Yellow veins, falling leaves. Is it light, chlorosis or fert issues?

7 years ago

Alright, so it's been, what, a month since my last citrus scare? Obviously we were due, lol. Here goes: the small leaves of one of my trees are getting yellow and then falling with the barest touch.

I've been watering every day. I've tried to be careful about the light transition, but with Dave being recovering, I admit I might have switched them a little faster than I normally would have.

I had been giving them 1/2 teaspoon of FP every other day for about a month. They are in 511 mix and it drains very well. I stopped giving them FP in the event it might have been an over fertilizing issue, since this year is the first time I use it, so right now, they aren't getting anything.

Both trees had the same regimen, only the small leaves of the smallest tree seem to have this happening. The big tree is really striving, which leaves me puzzled. It only affected the small one.

Here are a few pictures of the leaves. It mostly affected the smaller leaves:

Here you can see a few leaves it's about to happen to as well. Same tree:

Here are a pic of the tree it's happening to. It was doing great, too, which is frustrating. Tons of lemons growing, everything was alright with the citrus world. And now this.

And now pictures of the second tree, which was put through the exact same regimen and has never done better... Growth everywhere, buds, new branches, the whole nine yeards. Go figure.

Thanks for your advice, y'all. I honestly don't have much energy to devote to my trees right now.

God bless,

Atheen

Dave update: He's slowly doing better. He stopped losing weight (YAY). He can now have a light breakfast, a sensible lunch and a light dinner. I'm still cooking pretty much fat free food 3x/day for him, which isn't fun considering anything fried is his favorite food group. But I'm slowly reintroducing a little bit of fat in the form of olive oil, and low fat milk. It's pretty much chicken, shrimp, eggs and lean ham for now. Lots of rice, salads and veggies. Bread, but only the ones I bake myself. Too much crap he doesn't need in what you buy pre-sliced. So, I'm getting up with the bakers at 3.30am twice a week for bread, lol. It's worth it, though. Anything to get him healthy again. We see the pancreatitis specialist at John Hopkins on the 14th of June.

That's the pic of this morning's bread boule.

Featured Answer

limeinqueens

7 years ago

Hey Athleen - glad to hear your husband is doing better. There are cheap water Ph testing kits sold at pet stores - they are for checking the Ph of fish tanks and measure the middle part of the scale (usually from around 6-8). For around $5, you can get a little kit that will give you 200 tests, so you can test every tap in your house separately, if it pleases you. Its easy and fun too, like SCIENCE! Looks like this

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Comments (33)

johnmerr
7 years ago
Atheen,

As you know the Meyer is especially sensitive to light change; and the leaf yellowing and drop are clearly that. Don't worry, it will produce new leaves better suited to the new light. I would remove any fruit immediately, so the tree will not put its energy into seed (fruit) production. As for the other tree that is not dropping leaves, is it also a Meyer? Most other citrus are not so sensitive as the Meyer. BTW, beautiful bread.
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked johnmerr
Laura LaRosa (7b)
7 years ago
I've had that happen to my Meyer and, like Mike said, it has recovered. I'm glad your husband is doing better. That bread looks incredible! If you have a recipe and don't mind sharing, I'd love it! I have a sourdough starter that I grew myself that is now about 3 years old. I keep it in the fridge and feed it periodically to keep it going. When I make bread, it looks a bit like that. If you ever make it this way, I can give you some if you like!
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked Laura LaRosa (7b)
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Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA
Original Author
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Good morning, John, thank you for stopping by. Yes, they are both Meyer lemon trees, which is why I'm so puzzled. The other tree doesn't seem to have any issues. Why only the small leaves, though?

.

If you're sure it's not because I overt fertilized, I can start feeding my trees again, right? Oh, and thanks, it's really good, too ;)

.

Laura, I'll try to dig my recipe. I've been doing it for so long, I barely measure anymore, lol. And yes, if I go your way we need do a bread exchange, lol. When it happened to your tree, was it also because if the light?

.

