so i guess i should go with a syringe or pipette type instrument then, and make sure im shaking up the nutrients in the bottle before mixing. a digital pH meter probly wouldnt be too bad either, compared to basic pH reagent /color coding kit. although they seem finicky and require lots of care- which sort of foils my plans for quick fertigation routine. as for the process of mixing, i typically will make a 5 gal batch by filling with 4 gals of water or so, then adding FP, then ProTekt, then vinegar. i "stir" with a blast from the hose to mix things around and top off to 5 gals. for irrigation its just protekt then vinegar. i add nutrients according to my "typical" mix ratio, then measure, and adjust as necessary.

There's a lot of things wrong with that copy/paste from a fertilizer company that was just posted...and some things right. For the most part a plant does not know the difference between an organic or chemical fertilizer. The pathways for nutrient exchange do not care about the compounds that created the nutrient. NO3 is NO3...NH4 is NH4...and by the time it gets to the plant and it's uptake filtering...it's just N+. It is true that the compounds that create the nutrients do effect the soil, though. Excessive sodium based nutrients will de-aggregate soil, but you'd need a lot of additions without much water moving it out of the soil...this isn't an issue for many people's soil, but it is a concern (especially when used a lot, and very especially when used a lot in arid areas) to people with saline or sodic soil. Soil additions must be chosen and used correctly or it will negatively effect how nutrients move through the soil. If you dump a bunch of uncomposted organic matter in your soil, the microorganisms will tie up N and, depending on the material, release undesired tanins and phenols in the soil effecting both the soil chemistry and the nutrient availability. If you dump a bunch of chemical ammonium sulfate (21-0-0) in your soil and water it in, the N in it is available so quickly you can saturate your soil with N and at the same time spiking your pH low until the soil buffers itself...which greatly effects nutrient availability via pH and N saturation. Anything you add to the soil will effect how it "works" but there are ways to do it right without a detrimental effect on balance while adding what you need. Proper use of composted (or top-applied uncomposted) organic matter and proper use of ammonium sulfate lead to no bad issues if it's what your soil needs. Use any addition wisely...and don't ever use ammonium sulfate on acid soils unless you want to further lower your pH...I just used this as an example. "Minerals are transferred via “colloidal humus particles” found in healthy soil." Humus is only part of the equation...the mineral (non-humus/non-organic) part of the soil is as important (or more important, some would argue) since it doesn't degrade and actually holds exchangeable charges/nutrients for a much longer period of time than humus/organic fractions of the soil. Most people suggest you don't have more than 5-7% organic fraction in your soil to begin with. The mineral part of your soil, especially clay, holds a LOT of nutrient charge and practically acts as a battery keeping the nutrients available for exchange when chemical fertilizers are added or humus is being degraded by microorganisms. "Compounding the problem of not providing trace elements, chemical fertilizers also prevent the plant from absorbing them from the soil." ...this is total b/s. Also, the "flavor and nutrition" parts of the claims range from highly debatable to suspect...especially the flavor part of it. Vitamin C, Iron, Mg, and a few (mostly flavorless, but somewhat astringent on whole) anthocyanins compounds have been found in higher concentrations in organic grown food...aside from that, there's not a lot going on except marginal gains/losses compared to each other. This post was edited by nc-crn on Sun, Jun 30, 13 at 13:20

strawberry hill, your post is so interesting. I've never tested my soil but knowing that it's basically decomposed granite (in some places solid granite just 1 1/2 feet down) is a good clue. Growing the right roses for your area, as has been emphasized on this forum over and over, is in my opinion the most important lesson to learn. Having once chosen the right ones, there are still steps that can be taken, as you point out, to fine-tune the results. A lot depends on how much you can or are willing to do. I've found that coffee grounds from my husband's coffee consumption, alfalfa meal and adequate water are the simplest way for me to have good-looking roses. Judicious pruning also has its place. Poisons never will; I'd give up roses first. It's part art, part science and part the will of the roses to live and thrive. It's a little different for everyone, and it is endlessly fascinating. Ingrid

Thanks or the update Patty! Josh (greeman28) was saying I should consult you for advice so I'm glad you did the favor of responding to my post. I have read most of the cultivation forums over on the citrus forums by Jodi, Al, Mike, Josh, etc etc (really probably more extensive research than I should have, lots of reading lol) and am very familiar with what Foliage Pro is but unfortunately it is not sold here on my island. I would have to ship it in internationally which would be expensive so I have been trying to focus on using what is available locally. I think I do remember reading that urea requires soil microbes to break it down before it is available to the plant? If so I can see why that would pose a difficulty in containers, especially how most of mine are 1-2 gallons and not large enough to support any decent microbial activity. I'm very familiar with Osmocote Plus as well, and it does seem like a great CRF. My only issue with it is that it is incredibly expensive over here (something like $10/lb) whereas the Sunniland 6-4-6 was less than $20 for 40 lbs. I will apply the 6-4-6 to my in-ground plants then (no citrus but a few Sapodillas, Mangoes, many Bananas, some Coconuts, an Avocado and a Spondias mombin, known locally as 'Hog Plum' but more well-known as either Yellow Mombin, Java Plum or Ashanti Plum). If the issue with the urea is salt build up in containers, could I still use it in them and just water/flush regularly to leach any excess salt out? It does have some nutritional value that I assume would be available in containers (contains phosphate and potash, and some ammoniacal nitrogen and various micros). Also, I've been wondering how much my irrigation water has to do with how my container plants update nutrients. I tested it using phenol red solution (6.8-8.2) and it tested out as 8.2+, which is believable as our water is pumped from 100% limestone aquifiers and presumably contains lots of dissolved Ca and Mg (which is why I don't look for those in my fertilizers). However, I used the same phenol red (came with my dad's pool test kit) to determine the right amount of 3.3% sulfuric acid to use to lower the pH to 5. I think I used the pool kit incorrectly, as when searching online I found out phenol red only shows pH over a range of 6.8 to 8.2 (which suggests my irrigation water could be higher than 8.2) so I did not get a true 5 reading. If I may ask what do you use to test your water pH? I went to a local hardware store but they only had other pool kits, which usually do not test for "low" pH around 4 and 5.