Not many in these public gardens. Bartlett's Arboretum seems like they will try anything once LOL.

goo.gl/VnJxYq

My general thought on the western US conifers, is only mess with ones known to do well in your area.* It's not as though a whole bunch of them were just discovered or something. There's been a way to try them on the east coast for a long time now, and people have tried them. It would be crazy to think, for example, that the Scott Arboretum - listed at my link above - didn't try to plant T. mertensiana at some point. But OP might as well try his...what else is he going to do with it? It's not like most of us have a second garden on the west coast to plant what won't grow in our east coast garden. (though I am actually aware of at least one wealthy plant collector who does have that!) If it dies in a couple years or less, it dies in a couple years. I have proven to my satisfaction, for example, that ungrafted Abies grandis and Abies lasiocarpa have less than a snowball's chance in hell in my particular microclimate...and probably most of the mid-Atlantic. Maybe they'd be OK on the top of Sugarloaf mountain, or out in chilly Oakland, MD, but that's not where I live. Considering what Treehaven charged for those seedlings, I lost maybe $30, max. The balance of the order is alive, including 2 out of 3 Abies delavayi and all of the Abies albas.

* - but people apparently even have trouble figuring out this simple rule, which is why the eastern 2/3 of the US is littered with crappy looking blue spruces.

oh, Kyle could always approach graft it onto a T. carolinana seedling LOL.

Good points, David. Like you basically said, I intend to try it regardless, and if it dies, oh well; I'll only be out like a dollar.

I wonder if it can be grafted onto Tsuga canadensis? Or one of the Asian hemlocks possibly? That might help with the supposed root rot issue.

lol I just now read your last comment.

Yeah...funny how that works LOL.

Anyhow, I'd be careful about the Asian hemlocks. I had one die of apparent root rot, but I can't be sure. I'll have to check my records about which one it was. IIRC it had survived at least a year, probably two. It died either in the deluge of rain from Hurricane Sandy in 2011, or the very heavy downpour the following summer, following a heatwave, that killed my 4' Rhodie 'Capistrano'. (named 'Crapistrano' by the late Hank Schannen, founder of Rarefind, because of it's tendency to die like that) It was on the border of my neighbor's property though, and back then he had a lawn service company that was putting down way too much N, probably. It's growth was oddly soft and rapid to me...I wonder if that contributed. I am slightly downhill from his yard. Fortunately, he got parsimonious in his retirement and stopped the Chemlawn or whatever it was.

Not every plant from high elevation Asia is going to be root rot resistant.

https://jcra.ncsu.edu/horticulture/our-plants/results.php?search=tsuga

As I expected the southern Japanese one has grown that longest at NCSU. Mine was a T. chinensis. It came from Forestfarm so there's always the chance it was mixed up with another species, I suppose. Anyhow I definitely bought it on a lark, and probably won't replace it. Since the Asian ones look pretty close, to my eyes, to the native ones that do grow around here...I'm not sure I want to make room for one in the garden. When there are plenty of conifers that look nothing like anything you'd see around here.

Can it actually be grafted onto canadensis or caroliniana? I can't find if they're compatible.

There has been a decent amount written about Tsuga heterophylla, and it basically comes down to the location of the seed. If it is sourced from the coast, it doesn't have a chance out here, but if you can located seed from the inland locations, it should do fine. Tsuga mertensiana has the same range. If you look at the map belong, you would need to get seed from those inland pockets in Idaho. I called Sheffield's about this a couple years ago and Rick said he was trying to find an interior source, but hadn't had any luck yet. My question was specifically about heterophylla, so not sure if they have any source for interior mertensiana

http://www.plantmaps.com/nrm-tsuga-mertensiana-mountain-hemlock-native-range-map

Your question about grafting compatibility is very interesting to me. No one can seem to answer that though! I'd buy Tsuga mertensiana 'Bumps Blue' and Tsuga heterophylla 'Thorsen's Weeping' in a second and graft them to canadensis if I was certain they were compatible and that it makes any difference with their long term suitability here.

