If Munstead Wood stays dark most of the time, it would be great, but I have never seen it in real life, so I don't know how good a rose it is--although the description looks very promising. I did a quick google search--several bloggers mentioned that it is lighter during the summer--more pink in it, in other words. It could still be combined with Double Pink KO, but there would be less contrast and the overall effect would be "louder"--which isn't necessarily bad--think of Pappu's famous pics from a couple years ago--that was one loud, beautiful garden. It depends on how comfortable you feel with "loud." If you go with Munstead Wood, I would tone it down a bit by alternating MW with a white bloomer--like I said above, either Green Ice (lots of nice green foliage when it is between bloom cycles) or Gourmet Popcorn (good bloomer). That would give more contrast, but "neutralize" the overall effect to some degree. And in the cooler spring and fall when MW is darker, the white would keep the darker color from receding too much into the background--one of the problems with darker colors on a back fence. I guess by dark wine red, what I really had in mind was mums--they come in some gorgeous shades. How do they grow in MI? They bloom for a long time here in September and October. The alternating plants (Green Ice, let's say) would bloom in the spring and summer. I often like to stagger the bloom times of my garden clusters, but then I also like the bigger splash of everything blooming at one time. Here's a wild idea. My garden center was selling BLACK petunias this year. Get about 3-4 containers of them spread out at the feet of the KOs, and alternate with the Green Ices. That would be really cool. In the spring (before petunias can handle the cold), I'd probably plant a bunch of the darkest pansies I could find. They come a red or purple so dark that they almost look black. For that matter, if it doesn't get too hot during your summers and the pansies can survive therefore your summers (they burn up in July here in Kansas), just go with dark pansie in 3-4 containers alternating with something white like Green Ice. (Yeah--I keep insisting on that white, don't I! : ) ). Or if you really want all roses, conduct that annual search for the blackest rose possible. Good luck. Let us know what you come up with. Interesting project. Kate

I would second what Ibanez says. Many people try to grow Knockout in the shade--but then complain that it doesn't bloom much or that it gets blackspot (the usual results when people try to grow roses in too much shade). Roses are sun-lovers. And in my experience, Nikko Blue benefits more from shade than almost any other hydrangea I have ever grown. It might not be a noticeable problem now, but as the season wears on, I think you might find that one or the other plant is getting far too much sun or shade (depending on where you planted them). I'd move Knockout into the sun now before it gets those big roots--that thorny rose is hard to move once it settles in. But colorwise, I can see why you liked the two together. Kate

In my border "Knock Outs" on the back for screening purpose with about 5-6 ft distance. They are 3 years old, every year I cut them back to 2-3 ft high to the ground, they reach 6x6 by the end of summer. In front of the border I planted "Blushing Knock Out"s, mixed with perennial such as salvia, daylilies, irises, lavender + some low growing annuals in white, yellow and blue tones. This border is about 45 foot long by 8-12 ft wide runs along my driveway. I do not have water source near by, so the plants receive only occasional watering + rain. Despite that they thrive and bloom non-stop. As it seems you have limited space I would just mix "Pink Knock Out"s and "Knock Out"s , as they have similar size and form, in one row + plant some lower growing perennials and annuals in front of the row. You can add "Happy Returns" lilies , they look good together. If you plan roses 3-4 ft apart they will form solid hedge probably in 4-5 years. In you zone you should not have much of winter kill. I am about 200 miles south of you, my "KO" do not suffer from winter at all. I also would advise you reasonably priced, quality sours for "Knock Outs" mail Order nursery from Texas "Chamblee's Roses" . They are absolutely wonderful, knowledgeable people. Their roses are under 10 dollars and they charge actual shipping. Over 60% Roses in my garden came from them, all of them doing great; e-mail me if you have more questions about roses. My e-mail is northjackson@consolidated.net Here is a link that might be useful: chamblee's

If you want a big statement plant somewhere along the strip, you could try Darlow's Enigma. He makes a nice architectural statement, and I've never in my life deadheaded him. Wouldn't know how to get close enough without serious bloodletting, and he never needs it. I don't think he sets noticeable hips, and he blooms more or less around the clock. I also rarely if ever prune him, maybe a little tip trimming if I feel like it, but he mostly drops off nonfunctional twigs at the ends of branches without much help from me. I agree that Bonica is mostly self cleaning, or at least doesn't look ratty if I don't clean, and Marie Daly is similar. Several of the Easy Elegance roses do fine without any deadheading from me at all, and they're both winter hardy and pretty continual blooming. Little Mischief is short and wide dark pink, Yellow Brick Road is tall and slim, Kashmir is medium and red, Pinktopia is about 4-5' and medium pink. I'd say that Calypso, Music Box, and Sweet Fragrance can be left without deadheading but look a little less clean if they're not tended at least once a month. I think the hybrid musks like Wilhelm or Penelope would do fine without deadheading, and bushy singles like Ballerina or Robin Hood might be good. You don't want roses in a public space that are too tempting to nip off the flowers for cutting, so the singles and mass clusters are better than any hybrid teas. I know what you mean about maintaining church roses with a minimum of effort. My church has 70 or more Home Run bushes around their property, and about 5 years ago put a notice in the bulletin because no one had ever pruned them and there was all kinds of dead wood looking terribly ratty and half dead. Easy care isn't no care, even for Knockouts and similar roses. Now I just go in every spring and do a fairly brutal prune once a year, throw on some fertilizer, and they get absolutely no care till next spring. Driving by they look fine, though I'm sure my fingers would be itching to deadhead something if I got right up close to them. Oh, there's also a Seafoam or two around the other side of the church that I don't prune any more than my own Darlow's Enigma, but I rather think Seafoam looks ratty at the best of times so more care wouldn't help it much. I'm sure the congregation appreciates your attention and care. Cynthia