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missi_rogge

Quarter sawn oak-painted uppers yay or nay

Missi (4b IA)
4 years ago

I went to the cabinet place yesterday w/measurements and layout of our kitchen, intending to talk about a quote for Waypoint. He was busy w/another family so the kids and I wandered around looking at the cabinet displays, counters, floors etc. There was a display w/quarter sawn oak (Bertch cabinetry). Wow. Completely threw me off the Waypoint course. He's going to quote both the Waypoint and the Bertch so I have more numbers to compare.

My question is..the "look" I wanted for my kitchen was white uppers and stained lowers. There was one of the little partial doors in that quarter sawn that was lightly painted, leaving some of the grain to peek through and it was really pretty. Would it be a total waste to spend extra on that kind of wood only to have the uppers painted? Or would it be ok to do white uppers w/a different painted wood and the quarter sawn for the lowers? (or just bend and do all stained?)

Maybe I need to rethink what I am wanting for the kitchen? As of now, Waypoint is off the table, regardless, I just want the quote for my husband's sake. I'll do an all white Ikea kitchen instead (if we don't do the Bertch), b/c that's the best bet for the money that I've found.

Does anyone have painted quarter sawn oak?

Comments (145)

  • mabeldingeldine
    4 years ago

    Missi, you've got a great attitude! It's great you've got friends and relatives to help out to go along with it. I have two suggestions.

    1) Take a wood shop class through adult ed if you can. I did that 25 years ago, and it has served me well over 3 DIY houses.

    2) Keep an eye out on Craigslist. I've made amazing purchases from CL, and I too live in a rural state. Ex. Costa Rose granite countertop, $1100, brand new 36" GE Profile Induction Cooktop, brand new 30" KitchenAid wall oven and many more...

    Our biggest project was a whole house remodel including gutting the kitchen that was 90% DIY and cost well under $20 K (I'll post in the new 20K thread). It took over a year, but that is for the whole house. We could have done just the kitchen in a summer, but we are both teachers and have the time. Good Luck!

    Missi (4b IA) thanked mabeldingeldine
  • hatethecold_gw
    4 years ago

    Missi, the wall with the patio doors- what is the measurement for that wall to the left side of the door. It looks like maybe a little over 24"?

    I have a crazy idea (I am totally NOT) a layout guru), but not even sure if it would work without knowing that measurement.

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    @Beth, first thanks for all your tips and ideas on the hardware. Good idea to mark them out and good to know that 4" is the min (they sell 3 and 3.5, which are cheaper, so I wondered if that would work. thanks) I know; You had a lot of good ideas on painting. Thank you. I am still waffling on what to do. I guess my concerns w/ the painted floors are the effort to do it and the maintenance (I have wear patterns on my front porch and the kitchen gets more traffic). Plus I want to limit my exposure to chemicals. FWIW, this morning I emailed my house painter to check his schedule if I choose to have him repaint the cabs. (he's a much better painter than I am) Painting would allow me to fix the placement of the holes on some of the cabs (currently, most of the cabs do not have holes). I could also put a cab to the left of the stove. And I made an appt next week with the interior designer who was going to help me pick finish materials etc with the big remodel....to get his opinion of a scaled-down remodel. i.e. how to make this house a better version of what it is without spending a ton of money since I may move in a few years....thanks for all your help! I don't want this to be all about $$$, but everything is so $$$ and I hate the idea of investing a lot of excessive $ that I won't get when I sell. (when my former realtor came over this summer, she kept saying "do what *you* want; do what makes you happy; you don't need to do anything to fix this house to sell it" etc). So I guess my dilemma: what can make it more live-able for me for the next few years. (but possibly longer? who knows?)
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  • lisa_a
    4 years ago

    Thanks, Missi. I'm painting ceiling (ugh, ugh, ugh!) at a friend's today so I won't have time until at least tomorrow to update my above plan with accurate numbers.

