Hi Bill, Just wanted to report back after my visit to UF at Gainesville. First off, I wanted to say there was a very large slope by a building that had a huge area of the asiatic jasmine. It was in full sun and looked great. The only thing I noticed that was not that great was that the area was so wide it could not be reached for maintenance from either side. Therefore, the long strands were visible in the central, unreachable portion, and it looked a little unkempt. So, I guess the moral of that story is to make sure it can be reached by a weedwhacker and an edger from both sides if you want to achieve a neat and tidy appearance. A ground cover I had not thought of is dwarf Indian Hawthorne. I saw it in so many places in full sun, no care and it looked great. Although when I looked it up it said it got to 3-6 feet, I didn't see any that were higher than about two. Maybe there are newer types. Most seemed to be lower than that. I have a friend who has it here in Sarasota, and hers is about two foot. I know she doesn't prune it or do anything to it and it always looks great and blooms in the spring. I know it is higher than your criteria, but I saw so much of it that looked good, that I thought it would be worth mentioning. I will mention another, although again, it probably doesn't meet your criteria. Wart fern as a ground cover is beautiful and carefree, maybe a foot tall or a tiny more. However, I think it does best in partial shade. I am experimenting with it this year in my garden and it is doing well and starting to spread a bit in half day sun. However, it gets late morning, early afternoon, hot direct sun. Shaded in morning and late afternoon. I have to tell you where I am coming from. I know you are looking for visibility from the street. My DH and I are the opposite. We frequently are in the garden in our pajamas, or, in his case, a lot less! It is essential to us that we have as much privacy as possible from the street as well as all our neighbors. The first thing we did with our landcaping when we moved here (even before) was start screening in a big way. I can report that he is now able to shower outside or skinny dip in the pool after yardwork as needed. Feeling like I'm outdoors most of the day is almost essential to me. Our home has many very large windows and no window treatments! This also makes it essential to have great screening from all angles. Although I've got to say I really don't care much if someone wants to see an old lady in her pajamas through the windows at night. Although we like our yard to look nice from the street, we absolutely have to have it look nice when we look out. My viewpoint from the inside is what I work on all the time. I just wanted to mention that I saw so many lovely, lovely vitex in bloom at UF. There were groupings with firebush (the yellow, shorter type) and coonties that were just stunning. However, some of the vitex reached 10 feet or so. A plant I had forgotten about that I absolutely love is oakleaf hydrangea. It was not in bloom, but the foliage is so lovely on its own. I didn't know thryallis did so well up there. Crinums and European Fan Palms were absolutely beautiful. I really like that picture #7. It is lovely and sort of what I had envisioned with the sabals, coontie, palms, etc. However, having had experience with saw palmetto, I would never plant it unless I knew it was going to be a permanent planting (although I love its look). We had a lot at another property, and tried to dig up some of it to plant something else. It involves a bobcat or backhoe. Definitely not a drainfield candidate, I don't think. I love the silvery one like in the picture, though. Well, that's all I've got. Good luck, and whatever you do, let us know. I also love sunworshiper's fountain idea, or even a hardscape with an umbrella, a table and chair for an afternoon beverage. Have fun! Anna

I am just reading through this thread today. I have to agree with Moccassinlanding and BeverlyMN and that is to try it in a pot. Here are my reasons: (1) you mentioned "6 maples" and bad soil. Well I have maple trees in my backyard too but have amended my soil so it's not bad, but the tree roots are probably entangled in your hosta roots and your S&S is never going to get much better. The roots from my maples and my cedars have "strangled" my plants and made them decrease in size rather than increase. It has made me very sad to see my plants decline. (2) if the soil in your vegetable patch has less root competition, then I think your S&S would do way better than in the location it is now. You would have to keep in mind that S&S grows very large and will get more difficult to move, so you would want to make a decision about its location while it is managable in size. (3) Because of root competition, I began trying plants (mainly hostas) in pots. Wow, what a difference! The growth of the plants in my pots has been wonderful. To begin growing in pots, I purchased soil in bags especially made for container gardening. That worked very well. But now I still do use those bags, but I add small bark fines or nuggets to it to help increase drainage and aeration. I think if you put your S&S in a pot, you just might be amazed at the growth it will put out. That is exactly what happened to me. I divided one of my hostas in half and potted the one half. I planted it in the soil I mentioned above and placed it in more sun. That hosta grew so well, and looked so beautiful, it started my hosta addiction. And now most of my hostas are in pots and I can enjoy seeing my plants thrive. And that makes me very happy. If you do decide to move your S&S, have a look at the roots you see. Hosta roots are white. Cedar roots are reddish. Maple roots are dark. Here is a photo of a hosta I rescued from maple tree roots. (If you would like to speak to me, you can email me directly. We may not live that far away from each other.)

