s junk. A good cook can produce a meal even on junk. It’s the cook that’s the most important factor.
PRO
Patricia Colwell Consulting
6 years ago
When someone calls something junk I always want to know the reason behind the statement. So when you come up with the reasons I would love to read them .
friedajune
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
"So when you come up with the reasons I would love to read them."

Patricia Colwell - please read the thread I linked 2 posts above. There are several hundred posts in that thread with multiple and specific reasons given by people detesting their Bertazzonis if you "would love to read them".
User
6 years ago
Low BTUs, burner design, tiny ovens, weird and bad thermostat system, bad electronics, and worse customer service top the list. Not just my list. A lot of people's lists.
Jimmy Row
Original Author
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
Ouch! A lot of pointed comments here. Thank you for feedback. I am going with Big Chill. I wish the burners sat on cast iron (with removable parts) rather than stainless steel, but so be it.

EDIT: just called Big Chill and drip tray has been changed to black enamel.

As for sealed burners, that is not a deal-breaker for me despite acknowledging its sizable downside. Still, a bit of a bummer considering Big Chill oven is actually built by Blue Star!

Admittedly, I am a bit concerned about some reports re: knobs and oven handle overheating (Blue Star, not Big Chill but figure it is same same), which I have experienced with my Lacanche. To say the least, it was extremely annoying to not be able to handle knobs when oven was cranked at, say, 450 degrees.

As for the suggestion to buy a Blue Star and powder coat the area where the knobs live so that it can match the color of the oven, Blue Star said 'no can do' because the powder coating would quickly become scratched and chipped in that area due to both heat and heavy wear and tear.

Not that I am using commercial grade 18"d sheet trays, but Big Chill's interior oven dimensions are a tad small at 29"w x 18"d x 15"h (and trays are 28" x 17 3/4") whereas Blue Star offers 20" depth (so 3" more). Wolf, on the other hand, is 30" x 17"d x 18 5/8". Interestingly, I also explored the $$$ Ilve Majestic which is gorgeous, but the oven cavity is only 25" wide!
aibdesigns
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
Looking at the pics before even reading your post I chose #1 on looks alone, #3 was my second choice. You will not find any appliances out there with all great reviews so it will depend on what makes the most sense for your budget and style. When we remodeled our kitchen I realized very quickly that people have a short fuse when it comes to appliance feedback/thoughts, it's such a touchy topic, lol. Good luck.
Jimmy Row thanked aibdesigns
PRO
Patricia Colwell Consulting
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
I have not ever experienced any of those problems, low BTUs I don’t think so.I have only one oven in my 36” range never found it small.Waht about the thermostat my ovens heat just like any commercial range no telling you when the temp is reached , I have worked with commercial ranges for yrs. I think people have differnt expectations rom applainces and often they want a commrcial range but don’y understand the differences between them. I have never had a problem with knobs getting hot while the oven is on as mentioned with some of the above, I read your post and IMO there are 50-50 about the Bert. I own an all gas one and maybe the dual fuel and the induction have problems but I have not encountered any of them. As one post says Italias do not make items that last I will argue that I own many Italian made products and I would put them up against any other product on the planet. I think we all have opinions about what we use and in my experience we all have different expectations and sometimes they are unrealistic.
Jimmy Row thanked Patricia Colwell Consulting
Heather
6 years ago
I have a new Bertazzoni 30” double electric oven and I’m thrilled with the quality and the temp accuracy. It produces consistently great baked goods. I actually emailed Bertazzoni customer service in the evening to get the part number for the full extension racks and they had an answer waiting for me when I got up. I haven’t had any issues at all and would put this up against the Wolf any day.
Kendrah
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
Jimmy, you have picked some down right sexy looking ranges. Incredible color combos. We are in the process of purchasing a Blue Star, which as you noted makes Big Chill. There are many good threads that describe the evolution of the Blue Star range over the years. They used to have knobs that got hot but have taken care of that problem. I don't know if that carries over to the Big Chill models as well. And yes, it is really impressive how much the Blue Star oven holds. Compared to my current range, I feel like I'm getting a double wall ovens just by getting a new range!

