Pie Crust Problem
10 years ago
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Falling pie crusts
Comments (20)She specifically said to :Freeze the crust it for at least a half hour, until chilled. This is an important step in pre-baking. Otherwise the crust will slip down the sides. But that is not correct. Azzalea and the others have it right. Why does crust fall down? Several reasons. First, the butter that was stiff from being chilled or frozen, becomes soft and starts to melt. Take a stick of wrapped butter out of the freezer and hold it up. Set it on a hot windowsill for about 30 minutes and see what happens. It will slide out of the wrapper and down your hand. That's what happens in the oven. Whether you chill first or not, once you start cooking the butter will get hot. Then there's the water evaporation. As water evaporates, the dry ingredients shrink together. That's the principle behind drywall mud that they use for taping your drywall. And then there's the issue of the proteins in the flour that you've stretched out. If there's any stretch or tension left in the dough, it will pull itself together. So you need to roll the dough out a lot bigger than your pan and then kind of work your way around and let it get as tight as it wants to before putting it in the pan. Once it's in, make sure you haven't stretched it, but help it relax again. Then, when the butter starts melting and the water evaporating, the proteins won't tighten up and pull the dough back. Also, you might want to figure a way to "hook" it over the lip of the pan. If you have a beautiful rim, that may be difficult, but you can kind of mush it down ever so slightly so it won't pull back. And then the weights and things will keep it from puffing up too much. Where this is a big issue isn't so much with pie crusts, as those are fairly easy to keep from shrinking, but in those French tart pans with straight sides. It's next to impossible to keep dough from sliding straight down....See MoreCalling all Pie Crust Experts?
Comments (24)A quick Pie Story: I may have told it before. But what the H3ll, I'm older than you all and allowed to do that. My MIL always tried to emphasize being carefull with the Gas Range, washing machines , etc. That was to my wife when she was growing up. Well when we were married about two weeks, I was coming home to my 2 nd floor apt. and my wife came running down the stairs, stopping me from going up to the apt. She said " don't go up there !!!" The oven is ready to explode. I went up to see what the problem was and heard a strange noise from the oven. Poof!!! poop!! Poof !!! Plop !!! I opened it, not knowing what to expect??? Here were two Apple pies Poofing away, she didn't make any slits in the top and the Whole Crust was lifting up and down and Poofing, Ploping away Her mother always warned her about the Oven exploding. At that time you had to light the oven with a match at a small hole in the oven bottom. If you turned on the gas and waited too long, there would be a BOOM!!! This was just one story of the many stories in Lou's " Life with my Wife "" I should have written a book. Like many other Recipe's , Most of the Pie Crust recipe's are about the same . I have had, and made, the one with Baking Powder added and it seemed to make a difference. How it is handled makes the biggest difference. LISA : Try rolling it up on your Grandmother's Macaroni stick not the Rolling Pin and then roll it out over the Pie dish. In the Army the pies were about 16 X 20. Think you can do one of those ? Keep practicing , when it don't work, roll it into a ball and throw it at your DH. Then he will give you the Wooden Spoon treatment. You will learn fast!!! PS : I don't believe you dipped bread in the gravy on Sunday morning. My Grandmother had about 25 notches on her spoon. They matched the Knots on my head. Lou...See MorePie Crust - What am I doing wrong?
Comments (33)Lard has a larger fat crystal than other fats, which is one reason it works so well in pastry. Butter gives great flavor but has a lot of water in it and it melts quickly. The combination of lard and butter in pastry is a great twosome. When I use coconut oil (frozen and grated on the large hole on my box grater), I can reduce the amount of fat by about 25 percent, especially when using pastry flour or milling soft wheat or low-gluten spelt into flour to use for pastry. Good pastry is a combination of tenderness and flakiness and each characteristic is developed differently. Pastry is all about reducing the gluten development in the flour, so choose flour (pastry flour or Southern All-Purpose flours like Martha White, White Lily, Gladiola, Red Band) that has a low protein/gluten content to begin with as a great way to reduce gluten-development up front. If you want more tender pastry while using all-purpose flour you can add a little more fat and add an acid ingredient. Divide the cold fat in two portions and mix one half in the flour until it's very finely mixed. This will coat the flour so it develops the gluten in short strands (hence short-crust pastry) when the liquid is mixed in and will give a tender crust. Quickly add the remaining fat and keep it in larger blobs. When the heat of the oven melts the blobs of fat the steam will raise those layers in the pastry we recognize as a flaky pastry. Vinegar in a recipe is another way to decrease the gluten-development. Adding an acid brings one more tenderizer into play. "Acids soften gluten, breaking apart gluten strands and keeping the pastry tender." When eggs are used in a pastry recipe it is best used for something like a meat pie. The protein from the egg will reinforce the structure of the pastry, making it strong enough to hold a hefty filling. When liquid vegetable oil is used to make pastry it is considered a "warm fat", which coats each particle of flour so completely than no gluten develops. Oil pastries are very tender and tend to be more mealy than flaky since you don't have steam raising those flaky layers. Oil pastry is generally easier to handle and is easy to roll between two sheets of waxed paper. It's neither right or wrong what type of pastry you make - it's just one of those cooking/baking choices we make - BUT - as a general rule of thumb don't take an oil pastry to the fair because it will tend to get judged down because they rarely come up to judging standards. If a sticky dough that is hard to roll-out is your problem, you have too much gluten developed - probably from adding too much liquid and/or using flour that has a high protein content. Northern all-purpose flours like King Arthur and Robin Hood really don't make good pastry because of the high amount of protein. Add as little water as possible!!! As soon as lumps of dough stick together during mixing, stop mixing and adding water. It takes very little extra water, as little as 1/2 teaspoon, to quickly toughen the dough. -Grainlady...See MorePie crust question
Comments (40)I like parchment best because it can be folded up easily to transfer the crust and with a little flour the crust won't stick. This is probably redundant, but to make great pie crusts, just make more! In other words, practice! Then you will know the deep, dark secrets of the pie world. The reason cooks like the vodka recipe is because it is so forgiving. With butter/shortening crusts, the dough Must be kept cold at all times. When the dough starts to even get close to room temp., I slide a cookie sheet under the parchment and pop the whole mess in the freezer. As I cut out leaves, or whatever decoration I want on top of the pie, they go on a plate to be popped in the freezer immediately. The cold, cold, cold thing can't be underemphasised with regular pie dough (butter, shortening or lard) Cracks are ok, warm is not. With the addition of the vodka, however, something magical takes place. the dough can be rolled out a little warmer, it becomes like play dough, and has no cracks. It is satisfying and easy to work with. But when cooked, the vodka evaporates and creates those beautiful layers and flakiness. If you used regular pie crust and rolled it out warm, you would get leather. All that said, I still am obsessed with keeping pie dough cold. Very cold. Cracks can be turned under for the crust. I always make about 3 times more dough than the recipe calls for, I want lots of wiggle room. The dough can be frozen anyway so it doesn't go to waste. (make a disc, wrap in lots of plastic and a freezer bag) However, I experienced the real beauty of the vodka dough one day when I let the dough get crazy warm. I was sure the crust was ruined. But it turned out great! Flaky, and just as perfect as using stiff, cold dough....See More- 10 years ago
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