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    thanks mabelding! I'll keep an eye on CL and see what I can find.

    hatethecold, do you mean from that wall w/the chicken cabinet to the patio door? It's 27" to the trim.

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Lisa, omg, please don't feel you need to do mess w/the plan or anything for me. Even just having people to talk it out w/helps, other eyes for me to see thru. I'd say to enjoy your painting..but..yanno..ceiling painting suuucks. I'll say enjoy your time w/your friend!!

    I came home early from work today w/strep, so I'll just be spending the weekend browsing the forums and looking at cabinets! Well..when I'm not curled up in the fetal position asking myself why I work w/small children who get me sick.

    I got quotes from the cabinet guy today, and they were expensive, but not nearly what I thought they would be. And, I know there's things that could be changed to lower the cost a bit as well, if we were to go that route.

  • hatethecold_gw
    4 years ago

    Miss, yes, that is the wall I meant, and it means my crazy idea won't work. thanks :)

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Oh shoot, what was your crazy idea?

  • Lyndee Lee
    4 years ago
    I know there is a ReStore in Des Moines and there might be one someplace else in your general vicinity. I have bought several used kitchens, usually from ReStore but also from demo sales and Craigslist. Unlike most people, I design the kitchen from the available cabinets, as sets are never perfect for the space.. I usually have a pretty good idea what I need and I am rather creative at adapting cabinets to fit. For one kitchen, I had a 94 inch sink wall and I looked and looked for cabinets that would fit. Finally, ReStore received a collection of showroom sample cabinets with a 33 inch sink base and a 36 inch corner base so there is room to add a dishwasher at some future time.
    If you find a potential set, be sure you can figure out the lowers, especially the corners and sink base. Uppers can always be moved around and filled out with shelving but lowers can be tricky. Some sets arent worth the trouble; look for lots of drawers with quality hardware and a mix of sizes and sometimes you will even get plywood construction.

    I have bought cheap unfinished cabinets to augment existing kitchens and those are junk. Be careful moving them as they will fall apart before you get them in place. It is lots of work to finish cabinets and it is difficult to get a quality finish. General Finishes has some nice quality products but it seems a shame to waste the products and your time trying to transform low end pieces.
    Missi (4b IA) thanked Lyndee Lee
  • Lyndee Lee
    4 years ago
    I recently put in some QS oak cabinets in my basement and decided to price a similar cabinet from Menards for grins. They have a beautiful wet bar display 5, maybe 6 feet wide with the cabinets as shown price tag of $6586. Absolutely beautiful but too pricey for me. The kitchen guy priced out a 30 wide, 84 tall pantry cabinet with shelves and plywood construction at $1450 in quartersawn oak which is about triple what I paid for the whole bunch from ReStore.
  • rebunky
    4 years ago

    Missi, I’m rooting (sp?) for you! I know several Rogge’s in Iowa so maybe you are related. Best wishes on your kitchen!

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks Lyndee Lee and rebunky!

    There is a store up at the lakes called ReNew Reclaimed Building Materials. I follow them on FB and have asked about a few things-the hard part is getting up there before someone else, but never hurts to try!

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    rebunky, might be! There are two pronunciations here, different families, same spelling tho, which is confusing. My husband is of the Roh-gge pronunciation, rather than the Rah-gge.

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    I tried to put Lisa's suggestions into the Ikea thing. She added banquette seating w/small uppers/lowers on the ends-there's no seating options like that on there so I am pretending w/the benches. I changed the run w/the peninsula to the shallow cabinets instead of the full depth ones, so there's still counter and storage space, but we're able to walk thru easier. (didn't know how to put a Horda cabinet at the wall end of the peninsula) Left just those few uppers in the kitchen area so maybe it would feel more open? If we can figure out a different spot for the fridge, great, b/c then there's more cabinet/counter space on the sides of the stove-but if not, that's ok too. (there's room for a bigger fridge if it stays) I'll still look at taking out the closet b/c you never know what my husband might agree to.