I too was bothered that the band behind the dials on the Blue Star cannot be painted a color. Honestly though, when I look at your posted pic of the Big Chill, there is a lot of stainless on that too, it is just broken up into bands on the top and near the floor too. I wonder if you would not like the Blue Star better if you made up a pic on their site with brass knobs and not just brass trim around the knobs. I believe that is doable? I also would play around with the colors of black available so there is more contrast.
Jimmy Row thanked Kendrah
Jimmy Row
Original Author
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
Kendrah, thanks so much! As a matter of fact, I have spent all morning playing around on Blue Star's site. I agree with your insights and have now taken a step back to reevaluate. May I ask which Blue Star you ordered and in what finish? I didn't see an option for brass knobs, just colored knobs, but they must make them for precious metals series so perhaps all it takes is a phone call. By the way, here are some great hoods!Many thanks!
Kendrah
6 years ago
We live in a narrow row house, so 30" is what fits in our kitchen. We are ordering the RNB. I want to get in a custom color to match our off white shade of Ben Moore walls and cabinets. Trying to decide if I want brass trim or not. I might have been off about the knobs being available in metallic. Maybe they are just in colors? If so, what a bummer. Still, could get a black stove, black knobs, brass trim?
PRO
Lacanche USA
6 years ago
Bonjour Jimmy Row ! We are so sorry to hear your knobs were giving you trouble - you should absolutely be able to touch them despite the temperature while baking. Many times this can be due to a poor installation, or lack of using the back spacer behind the Range, especially with electric ovens. We wish you all the best in your search for your new perfect Range, and very happy cooking. Merci et à bientôt !! Lacanche US
Jimmy Row
Original Author
6 years ago
hi again Kendra, I spoke with Blue Star rep re: metal finishes on knobs and he said "We offer plated trim in Brass (Brushed, Polished & Antique), Copper (Brushed, Polished & Antique), Pewter, Chrome and Oil Rubbed Bronze." Here is a nifty pic I found with brass knobs!
Kendrah
6 years ago
Ooh la-la. Those knobs and trim are great. It is so tempting to get them for my Blue Star, which I should be ordering soon. But my kitchen designer and husband think that just going simple with stainless trim and white knobs is more fitting for our new kitchen look. I'm not usually enticed by bling, but this really does it for me...
calliebaumann
6 years ago
Another option (if you like the look of the brass knobs against a black background) is a Tecnogas Superiore Deco Line. Check it out if you haven't already seen it.
Marybee
5 years ago
Jimmy

what did you decide to buy? I’m losing my mind with choices
Jimmy Row thanked Marybee
Jimmy Row
Original Author
5 years ago
last modified: 5 years ago
hi Marybee! I know how you feel! I went with a Blue Star 36" Platinum Series (6-burner w/ interchangeable griddle/charbroiler) in "Traffic Black" with brushed brass handles and knobs. Matching hood (black with brushed brass straps) is being custom-made by Vogler Metalwork & Designs based upon http://voglermetaldesign.com/ogee.html My install is happening in a few weeks. I will upload pix then. FYI - here is great vid on the Blue Star interchangeable griddle/charbroiler. https://vimeo.com/217882107 Good luck!
Jimmy Row
Original Author
5 years ago
last modified: 5 years ago
and here is the matching hood by Vogler:
Kris Buell
5 years ago
Absolutely gorgeous! I personally couldn't justify the price to my husband for the knob options myself, but I can drool over yours, and that hood, wow. My only gripe about my BS is the top front side piece of stainless got tons of hairline scratches pretty much right away due to family helpers dragging pots across it, but hey, character. I absolutely love my range and I don't care. I'm sure you're going to love yours as well.
shughs
5 years ago
This is a great post with valuable information. We are remodeling a kitchen and I am researching ranges.
Aunt Arctica
5 years ago
Just a note, Bertazzoni just did a major remodel (I am looking at them and BS too). The ovens are taller, added temps to the temp gauges, and after Dec you can get the black knobs for the Master Series upgraded version. They also now have a distribution center in Seattle that will carry parts. We live somewhere that there is little service, yet we can get both BS and Berta service (same people). Also, it is notable which companies simply won't carry certain brands due to service issues and Berta is not one of those. In fact, its sold at most high end appliance and decorating companies. Their response to our questions was prompt and easy and friendly. What we really want is a BertaStar...the looks of the Berta, the top open burners of the BS...ha ha! Its hard having to choose between muscle car and italian flair....Berta is winning so far since we like sautes, veggees, and fish...more Mediterranean diets than heavy American.
Heather
5 years ago
I had good experience with Bertazoni. i have a 30” double oven and it’s great.
kitchenchemist
5 years ago
How do you love it at this point, Jimmy Row? I also have a BlueStar, and 2 years later, I just love, love it. We went with the antique brass knobs and handles. If we were to ever move, I would contemplate replacing our BS with something else and moving the BS with us! I hope you're enjoying your beauty as much as I do.

