Could it be Pink Chablis?

Linda, yes Would love to see a pic of yours... but I came to the same conclussion that this is not the same plant.

I wonder if somehow I've got a faulty plant.. it was a sucker off of the mother plant. The mother plant has semi double blooms and it's a darker pink bloom... and the other sucker taken at the same time is the same way.. semidouble blooms and darker pink blossom. This one has only single blooms (it's sent up four blooms... and they are ALL the exact same shape and size.. just huge star shaped single blooms). So maybe if I could get some pictures of the original plant and blooms, it would be easier to ID. Who knows. Anyhow, it was a fun conversation while it lasted! :-)

Lucky - I think the leaves are more ruffled than Pink Chablis. That's a Lyndon Lyon plant right? Do you have one? I'd love to see a pic if you do!

Su

Just an update: I ordered Wrangler's Dixie Celebration... and that way i have a similar plant to the one I have that has ID. ;-) Thanks for all of the thoughts and everything! I love the discussions. (picture taken from internet)

I know that Dixie Celebration isn't the same... so I'm not saying that my "True Friends Share Violets" (i.e. unnamed variegated.) is the same thing... I was just saying that I thought it would be fun to have another variegated pink. (never mind that I already have two) :-P

BTW - Anyone here have Fishermans' Paradise??

I have Fisherman's Paradise. . . well, sort of. Its a problematic plant for me. Two years ago, I grew a nice one & then practically overnight it went south. I don't know if it was too hot, too cold, too wet?? Perhaps I didn't smile at it one day. I managed to save leaves & the crown which grew back & performed well for six months or so & then went into a decline. Two young plant lets decided to follow along too; I lost the main plant & all leaves I tried to root. One plantlet is clinging to life but I'm not holding out much hope.

I have a young plant of Wrangler's Dixie Celebration so am hoping for a nice one. Gotta love those Wranglers! Terri

ohh if it makes it i really would love a leaf! i would pay postage or send you whatever leaf you would want from mine. been wanting that one so bad! :)

I don't have much confidence in this plant, so little that I've already placed an order with Bluebird Greenhouses for replacement leaves. FYI there are some auctions & BIN plants on Ebay right now. Terri

I'd bet money it's actually Willodene. The leaf texture is notable to me and the flower is spot-on for Willodene.

Hi Su, Then if Kate is correct, then I would love to have a leaf, as I try to grow vintage violets. Anyway, it is lovely, whatever it is. I love the name Willodene.

Joanne

I do have it, yes. It has a very distinct leaf compared to other variegated violets.

Rosie,

The decision was made about ten years ago or more. The plants used to come with stakes. They still do, if you buy directly. Monique handles the customer service for Holtkamp and sends out the violets ordered through the mail. She was restating their company policy. As a customer service rep, she is very nice and helpful. . Joanne

Hi, Kate, if you would be up for a trade, I have some vintage violets, if that is what you are interested in. I especially love the light pink violets with variegated leaves and had wanted Willodene but it is hard to find. I also have lots of contemporary violets as well. Thanks for finding us and chiming in. Joanne

yay!!! you mean you actually think youve identified this plant, Kate?? could you post a picture of your plant if possible?

Joanne - i sent you a PM and said i couldnt do another trade... but if you are still interested, please PM me... i think i could do a small trade. ;)

Su

side note... houzz has updated their cell phone web format! yay! so much nicer. :)

YAY! I am so excited... this looks so much like my plant! Even down to the wide range of leaf variegation on the one plant! Thank you so much, Kate! I am indebted. ;-)

Holy cow! Been following this conversation and I do agree in the ID of this plant! Do we now call it Willodene?? I looked up various pix of Willodene and they all seem to be as identical as you can get to YOUR plant shihtzu4su !!! Well, perseverance pays off!!! Yay!!!--Rosie

You're very welcome. Normally, I try avoid ID posts because I just cringe when anyone wants to self-ID a plant, but I'm glad I looked at this one. I'm certain it's Willodene--everything looks correct to me and Willodene is such a distinctive plant, I can't imagine anything else looking so similar.

fortyseven_gw: I have some leaves down from my Willodene plant and might have babies to trade soon.

Great, I will PM

I vote for Willodene. I don't have any photos of LHM. My Mama plant is now in plant Heaven, (rough winter) and I only have leaves down.

Linda

I vote also for Willodene! Which leads me to something I read this morning. In an old issue of my African Violet mag, it has an interesting article about this very subject. Plants that surprise us! How (except for typing it out word for word) can I get it here for all to read??? Not real computer savvy but I think it would be informative! Rosie

It is not possible. The back issues are not scanned onto the AVSA website. The back issues are available through purchase at the AVSA website.