there is a plant propogation book i have wherein the author describes his own mist system. that author has a large black coil of hose in the roof of his greenhouse so that water can be heated before reaching the mist nozzles. that's at least one vote for using warm water and keeping the cuttings reasonably warm as they root. just thought i would toss that in! lol. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: mosaic z8 LA (My Page) on Sun, May 11, 03 at 11:59 With such a setup you could probably root roses under mist all winter here in Louisiana. And then as an added bonus, you could save on your power bills all summer by using it to steam your veggies :) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: tammyinwv z6/WV (My Page) on Sun, May 11, 03 at 16:05 i have been unable to find the mist heads even within an hr from my home.Someone mentioned here they found them for .50 each.would anyone be willing to get me a couple and mail them? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: wild_garden virginia z6b (My Page) on Sun, May 11, 03 at 16:32 at my lowes store the mist heads where in the indoor gardening area next to the register, i doubt the people at lowes would have even know what to look for. it was with the drip irrigation supplies, as i said in the indoor gardening area next to the big outdoor area where they sell trees and things. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mist heads supply source Posted by: RoseHawke 7b AL (My Page) on Mon, May 12, 03 at 10:37 For you folks that haven't been able to find the heads locally, try going to this site: Dripworks or here's a direct link to one of the pages with some heads:Misters . I just a couple of weeks ago ordered some irrigation supplies from them and received them quite quickly. About 4 days if I remember correctly. Haven't had a chance to put it together yet, which is probably just as well as the flood we had last week would've probably washed everything down the creek ;-). I also have the Melnor timer, and it does seem a bit confusing about its ability to do a mist cycle, but what you're doing is programing it to do one cycle (on in the am; off in the pm) and punching in a choice of watering pattern, in this case the off for 10" on for 2" pattern. I believe the idea behind the pattern was/is actually to help prevent water run-off when doing overhead watering by allowing the water to soak in between the on phases. I bought this particular timer though because when I looked at it my mind said "Ah! Mist!" (heh), even though the reason I bought it at the time was to keep a new patch of zoysia sod watered until it rooted in. My batteries did last all season last year, but it was only opening that valve 4x a day for 3 weeks, and then 1x every 4 days for a couple of months. I can see where a misting pattern of opening and closing that valve many times during the day may eat batteries, but as ShamanSherpa pointed out, it's still cheaper than a $100+ misting timer! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: patclem z7 (or 6) TN (My Page) on Fri, May 23, 03 at 8:32 Regardless of how much water it wastes, etc, I decided to experiment with misting. I am TERRIBLE at rooting cuttings. I've tried baggies. I've tried jars. I've tried special cutting trays with plastic domes. I've had one rooted cutting out of probably 50. I had the same problem finding true super-fine mist systems in the south. None at Lowe's, none at HD. They're not popular here because they don't have the same evaporating effect they have in less humid areas of the country - they make you wet here. Here's where I found mist heads. They didn't charge me anything for shipping. They were super-good to deal with online. Web Page - Phone/Fax 888-693-0578 Local/Fax (719) 495-2266 Qty: 4; Sku: 6W401; Product: Monarch Misting Nozzles M-1; Amount: $7.40 Qty: 4; Sku: 6W519; Product: Reducing Tee for Monarch Misting Nozzles; Amount: $4.40 You have to go to Lowe's or local hardware store and get a hose adapter, timers, 1/2" PVC, PVC caps, etc. I have mine set up with 2 mist heads, and about a 6' diameter section of my grass is soaked! I don't have mine on a timer yet. Results? I don't have any yet, except none of my cuttings have turned black yet. PS - I AM NOT AFFILIATED WITH THIS BUSINESS IN ANY WAY! Here is a link that might be useful: Mist Heads -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: fuselighter 7/WA (My Page) on Thu, May 29, 03 at 21:41 I am so excited about the misting bed. I went out and bought all the supplies today. Total cost was about $15 (my husband had PVC and elbows left over from installing the sprinkler system). I would like to go to an intermittent system eventually, but for now I am going with continuous. The water bill is not an issue because we have an irrigation system (there is an annual fee but it is not based on usage). I set the whole thing up in about an hour. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: debbinard Z4CO (My Page) on Sun, Jun 1, 03 at 10:54 Shamansherpa -- I could not open your picture! I live in Colorado, it gets very warm middle of June (up to upper 90's) and stays low humidity. We are on outsidewater restrictions 2xweek, so I'm not sure this method would fly. Am wondering how visible this is, or if inside is an option under lights. At any rate, I would like to propigate some rose cuttings now (is this a good time?) My daughter in law is moving and would love some plants from a rose with sentimental value. Is the rooting hormone used just the usual or special for roses? Thanks Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: mytrid Zone8b Florida (My Page) on Sun, Jun 1, 03 at 13:48 Deb, Maybe you could call your water extention office and see if you can get special permission, exsplain to them how little water it uses. Yes you use rooting hormone, there are many available. Dip and grow I here is supposed to be really good. I got some of the more exspensive stuff from a friend whom bought it threw rose imporium on line. But you can always use something like dip and grow. Deanna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: rose_enthusiast z7 TX. (My Page) on Sun, Jun 1, 03 at 15:47 Hi there Deanna! It seems to me you've managed to help a lot of people with your invaluable info. And I would like to thank you for inspiring me to start a misting bed to root my cuttings. I have one question to add to the many others you've been getting though... What rose company is it that you get your rooting hormone from? Is it Rose Emporium or the Antique Rose Emporium? I would like to purchase this product as well, since you and this company are using this to successfully root your cuttings. Thanks Again, Carlos -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: mytrid Zone8b Florida (My Page) on Tue, Jun 3, 03 at 1:31 Carlos, Thank you but we should all thank AngieAnders, she is the one who did all the research and work to discover this method and then post it here for us last year! She truly diserves all the credit. I just wanted to keep any new people aware that have just started rooting this year. Best of luck all and don't forget to post your sucess! Deanna -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: epiphany z5b PA (My Page) on Tue, Jun 3, 03 at 9:28 I found the Arizona Mist system which is by Orbit as mentioned at Wal-Mart. It has 12' of tubing, end cap, six misting heads and hose adapter for $14.95. Of course, it is once again cold and wet here,......all of a balmy 56°. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posted by: auntnana 6 TN (My Page) on Thu, Jun 5, 03 at 13:06 I ordered the misting heads mentioned above from Dripworks last year and they don't put out a fine mist as much as they do a fine spray/droplets. And even though I had a pressure regulator on there, I kept having a problem with the heads blowing off! (Their drippers work perfectly by the way so it's nothing against the company) I ordered foggers from Misty Mate this year and they put out a super fine fog. Perfect for propagation. They are a litte more expensive than the ones from Dripworks but worth it. And if you ask they will ship the misting heads for $1.50. I went to HD and bought a 10-24 tap and drill set (3.00) and drilled holes in my 1/2" cvpvc and the heads just screwed right in! I bought a Melnor timer at HD for $39 and it has 1 minute spray options so I've got it set for 1 minute every 10 minutes. Can't remember the model number but it's not the one on the HD website. I hope to finish my new propagation box soon. I built one on a stand this year so I can move it around easily. Wouldn't you know, HD has plastic sheeting made just for greenhouses that I used! It's not the real thick heavy stuff either. It's only 4mil and is crystal clear see-thru! Hopefully I'll be finished this week!

A picture is worth a thousand words, HU-659273525. But I'm glad your tree is doing well for you. They are one of my favorite BLEs although mine in zone 7a has been almost killed to the ground before and surely will be again someday, it came roaring back to life. I haven't seen any drunk birds yet, and in fact they seem to avoid mine. [Haha I now spot a mistake on that thread. The huge cyclamen blooming in September in Rye had to be something like C. graecum, not C. coum. Although now I seem to recall having a sidebar convo with someone on GOTE and finding out those cyclamen were some brobdingnagian hybrids that had just been introduced to the UK market, bred to make plants that looked a bit like C. persicum hybrids but were hardy enough for milder parts of NW Europe. Totally forget the name now, and I googled at the time to find they hadn't been brought to this side of the pond yet, as is so often the case. I'm still waiting for Clematis X 'Advent Bells', whose hybrid vigor might give it a better chance fighting my winters]