1905 Kitchen Remodel: A Nod to Simple Victorian · More Info
Robert
4 years ago
We're late to this discussion, but we have just finished a multi-state tour of kitchen showrooms looking at "professional" ranges, cute and otherwise. A deciding factor for us proved to be the oven temperature-setting. Bluestar/Big Chill and many others have very poor controls for oven temp setting. Some are coarse, upside-down, or both. It seems that the cuter the range, the worse this is. Doesn't anyone bake anymore? How did these controls get into these kinds of ranges? Why do cheap gas stoves have better oven temp setting?

The answer might be that in a commercial kitchen, various ovens are set to specific temperatures at the start of the day and they stay there. Actual oven thermometers are used to verify temps. Some cute ovens like Bertazzoni have thermometer indicators on their control panels but good luck trying to get consistent settings by just using the oven temp knob when you need to bake a cake at 350F and then roast some vegetables at 400F.

We eventually chose a 36" GE Cafe in bronze and white. This series has a fairly precise oven control setting with actual temperature indication. We will order matching extra oven handles and adapt them to a large but fairly standard white side-by-side fridge, Whirlpool or GE. Here is a link to sources of other kitchen hardware that will match that special GE Cafe bronze:

https://www.houzz.com/discussions/5578436/hardware-to-match-ge-cafe-series-range-in-brushed-bronze
Heather
4 years ago
Robert, most of the avid bakers use thermometers in their ovens - anytime a recipe I’m cooking requires precise temp controls, I use a thermometer. My Berta double oven doesn’t have a display that shows the current temp of the oven, but my thermometer always reflects the temp I’ve set it at (not sure what’s confusing about the temp knob). A GE cafe is a good choice.
M
4 years ago
last modified: 4 years ago
I don't particularly trust temperature controls. They never tell the whole picture. Every oven behaves subtly different and requires some getting used to. So, yes, an oven thermometer in the actual oven cavity is helpful. And some ovens might require a baking stone/steel or some other form of heat dispersal mechanism. Others are naturally very even. Of they need the fan to run in order to do so. Yet again, others are even, as long as you don't run the fan. You'll figure it out over time as you get used to your new appliance.

We now have two different types of ovens. A big 30" Bluestar gas oven, and a very featureful 24" Miele combination steam oven. They are both great about keeping temperature. But the Bluestar is much more even. On the other hand, it takes much longer to preheat and it doesn't have all the neat features that I like in my CSO.

In the end, both of them are great ovens and I use them interchangeably for both cooking and baking. It's easy to make the required adjustments to recipes and I rarely even need to think about it. Really, the only problem is with ovens that are wildly uneven and fortunately not even the Miele falls into the category; it just isn't as impressively even as the Bluestar.
Robert
4 years ago
We always use a thermometer in the cavity to double-check oven temps, but the coarseness, orientation, and wobbliness of many of these cute oven controls makes it difficult to even get a consistent starting point for temp setting. Many times you need to change temperature in the middle of a bake or roast. Repeatability matters regardless of what the oven knob says--even if it was just numbers 1-10 and not temperatures. It helps to be able to easily return to the same knob positions each time without standing on your head.

Wolf gets it but in a non-cute industrial way:
k mcc
3 years ago
@Jimmy Row How is your BigChill range??? I was thinking about putting in a wolf range but came across this brand recently and LOVE the look....would love to hear how it's been.
Jimmy Row
Original Author
3 years ago
I ended up going with a Blue Star Platinum, which I love!
Raquel V
2 years ago
Very helpful thread. Jimmy, can I ask why you went blue star vs big chill?