God bless,

.

Atheen
johnmerr
7 years ago
Atheen,

Well, not all plants are created equal; that is unless you have a Mayan Meyer Lemon, which are all genetically identical. Some plants are stronger, some weaker. I would continue the fertilization.
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked johnmerr
Laura LaRosa (7b)
7 years ago
Sure Atheen! Looking forward to it! I think in my case, it was a light changes...also, I think they shed older leaves to make room for new growth.
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked Laura LaRosa (7b)
BarbJP 15-16/9B CA Bay Area
7 years ago
That is a beautiful loaf!! Glad to hear Dave is doing better. Slow but sure is good.
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked BarbJP 15-16/9B CA Bay Area
myermike_1micha
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Atheen, very happy to hear Dave is better...The way he's eating, that is how I eat and I have no health issues and I am reasonably still, young and not into eating any other way. It makes a huge difference in energy and health in general. That is the way we should all eat. Less fried foods, less white starches, no processed foods,unhealthy fats, and sugars)

Your tree, if temps are stable and warm by night, then it's from a lack of a nutrient due to pH issues. I would keep up fertilization since you can fertilize as much as you want in the 5.1.1 mix. Start using vinegar and see what happens..It can't hurt)

Also watch for over watering. It can happen even in the 5.1.1 mix/

Nite
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked myermike_1micha
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA
Original Author
7 years ago
Thank you Mike. I could have sworn I posted a reply, bit it's not there and I'm too tired to figure it out. I hope I didn't post it on the wrong thread. I wanted to ask you, how much vinegar should I use per tree?

Barb, hi! :)
johnmerr
7 years ago
I'm not Mike, of course; but vinegar is used to lower the pH of the water/fertilizer you are applying; it is not amount per tree, but amount per gallon.
Laura LaRosa (7b)
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Atheen, I bought a cheap testing kit linked somewhere in this forum to test the ph of my water. After adding FP, the ph drops, then the vinegar drops it further. For my city water, I have found that 1/2 tsp of vinegar, after the FP drops the ph to about 5.5 or even a little lower (all these quantities are per gallon of water). I give that to my trees once a week.
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked Laura LaRosa (7b)
User
7 years ago
Atheen, the amount of vinegar you add depends on the pH of your water before you add anything to it, so you need to get a pH testing kit. I use one for testing the pH in fish aquariums. If your water pH is above 7, then you need to add vinegar, which will drop the pH. Your pH, after adding fertilizer and vinegar (if it is needed), should be about 6.5.

I am glad Hubby is a lot better.
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked User
myermike_1micha
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
And the other thing is this, you could call your local water provider and ask them what the pH is. Mines is 8.0 . Pretty high and it's no wonder my plants look like crap if I stop using it, especially my tropicals such as Jasmine, Gardenia, Citrus, some Hoya and Orchids. But them my sisters is 7.0 and she adds a capful per gallon. Even if it were lower, that amount would not negatively impact anything since my step father in Puerto Rico uses it anyway even though his pH is 6.7. I don't think I have ever heard of anyone having well or tap water lower than 6.5 and there is one that exists, I have yet to meet them here.)
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA
Original Author
7 years ago
I just called the city and of course couldn't get any answers, but, hey, what else is new, right? They had no clue who to transfer me to, either. I asked them to forward the call to whomever is in charge of the water, and ended up in a general voicemail box. Oh, well.

.

John, thanks for stopping by. The reason I asked, was that I water from the hose until water flows through the bottom, so I can't add it as I water nor do I know how many gallons of water I use to, well, water, LOL. I was planning on adding it to my pitcher of water+fertilizer (FP). I know it's not perfect, but that's the best I can do.

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Laura and Vladimir, hi :) Thanks to both if you for your well wishes for Dave :)). Next time I'm near a PetSmart, I'll try to see if I can find a ph tester at the aquarium section. I'll let you know what the water PH is at. I admit, I'm curious, now. ;)

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Mike, since it can't hurt, I guess I'll start adding a teaspoon of white vinegar together with my half tablespoon of FP to the quarter gallon pitcher I use to fertilize each tree (I increased the FP to half a tablespoon as per your advice from yesterday). I also put my trees on an every other day watering schedule instead of daily, starting today.