  • Annette Holbrook(z7a)
    4 years ago

    Missi, to make the bench seating portion of the banquette I’m using a 24” deep upper for over the fridge and putting in on a standard toekick base. Then you just put the drawer hardware and fronts instead of the door hardware.

    To do it in the planner you have to view it in 3D mode and move it down to floor level.

    Missi (4b IA) thanked Annette Holbrook(z7a)
  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks! I'll see if I can figure out how to do that.

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Do you have to do anything special so it will allow you to move it down? When I go to 3D view and click on it, even if I move my finger down w/the touchpad, it moves it to a wall.

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    I got it figured out. And changed it a bit.

  • F L
    4 years ago
    I always read these threads and am astounded at what people quote as the price of a decent kitchen reno. we are completely not diy people, I live in nyc area (read: pricy) and we moved our kitchen to the dining room, turned old kitchen into dining room and removed a load bearing wall between DR and LR. we put in hardwood flooring throughout, semi custom cabs, quartz countertops and all new ss (box store) appliances. kitchen has eat in area, no island, but big enough to comfortably cook for a family of 9 all week, 3 meals a day. I love my kitchen, and all of this was around 50k, kitchen itself 38k. I don't know what others are spending on, but this is my real life experience...and We used a kitchen designer and kitchen store for this...moving all plumbing, gas, electric etc. we could have gone lower with stock cabs too. so there's hope for everyone who doesn't have 75k to drop on a kitchen....
    Missi (4b IA) thanked F L
  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Isn't it insane? The cost seems to be bandied about by a lot of people like oh no big whoop but boy howdy to a lot of us it's mind boggling.

  • Lisa 902
    4 years ago

    @F L, I'm wondering what brand of cabinets you used.

    I'm enjoying this thread and I wish you the best, Missi.



  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks Lisa! I'm having a lot of fun working on it for sure.

    I'm going to work on getting pictures/lists of everything I want, layout, quotes, paint colors, curtains, the whole nine yards, so I can present it to my husband and dad and there's no excuse not to start!

    I'll be back for more help.

  • F L
    4 years ago
    I'll be home tomorrow and I'll post. I did it through a local kitchen place
  • F L
    4 years ago
    the brand is forevermark
  • Annette Holbrook(z7a)
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Missi,

    For your banquette area you need to use the 24” deep refrigerator uppers for the bench portion and the 15” deep base and uppers for the storage cabinets on the sides. You want the banquette seating to stick out beyond the side cabinets. It makes it much easier to get in and out of the bench area if you have some recess to the side.

    Also for that area, if you want it to be a bit different than the kitchen cabinets and look more like furniture then do flush toe kicks like it the first pic above. However if you have young kids, they may scuff up a flush toe kick because they aren’t generally aware that they are kicking them as they slide in and out.

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Ohhhhhh got it-here I thought I was being smart by just changing the width of the side cabinets again-the ones above are 18, and I switched them out for 15". I'll go back and do it again w/the shallower base cabs. Thanks!

    Every time I get on there and run the tally of what all is selected I cringe a little bit more haha. BUT I don't want to have to do this crap again for an awfully long time so I want to make sure I get it right.

    I very much appreciate the help I've been getting!

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Ahhh now that I'm in there I remember why I redid it w/the shallower cabinets-the refrigerator ones didn't come in drawer styles and I figured they would be easier to get stuff in/out of. Maybe no?

  • Annette Holbrook(z7a)
    4 years ago

    Missi, you just buy the frames for the 24” deep refrigerator cabinets. Then you separately buy the drawer parts from this unit,

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    ooooooh is that option in the planner too? I'll go look for it tomorrow and redo it. Thank you!

  • Annette Holbrook(z7a)
    4 years ago

    Missi, I don’t think it will come up in the planner. You have to put the cabinet with the 2 doors in your plan and then make a note to yourself to buy the drawer hardware and the drawer front, and have the door hardware and doors removed from your order.