Joanne

yeah but what if I scan the page and copy and paste? Or take a pix? Would that work? Rosie

Sure, it should work. Might be too small to read but you can try. Just be sure to acknowledge the source, due to copyright requirements. Joanne

My leaf is still looking good so I'm hopeful it'll make it all the way to babies. Willodene was on my wish list too :-)

Oh good! That makes me happy. :-) I put down some of the oldest leaves on the plant about a month ago, and one of them is sending out three new babies! So I have high hopes that the leaves I sent out in trades will root also... since they were younger leaves. :-)

I will try to post some AVSA articles,,,we'll see how well they do. I understand about the acknowledgement. I have been reading my old issues of AVSA and I really enjoy the Registration. This is really good to research when a violet was given its registration number. Great color photos also. I will see what I can do to get some info to the group! Rosie

Su, do you root your leaves under something to hold in moisture? Like a clear cover or dome? Rosie

Whoa, babies in a month?! Amazing!

Kinda what I thought! That is amazing and that is why I asked my question about humidity! I want babies in a month too! Rosie

well maybe it was more like two months? i cant remember! *blush* sorry... didnt mean to get everyones hopes up! :-] i do have all of mine either in a sealed plastic bag or in one of those disposable pie tins or lasagna tins with a clear plastic lid.

I'm using the plastic boxes that 1/2 sheet cakes come in. I get them at my local supermarket for $2-3 depending on who's working. 3 fit perfectly on a 48" shelf. I was so thrilled to find them! I haven't tried it yet but they supposedly hold 50 or more solo cups! I use mostly styrofoam egg cartons for leaves. It fits 4 1/2 dozen plus some 1 oz cups along the side. For larger leaves I have 2 or 4 oz cups. I don't snap down the tops so there's a little bit of air flow but not much. I'll let you guys know how long it takes to get mouse ears with this set up.

You can take a photo, save it to your computer, enlarge and post here. I did this with some old family photos I wanted to share with relatives and it worked fine. I would acknowledge the source.

All of my leaves are under a dome.

Leaf propagation speed depends on several factors the most important of which are growing conditions and variety of the leaf. I put down a leaf of 'Arabian Night' and two weeks later, I had babies. I have a leaf of 'Garnet Elf' that I put down last July. I am still waiting.

Plants teach us patience....

Linda

Linda, how much light do you give your leaves?

Linda, Maybe that is why Garnet Elf is so rare. Melody, do you poke holes in the bottoms of the egg cartons? thanks for explaining. Those cake boxes are great. Joanne

This seems like an awful lot of work. I would be happy to transcribe the article from a scanned image. It can't be that long. You can send me a link or I can give you my email address.

I don't understand. A link to what? Rosie

A link to view the scanned image. If you scan the article from your magazine and then upload into to imgur.com, or flickr.com, or some other picture hosting service, you can then send me the link to view the file and I will retype it. Or, you can email me the scanned image and I will retype it.

I'm offering because all this discussion of scanning, resizing, etc., etc., just seems like a lot more work than is necessary. An article the length of those printed in AVSA magazine can't take more than 2-3 minutes to type up (for me, at least).

I will see if I can do something either Mon or Tue. Thanks!! Rosie

No need to re-type it. If you save it as PDF and run the analyzer, it will find the text. Then you can just copy/paste....

Melody Rose,

I give my leaves the same amount of light that I give everything else. Twelve inches under the lights-one cool, one warm, for 12 hours a day. The 'Arabian Night' was interesting. I was getting ready to go on vacation to Italy and I was giving my violets a last once-over. I accidentally broke a leaf from AN and just stuck it in a pot with a bit of soil. When I came home two weeks later, there were babies. BIG babies!

Joanne,

I think that is probably one of the reasons GE is rare. I also think that, because it is older, people stopped growing it as the newer varieties came out. It is interesting how violets have changed over the years. Since I have been growing a very long time, I see trends. Fantasies, chimeras, the Russians. Today's violets tend to be more unstable than those when I began growing although they are decidedly more 'fancy'. This is due to all of the hybridizing which promotes genetic instability to a certain degree. Even the oldies, GE and Firebird have changed over the years. The genetic diversity which enables us to have such a diverse number of plants also contributes to this instability.

Linda

Linda interesting you should make the statement about today's violets being more unstable. I have no degree or formal background training in horticulture, plants and the like, but I have been harboring that same thought for a long time now. I wondered if it was due to maybe not propagating "new" discoveries as diligently as in the past? Maybe in the quest to get that new variety on the market a few corners may have been cut?