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Good bless, y'all. Thank you for the help and advice, once again. One day, I'll be to help somebody with their Meyer lemons, I promise!

.

Atheen
myermike_1micha
7 years ago
I don't know how this post need up on Lewis's thread since I know I switched to yours Atheen, but I copy and pasted it here for you)

Hi Atheen....Every other day if your mix is still moist or longer than that. You would be the best judge on your mix since day time temps and sunshine verses cool temps and cloudy days can make a huge difference on your watering schedule. Is there any way you could use your finger and push deep into your pots, preferable just outside your root balls or use a wooden dowel stick and see just how much and how fast your mix dries out?

If it is holding water towards the half way down to bottom of your pots even on these nice sunny days, I am concerned your mix was made with too many finer particles or that they gravitated towards the bottom.. Can you water and then a day later check the moisture and tell us?

Wishing Dave all the best)

Thanks ))
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked myermike_1micha
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA
Original Author
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Mike I just did the skewer thing. It's a little moist, but by no means wet. It hasn't been hot at all today and yesterday, either, around 72-75 only. Honestly, it drains so well, and so fast when I water, I think the mix is still fine. But, hey, you're the expert, so as far as I'm concerned, what you say goes, LOL.

I also think they might have needed more water last year, since they had almost no roots to suck the moisture.

Limequeen, hi! :) Thanks for stopping by. The PH kit is on my shopping list for next time I'm near a pet store, lol. I'm going to channel my inner Jamie Hyneman and pretend I'm a SCIENTIST, rofl. If you only knew how much Dave rants that the tests are "Not scientifically made" when we watch Mythbusters;). But, hey, once an engineer, always an engineer I guess ;)

I'll do the skewer thing again, tomorrow. Unless it rains, which it very well might.

Thank y'all for your continuing well wishes for Dave. It means more than you know. That man is my world, my sun and my whole universe all rolled into one.

God bless,

.

Atheen
GreenLarry
7 years ago
I hope Dave is well soon!
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked GreenLarry
hottina44
7 years ago
Johnmerr, I've got big problems w my potted Meyer lemon tree about 3&1/2 yrs. old. Went completely bald ( leaves one pinky size fruit & lots of blooms in Dec.2015, I think from temp. Change from snow cold in spa.Phila. Area. Completely bald. !! I had read about vinagar &Foliage pro added to soil. I added it every 2wks. & sprayed every day w fish emojis ion 2Xs a day. I'm 2 mo. It grew green lesves, not a full canopy or Dark green but green . I was happy as a clam !! 2 mo. After stopping vinegar w FP my trees leaves started to turn yellow & after a few weeks( about 2 mo. I had a completely bald tree agin
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA
Original Author
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Larry, thank you! :)

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Mike, I haven't forgotten about checking the moisture of the soil... if only the weather would cooperate, LOL! I need more than 24 hours without rain to do so, and when I do have 2 days of sunshine between waterings, whether manual or divine, I will skewer the crap out of that pot and tell you what I find :)

.

Whatever we are doing, though, we must be doing something right. The trees are literally BURSTING with new growth and they are both getting new buds as well. Even the little runt that had the yellow veins. I guess the capful of vinegar and the half Tablespoon of FP is just what the doctor ordered.

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Here is the big one. There are even 2 new growth straight out of the trunk!

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The runt is doing great as well, 4 new branches coming out of the trunk and the bare branches are getting repopulated :)

Other branches of the runt, as well. I'm not going to put pretty red x'es everywhere, you get the point, lol :)

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They look happy!

.

Just a question though, do I leave the trunk ones, or are they what is considered "suckers"? Thanks!

.

I hope y'all had a great week end, and that the week ahead is even better :) God bless,

.