Very interesting stuff. I got my T. mertensiana from Rick two or three years ago. I don't recall what it's source was, and at the time, I knew much less than I do now, so I probably wouldn't have realized it made any difference.

Never knew this but apparently T. mertensiana is morphologically different from all other hemlocks, and would perhaps be interesting to grow for that reason.

I think in most genus, it is assumed any species will graft to any species. With the exception of certain large 'super genus' like Rhododendron, that actually contain 5 incompatible sub-genus/sections. (lepidote, elepidote, evergreen azaleas, deciduous azaleas, etc although it's actually much more complicated than that: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhododendron#Subdivision)

I read on an old thread where someone said mertensiana can be grafted onto canadensis, but that it will eventually fail unless you plant it so deep that the graft line is covered so that it will eventually grow its own roots. It was a little confusing.

Yep, information on Tsuga grafting is scarce, but I found an Arnold Arboretum article that indicated all Tsuga used to be grafted to canadicans, but they found too much incompatibility, even within the same species (dwarfs especially). So it seems the vast majority of Tsuga is now rooted.

Also found an old comment on here from ConiferJoy (a top expert), that Tsuga is difficult to graft, which again suggests people are rooting them.

Also, I'm sure smarter minds have already tried doing cross species grafts of Tsuga, and concluded it's either not viable, or doesn't solve whatever the issues are with the western hemlocks adapting here

Interesting...it sounds like Tsuga just have trouble with grafting, period.

I live in southern Indiana and have tried T. mertensiana twice in the ground. Both times have failed within a month or two. First time it died over the winter; next time over the summer. Despite this, I do think it could live through a summer decently if properly sited. But I suspect the winter is the problem; in particular, the combination of cold and dry air and winds and frozen ground. From the little bit of research I've done, it seems the top growth is plenty cold tolerant, but that the roots are not (in native habitat, the roots are always snow covered).

I may keep trying, but I'm guessing the combination of frozen soil (often without snow) and cold does them in,

Having said that, I *do* have a 'Bump's Blue' that I ordered three years ago. It's still alive, but it's potted—and I bring it into a mild(er) porch every winter. So far, that seems to do the trick.

I found hot humid summers more destructive to mertensiana than cold. My 'Bump's Blue' lived 7 or 8 years and saw temps of -17*F without injury but one long, hot, humid summer and it died. Water was not a factor. Finding a balance of sun and cool in summer is the key.

tj

" without injury but one long, hot, humid summer and it died"

yep - that goes back to what I was saying about western US conifers. The safe, default assumption is that most of them cannot tolerate our eastern humidity.

Agree w/david. Grafting won't help 'cause it'll be the needle diseases getting it.

I have a T. mertensiana in a large pot for the past 5 years. I forgot about it in the mix and never put it in the ground. It has survived but only grows a couple inches a year. It is in part shade surrounded by other potted trees. I'll have to see about untangling the roots and getting it in the ground this spring . . . originally purchased as a small liner from forestfarm if I remember correctly.

T. mertensiana is a high altitude conifer.......it even struggles down here at sea level in its native range :-) If you can offer the growing conditions characteristic to a high altitude (5,000 feet and up), then I think any chances for growing it would be much improved.

I have three Mertensianas and all are doing just fine, but I'm not at sea level either at 700ft. and about 15 miles from salt water. Mine are around 25 or 30 years old.

I'd reckon an alpine tree would benefit from an open siting w/as much wind & sun as reasonable. Also perhaps planted on a sandy berm for maximum drainage. But none of that is a guarantee.

The best examples of Tsuga mertensiana that I've seen are located in the sub-alpine zone of the rain forest on the SW side of the Olympic Mountains in Washington State. Plenty of water and good drainage. They are seldom seen on the drier, NE side. There you find Abies lasiocarpa at the same sub-alpine elevation. So, Beng12, you're right!