Do they still propagate only thru 3 generations before it is allowed to be called a new variety? Is everything we grow actually registered through the AVSA? Or if (bear with me here) I "invented" a pure schoolbus yellow violet, propagated it for 3 generations, is that all a person must to do to have, name and sell a different variety of violet?????

Don't misunderstand, I am not throwing stones at ANY hybridizer but I have been pondering this thought of instability for a loooooong time silently and only to myself cause I have no violet people to bounce things off of and grow with locally. AND only in the context of looking for a reason. I can't figure out any other explanation for it. So again any info is appreciated!

Everyone loves the newest shade, bigger flower, fancier leaf better everything including me. I am amazed at the scope of the violets that exist today. Here is how far behind I am. Until joining all of these lively discussions on the forum,,,,,,I never knew there were RUSSIAN varieties! I was still in the Tinari, Lyon (and not the modern Lyon), Buell, Fredette, Parson's, Frathel just to name the very few,,,,,only up to the 1980's violets! (I mean geeze,,,,,,look at the violets I ask about!) But I have also been out of touch growing them also. I am playing catch up in a very big way!!!

I can remember putting down a leaf and nothing ever died! Now I feel as though I may have "lost my touch" so to speak. AND sometimes I cannot figure out why that leaf died. I know,,,,everyone has a leaf die now and then, but I struggle now. Never had to before and I was raising 2 babies 17 months apart!!!!!!! AND nothing died!!!!!

So back to the original statement, I wonder about the stability factor also! And remember, anything I have brought up is not an attack,,,,I just am wondering and playing catch up!

Would like to know what others think!!!! Thanks!! Rosie

Rosie,
Since I began growing violets at 19, I've been doing it for awhile :) I never saved 6 of anything either until recently although I didn't care much for fantasies (those were more mom's thing.)

Yes, you are supposed to have them come true for 3 generations before registering. However many hybridizers aren't registering their plants now. I'm not sure why but we don't know what their procedures are for assuring the plants are stable. 3 is a bare minimum I would think. I believe I saw percentages on that one somewhere.

If you haven't already noticed, many of the old ones are gone. The Parson's are an example. Just poof! No longer here. I probably mentioned that I quit growing for a few years and the names on my pots had just vanished (the plants) - Honor Roll plants.

I hadn't ordered anything since 2010 so last year I overcompensated a little (a lot). I may have had more issues with leaves that normal or maybe it was just the mass and the ones that had problems showed up more. I don't know. I wanted to run a test this year but the only vendor who sent enough multiples raised prices and also subs a lot. I'm still sorting out last year's stuff (which is why if there's a better way, I wanted to find it).

I don't know if varieties have simply deteriorated over time or what but I've been disappointed in several. I've had birth marking and ones that were off. Some of these are plants that I know were okay about 8-9 years ago;. I've only recently gotten a few Russians and not the real expensive fancy ones. Paul Sorano went over to Russia and I suspect that many of them are part Lyon's anyway. Some of them even act about the same - big pretty blossoms on rather indifferent foliage. (Of course not all Lyon's are that way but a good many are like that. It's like you can have one or the other ;)

Diana in PA

Sorry to jump in here, but I find the topic of stability very interesting. I, too, have felt like there is a greater increase in unstable modern varieties compared to vintage violets. I think some of that can be blamed on hybridizers rushing their new hybrids to market, but I think it's also an illusion caused by other factors:

The internet has made it possible for violet collectors to share pictures of and discuss their violets with growers all over the world. Where now, we can do a quick search and find 30 different pictures of a variety, we had to rely on sketchy written descriptions for most violets in the past. It's totally possible for a violet to loosely match it's written description, even when it doesn't really look like it was supposed to. I think it's possible a lot of the vintage violets were as unstable as modern violets, it was simply that we didn't have numerous pictures to compare to, so we didn't realize as often that something about our plants was a little bit off.

Along with making it easier to find and compare photos, the internet makes trading violets much faster and easier. When we had to rely on ordering from catalogs and from vendors at shows, we were only getting a very limited cross-section of the actual number of violets being produced. By the time a vendor has packed up and taken their stock to a show, they've probably only loaded the most popular and/or most reliable varieties (nobody brings their ugly plants to a sales table!). So, by default, less stable, less reliable varieties were never in circulation as much as the more stable varieties. With the internet, violets can circulate further, faster and with greater ease. More people "see" a variety and want it, prompting a greater number of initial purchases and immediately putting a greater number of that particular variety in circulation. That means that rather than naturally falling out of circulation, unstable varieties end up being passed around just as much as the reliable varieties.