Atheen
johnmerr
7 years ago
Atheen,

One of the reasons your trees look good now is they just got a shot of nitrogen; and citrus love nitrogen. Rainfall, especially early rains have a lot of nitrogen.
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked johnmerr
hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
7 years ago
Ok well I have been thinking I better get on this vinegar bandwagon.... I tested my water ph before foliage pro and it was about 6.5 already.... so is there any value to start the vinegar too with that PH?
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
johnmerr
7 years ago
Hobby,

No need for vinegar. If you test your water again after adding FP, I would guess it would be near 6. Adding vinegar, adds salts to your soil; when the vinegar neutralizes with a base in the soil, the result is water and salt. Who needs salt???
hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
7 years ago
Ok thank you, that's what I thought from reading other posts about it but thought I would check. I am on well water that fluctuates in levels of all sorts of stuff so I better keep an eye on it.
bmelz
7 years ago
I'm curious why nobody is recommending PH Down to bring the down the PH? I bought a fairly large bottle for cheap at the local hydroponics store. It will probably last me years. Is it just because vinegar is much more accessible?
myermike_1micha
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Atheen..LOOK AT YOUR TREES RESPONDING!! I am so happy for you! You know, you would be surprised at what vinegar and fresh rains can do for my trees.. I am getting HUGE amounts of green growth and the vivid color of the trees is just exciting. I had a huge downpour last night and this morning, all my trees looks so beautiful lit up by the sunshine....

Hobby, if you water is reading that low, then vinegar is not needed although if they were my trees, I would give a heck of a lot more fertilizer...I would also scratch in some slow release and start spraying down your trees with Fish Emulsion diluted in water. I use a spray bottle end attachment at the end of my hose.

Bmelz, good question...I don't know if it does the same. I would be curious to know if anyone else knows.
BarbJP 15-16/9B CA Bay Area
7 years ago
Bmelz I would guess price. PH Down is on Amazon $10 for 8 oz. I can buy white vinegar at $4 for two gallons. And I can use the rest for many different things like laundry additive or cleaning or pickling. And yep, it's much easier to get a hold of.

PH Down is phosphoric acid, same thing as the P in NPK, fyi.
hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
7 years ago
Ok now this is intriguing, why would I need more fertilizer then Mike? I do have osmocote plus mixed into my 5-1-1 plus I water with foliage pro about once a week. Fairly weakly I would think. Thank you!
hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
7 years ago
I think I have fish emulsion too, why specifically that?
hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
7 years ago
Athene your boule looks amazing!! Here is my sourdough "everyday loaf".
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
Laura LaRosa (7b)
7 years ago
Hobby, do you have a starter also??
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA
Original Author
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
Tee hee, thanks! Your loaf looks awesome! Here is a pic of my everyday white bread loaf ;)

And what the hell, that post is so derailed at this point (LOL), while we're at it, here is a picture I took a while ago, I wanted to surprise Dave with genuine brioche for breakfast:

(I had to test one before I fed it to my husband, now, didn't I?)

And here is a picture of the crumb of my country boule. (Fellow bakers will understand that pic, lol:)

.

.

Damn, now I've done it and made myself hungry, lol.

.

Atheen
hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
7 years ago
Wow I could really go for one of those right now, those all look amazing! Mm brioche now that is a great idea.

The crumb looks pretty darn perfect, I am still working on my artisan loaves, I can nail some good ones but consistency continues to be a problem. The trees are looking great as well lol! Sorry to take off on a tangent.

Yep Laura I have had a starter for about 3 years, you too right? Another conincidence :). Do you see my colored eggs on the counter in the back of the picture too?
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked hobbyartisan (Saskatoon, SK Canada, 2b)
Laura LaRosa (7b)
7 years ago
Atheen, your baking looks amazing! Hobby, amazing....yes, another coincidence and my starter is about 3 also!!! We need to meet someday!!
Atheen - 7a - in Maryland, USA thanked Laura LaRosa (7b)