  • Annette Holbrook(z7a)
    4 years ago

    I found the best way to get my plan organized was to print the buying guide. I printed from page 20 to 68 the get the cabinet info, but if you have the ink and paper available then print the whole thing. Or go to an ikea and get the guide from them. For example, this is the page showing how you order just the frame for the fridge upper, without the doors.


    Buying guide to print

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks! I'll see if I can get it printed at home.

  • PRO
    The Kitchen Place
    4 years ago

    I think the white trend will inevitably start to fade in popularity. I'm already finding people wanting wood again. For those that love QSOak but need something a bit easier on the budget, I recommend doing Flush or beaded inset with regular oak or hickory. Oak and hickory are two of the least expensive woods so it can be a good option for those on a budget. Plus a stain is anywhere from 10% to 25% less than paint. I recently did a couple kitchen remodel, one with oak and one with hickory. Both flush inset. The inset gives the wood an updated classy look (furniture look).. a far cry from honey oak builder grade from the 80s and 90s.

    Shiloh Flush inset rustic hickory in Chestnut finish (kitchen pics below) cost about $10k in this kitchen. Oak would have been less. The desk was extra.

    You can also do regular hickory, but they wanted the knots.

    Here is the other kitchen in Oak Flush Inset by Shiloh as well.

    Missi (4b IA) thanked The Kitchen Place
  • bbtrix
    4 years ago

    You can do a limited amount of customization within the planner. With the cabinet selected, click customize on the right then it allows a few different combinations. I always have the guide next to me while designing as it has all parts in one spot.

  • lisa_a
    4 years ago

    Missi, I posted a link to how to make a banquette bench using Ikea cabinets in my post of 1/17. I also drew the banquette at 24" d and the cabs on each side of it at 15" d for the reason Annette stated. If you were to have at least 24" of bench beyond the table length, you could probably get by with 24" d cabs next to the banquette but you don't have that luxury of space.

    Nice kitchens, KP!

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    TKP those are gorgeous kitchens. My husband would want the knots in the hickory--but I like the second one. That's oak? I guess I need to look at more kitchens than what I've been b/c that looks nothing like what I've pictured for "oak" in my head. Like-not even in the same realm. Maybe I need to give you a jingle!

    Argh Lisa you probably did and I just didn't process what you were talking about. Or I went to the planner to work on it and got distracted messing around w/things. (squirrel!)

    bbtrix, ha yeah I finally figured out a few days ago that you can change the fronts w/just a click..and that you need to add side panels and such.

  • Annette Holbrook(z7a)
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Lisa, would you, pretty please, post the link to the thread you mentioned ? I tried the other link but it didn’t work. But could be that I’m on my iPad not my desktop.

  • Lyndee Lee
    4 years ago
    Im not really a fan of rustic hickory but it was still a pretty kitchen. That oak kitchen is really appealing with the slightly darker finish on the oak and inset doors.
  • Annette Holbrook(z7a)
    4 years ago

    Missi, that worked. I think I needed to delete my cookies.

  • Mrs Pete
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Dude, 63k is slightly less than what my husband and I both gross in a year.

    Yeah, and my whole house is worth about 150K and is roughly average for this area -- no way lots of people in this area are spending 63K for kitchens. A few people, sure, but it's not average.

    yes thank you so much daisychain! Sometimes there's a feeling of if you can't afford high end, you don't deserve anything. I'm just looking for something that will be great for me..which might not be great for anyone else.

    Yes, we do see that attitude on this board sometimes. I tend to advocate in the other direction; that is, although I can afford whatever I want, I don't see the point in putting excessive resources into your house.

    Ah yes, Sophie, but if a person doesn't know something costs many times over what the budget allows, must you ridicule someone for having "fantasies" about it, and *asking* about it?

    Having read this board a while, I'm going with ... yes.

    What's 4 hours(ea way) when you'll be living in your dream for years. I can say it's always worth it. But it's also a journey so do your homework and prep to get farthest along.

