So they finally refunded my money after seven weeks, three emails, and four phone calls. For those who want to defend Rogue Valley Roses - (1) The reason I describe RVR as "under new management" is, the not very polite man I spoke with told me, during the first of my four phone calls, that "the owner had fired everyone and put in new management" and, according to him, that was why they hadn't responded to any of the emails I had sent them. (2) If you are personally acquainted with the owner and have reason to sympathize with the owner's problems, that's fine. If you have had a recent good experience with RVR, that's fine. But, in the real world, those of us who deal with internet businesses need accurate information on whether they can expect a good experience and this means that individuals should post accurate accounts of their own experiences. My experience with RVR between February and May 2017 (typo corrected, this originally said 2015 causing confusion infra) has been absolutely horrible and I strongly recommend against dealing with them until they get their management issues straightened out.

Bill, Bart, Catsrose, Sherry, Pam, Auntlavender, Kippy, Jerome, I'm glad you all liked this, and that you wrote to say so. Communication is precious! Bill, so are poems, the spring water of the soul. Bart, beetles have been pretty bad here, but not as awful as last spring; the "cetonielle" (smaller black ones with white dots) are somewhat fewer, but the population of "cetonie" (green-gold and bigger) seems to have grown. This spring has turned out a lot better than a person would have thought, hasn't it? Some of my Gallicas in particular have had big full blooms such as come only during a good season. About the once-blooming roses, my guess is that you can grow them. Do apples and cherries grow in your area? Tulips and daffodils? All these need winter chill. Here we had some extremely warm winters back around 2005-06, I believe it was, and I worried that there weren't enough chill hours for the plants that needed them, but everything bloomed just fine. I have the highest opinion of these roses, and find they're perfectly suited to my climate, and I suspect to yours as well. Perhaps I should add that a really hot dry spot doesn't suit most of them...well, perhaps the Albas and the Damasks. Funny, I feel guilty when I sit down and just enjoy the sight of my garden, but isn't that what it's there for? Hear, hear, Catsrose. Definitely keep on being proud of your garden and enjoy your visitors' enjoyment. Sherry, I don't draw well, my little sketches grow out of determination and nothing more, though I do enjoy the manuality of them. I need to learn to use a camera. I admire the many examples of good photography I see here and am aware it would be a hugely useful tool for me, but I haven't applied myself to the task of learning. Pam, your rose season sounds wonderful, and a most well-deserved payment for your labors. I think it's marvelous that you offer so many people the memorable experience of being in your garden. Kippy, I bet you already know that you're never done. But it sounds like you're getting close to a kind of gardening that's less chores and more play and enjoyment and experimentation. Jerome, I read Thomas's book early on in my rose growing career and agree that it's a book that promotes dreams. I still have it on my shelf. The sobriety of his style makes it all the more effective in communicating his love for these rare, lost roses and in describing their charm. Did you ever look into the Hybrid Chinas? These are--I read--once-blooming crosses between China and once-flowering old roses that look a lot like their once-blooming parents but are more tolerant of lack of winter chill. I'm getting this from the Vintage Rose Book. The Hybrid Chinas include highly desirable varieties like 'Duchesse d'Angouleme', 'Hippolyte', and 'Juno', all of them having to my eyes a convincing old rose air. If you're interested you could inquire on the forum and see what gardeners who have conditions similar to yours have to say about them. Melissa

Re gardens dying when the gardeners die or leave...I am really lucky in that respect. I am the fourth generation of gardeners of one family to garden at our house. It is not a large place - just a 1/3 acre city lot, but I really enjoy knowing the history of the garden, and have been trying to save & clone all of the old rose cultivars I can that have been here for decades, no matter what class they are. We have old photos of the house & garden going back to 1905. In some instances, I am very glad certain plants did not survive - thank heavens they got rid of that squat, ugly huge palm tree that was in the middle of the front garden in 1925! When we moved in 20 years ago, my father-in-law, who grew up here and was the third generation gardener, was thrilled that I was interested. He took me all over the garden and told me what each plant was (he was working in his retirement as a landscape gardener at that time), and who had planted it. As for future plans, lately I seem to be focusing on rooting roses from my garden in order to spread them around the neighborhood, or plant them in more appropriate places in my garden, to make sure they survive. I have also been walking around our neighborhood and taking cuttings from lovely old roses, some of which are in gardens that are destined to be turned into condo developments, etc. I got new plants from very old cultivars of Belle Portugaise, Crimson Glory, and Niles Cochet that way, as well as a mystery ever blooming yellow rose with miniature flowers on a bush that gets about 3 feet high (the old parent bush was 6-7 feet high in shade, with a huge old trunk). Today I just saw some roots in the rooting bag of a sort of medium pink "cabbage rose" with very large fragrant blooms that came from cuttings of a rose 2 blocks from my house. It is growing in shade there, but the owner said that she remembered that when there was more sun 30 years ago, it rebloomed - I will have to put it in a big pot in the sun and see what happens. Another fun thing that has happened - since I started gardening here 20 years ago, and took care of the roses out by the street, and planted lots more out there, several of my neighbors have also started planting roses & other flowers out by the street in front of their houses. This area has lots of Victorian & Craftsman houses, but when we moved here lots of them were not cared for. Now they have all been fixed up, and many more folks are gardening - it is catching! Jackie

This is all very new to me. I've never heard of Palantine Roses before now. So I must ask, why do you all have to order at a particular time? Are they no longer available after this date? Or do they run out of the most popular quickly? Is there a cut off date for ordering? Surely they don't ship them out now? Do you pay for them now and anxiously await for them to show up on your doorstep the first day of spring? Sorry for so many questions but you all seem to know more than any other place I've looked at that talks about roses and growing them. First off I need to know where to buy them. I'm not a big fan of Lowe's bare root roses. They seem to struggle to grow. Anyway, thanks for your time. ~ Annie