    Yep, but do make the most of your trip: Be sure to go with measurements, color chips, whatever else in hand. And look up their sales. A couple times a year they have a cool sale: You eat in their restaurant, and then deduct the price of your meal off $100 of furniture. And they have a great sale on cabinets every so often -- definitely worth waiting for.

    Missi (4b IA) thanked Mrs Pete
  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    I met w/another cabinet guy today, the one I've been trying to connect w/for a few weeks but we just kept missing each other w/weather and our schedules. He's going to get a design going and quote maple, hickory, and oak, in just a plain shaker door, the least expensive of the full overlay doors that I liked, so that the quotes are all apples to apples. Depending on price then, I could look at other styles, standard overlay, whatever, to see if that will help. He's seeing a lot more cabinets than I had in the kitchen part and that little jog of wall. And I forgot to tell him we're putting a pantry in..started talking and it slipped my mind. I didn't ask him to quote for the banquette seating. I'll just see where we are w/the kitchen and wall jog.

    He uses the Debut cabinets, and I'm looking at the Executive construction.

    Anyway, I was happy w/how things went, he grew up around here, knows a lot of the people from here, and two of the jobs he's going to be starting are people we know.

    My husband is still not thrilled w/the idea of doing cabinets that are not the unfinished ones from Menards, so hopefully I can get him on board w/one of these other options! If we're going to do Ikea instead, I want to have things nailed down in time for the kitchen sale.

  • Michael Goss
    4 years ago
    Hi! Just a quick thought to take or leave: we moved into a house with laminate counter tops and I hate them so much. They prob are the worst quality and maybe there are better out there but just be careful choosing laminate counter top if you’re going that route. We have it as a 4” backsplash behind the sink as well and it’s separated from the particle board underneath. My daughter also ripped off a piece on the side of the counter, lovely.
  • House Vixen
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    I've been following this thread since the beginning....

    Missi, thanks for starting it and man, kudos to you for still having the energy to explore your options when faced with roadblocks!

    So many great suggestions in this thread -- always glad to see creative reuse concepts mentioned -- Craiglist-y, Green Demolitions, etc. And DIY where possible, of course. BTDT and looks like will be BTDoingMoreofThat than hoped for this go-round. ;)

    I had to take a break from my current project planning when quote 1 came in way too high for where we want to be and I had a lot of other things going on. [Our HCOL market is booming and my numbers were about a year out of date for labor.] Getting back into it now.

    Having started my GW lurking at least 16 years ago, this was ALWAYS a place where people on smaller budgets could get great advice -- including how to get the "look for less" -- and support. And without the shaming...

    No, sometimes we couldn't get what we wanted, but we could always get more for our money and/or a higher-end look than we would have had.

    Back then I found GW too late for layout input [cabs ordered, rashly!] and boy did I live to regret that. But I never felt my participation was worth less because I had ~ $10K all-in to spend.

    I'd really like to see more of these types of threads, and from the response I'm not alone! The mix of reality check and alternative solutions helps so many.

    ps our HD cabs ("Thomasville" in 2002, so I think Masterbrand) and laminate counter are holding up fine. Now if I could fine someone willing to try...CE Freeman's, maybe?...trick of converting frameless to inset I'd probably be able to reuse some vs donate/sell should this reno happen!

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks Meghan! We currently have laminate..just a stock kind that was at Menards when we tried sprucing the kitchen up many years ago. I'd like to get butcher block, or white Corian. Corian I think is pretty spendy. The only butcher block we'd be able to do is from Ikea b/c I think bb is kinda up there in cost as well. I've got my work cut out for me on the cabinets..I don't want to push my luck too far w/the countertops. If he'd agree to it, or my parents were to decide to float us a loan, however, then I'm all for it!

    Thanks House Vixen! I've got nothing if not staying power eh?! I spent three months researching goat milk soap when I wanted to try it. Been researching ideas for a new ring for a year and a half, another ring for not quite a year. This is my favorite part, I think, looking at pictures, getting thoughts and ideas and experiences from others.

    I knew I couldn't be the only person in the world in this situation, with a severe lack of budget. Severe lack of budget, determination and a sunny disposition ha! Also a healthy dose of realistic, logical, rational and practical ways of looking at things. Maybe throw in a long suffering husband as well..


  • Lyndee Lee
    4 years ago
    I dont know if the ikea butcher block has improved in the past decade but I dont recommend it if there is any chance of water exposure. I used it around my sink and the glue isnt waterproof. Unless you never have helpful visitors or negligent household members, it isnt worth the trouble. All it took for noticeable damage was someone spreading out a dishtowel and then leaving the wet dishtowel on the counter while the dishes air dried. Even if you wouldnt personally do this, do you want to be spending your time and energy following everyone who enters the kitchen and drying off the countertop?

    I like white Corian which I use it for all sorts of bathroom and laundry room surfaces. My usual source is donated countertops at ReStore. I dont have the materials or equipment to seam it for kitchen countertops but I have done smaller seams that are in less visible locations.

    I recently put a menards laminate countertop in my basement which was the cheapest alternative. I needed a single straight piece, so 12 feet for 150 bucks. I really dislike the mitered corners and the one piece backsplash but I had the space to cut off the backsplash and I will do a tiled backsplash instead.
  • Imhappy&Iknowit IOWA zone 4b
    4 years ago

    North Iowa here.. What no one on this thread understands is there are no "green spaces" here. We have Habitat ReStore. We have Menard's or maybe Lowe's or Home Depot. Iowa people help each other all the time. Craig's list has junk. I did a kitchen gut 10+ years ago with Menard's hickory cabinets and laminate counters. No back splash. Existing Vinyl floor. Used my just fine white appliances. My house was built in 1880 so no open concept here. My kitchen is a room. A small room by comparison to almost all kitchens on here. I had a handyman who worked cheap. I had known him for at least 30 years so when I left for work I knew he'd deal with whatever came along. He was gone when I got home and I did clean up. I also did the gutting of the old kitchen; dead mice in the light fixture but he warned me about the potential so I was prepared. Maybe I was very, very lucky but I got a great kitchen for $10,000. I don't know what inflation would do to that price today. Compared to what I started with I now have a palace.

    You are a long way from final plans and I think you will do just fine. It takes a lot of price comparison shopping to get there. And shopping on eBay and Menard's sales. Don't over look the consignment shops. If you do Menard's cabinets wait until they have the 11% off. If you visit the cabinet people there regularly and tweak your layout, you will find people you really like and who like you and they will tell you when the sales are coming up. You can also make your own laminate counters for cheap. I didn't do that 4 inch backsplash thing and even though I didn't do any other kind of backsplash, I'm glad I didn't add it. Right now I have wallpaper but I'm thinking I might tile some paneling that's cut to fit so that if I get tired of it I can pull it off and put something else there.

    Missi (4b IA) thanked Imhappy&Iknowit IOWA zone 4b
  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Nice to see another Iowan! Ha, yeah, there is definitely a dearth of places around here to go, and unless you live in a place like that currently, or have in the past, it's really hard to understand what it's like, or what is involved in trying to find things. Even the ReStore, heck, we're 1.5 hours away, and depending on the season, unless it was free, I *really* doubt I'd mess w/driving up to the lakes and deal w/the traffic there just to save a few bucks during touristy summer time.

    It is nice, tho, and I think seems to be something else unless you live here, you don't get it, that we all help each other.

  • Imhappy&Iknowit IOWA zone 4b
    4 years ago

    you don't have messaging enabled but I do. Will you message me? I might know something/somewhere that you need ;-)

  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Oh I don't? Shoot, lemme figure out how to do that. Didn't know there was such a thing.


  • Missi (4b IA)
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Jeez I'm dumb I can't figure out how to enable messaging. Let me try to message you.

    Messaged you and enabled messaging too!