There is also a greater degree of sharing. Hybridizers are not just discussing their new plants and seedlings as soon as they begin to bloom, they're sharing pictures. A lot of times, by the time a plant has been through three generations of testing, there are already fanciers who have added that variety to their wishlist and are anxiously awaiting it. In the past, varieties might have been tested over multiple generations before being circulated at all. Now, I think three is the bare minimum for a lot of varieties and since the demand is there, they begin circulating afterward that much faster.

Finally, I think that the internet has made the hobby more accessible to casual fanciers--the people who are not showing, not hybridizing, not really striving to grow "perfect" plants; they're just growing plants they like, trading leaves, and sharing photos online. All that is great--I LOVE that new people are entering the hobby--but, I think they, as a whole tend to amass collections not based on great growing traits, but just on their personal preferences. So, they're not culling varieties that are prone to sporting, have bad growth formations, drop blossoms early, grow slowly, etc. and they trade more freely than show growers, too, so they're passing those undesirable varieties around a lot more.

Just my two cents, but I don't believe modern varieties actually are less stable than vintage. I just think that the vintage varieties still in circulation have withstood the test of time and the modern varieties are somewhat untested.

What you say makes sense to me. Violets just seemed more reliable back in the day. I think I got my first one in 1964. I was almost 16 years old. I loved plants so much! My dad built me a wooden table, nothing fancy, put up two 4 ft. fluorescent long ways (my table was 8 ft long.) and I went to the greenhouse and just started choosing plants! How stupid and uneducated. I remember I got a violet, a gloxinia and as many others as $16 would buy. Just all different things that I fell in love with until my money ran out!!!! lol

You answered one of my thoughts,,,,,that a lot of hybridizers aren't registering their violets. Wouldn't it be a perfect world if everyone had to propagate for 6 generations for stability, were made to register and only then could they get registration or patent to be able to sell? haha

So now that gives us discussion material on beautiful violets like Edge of Darkness and the like.

And yes, I have seen that a lot of the old varieties have gone "poof". Such a shame. I want them because they created memorable and nice memories for me. I got several of my neighbors into violets (we lived in a townhouse community) and I would root leaves, start them off in small styrofoam cups and as soon as the first flowers bloomed I sold them. Believe me they went fast! So many memories.

One of these days when I get really going fast track on violets I will again order from online. Last time I did it was in the 1970's!

I have not been back into violets long enough have something "mis-bloom" for me. When I buy a blooming violet the first thing I do is photograph it for my folder of Plants I Own. I make sure the pix and the tag are both labeled the same. It never occurred to me it may not rebloom the same until I started in this forum! But I can't keep more than one adult plant. The leaves, as they give me babies I will use for trading power. I don't have lights, table, and scads of room anymore. I depend on windows.

But I will tell you what I do. You will cringe. I have always summered my violets on my deck. I take the pots off of their wick base, and I have a metal chaise lounge that holds them. Yes it is in a corner of the deck that is very protected from sun. Totally shaded at all times. They get rained on and I never lose them. When it doesn't rain enough they get watered. Every morning I sit out with them, my morning coffee, 2 dogs and binoculars (for the birds of course!)

During their outdoor summertime break those petioles, leaves and everything else to do with a violet grow sturdier and stronger. The flowers are larger and more prolific. I know they survive the winter in the house much better because they are in super condition when I bring them in. No, I don't see evidence of bugs when they come in. I give them a great soil rinse and take them out of the pots, set them aside and wash each pot with soapy water before I reset the plant. This system works for me. Believe it or not,,,,this corner they are in is even protected from high wind! We are on 5 acres and their is farmland all around us. The only windbreak is my house and anything we planted for the last 28 years.

All my other houseplants go outside also. They also do well. Rosie

Glad you jumped in Kate,,,,plenty of food for thought! You are very right about accessibility and ease of trading! Although the casual grower just wants to grow and I get that. that is probably where I am. And there will always be people who want to show. I get that also. I always felt a little better when my AVSA mag would come and a variety that won a ribbon or something was a variety I had!!!

There are so many ways for us to look at this. I do enjoy all of the opinions and thoughts! Rosie

Kate, Thanks for jumping in, your comments are insightful.

Rosie, It seems that Optimara has reissued some older varieties in the single pansy shape. Farah is available again. That is an older pink, a nice, subtly shaded color combination. Lively but not too strong. It looks very good with either a dark purple pansy or with Manitoba, a lovely shade of periwinkle blue with a dark underside to the leaf, can be found in stores now also.

Where I live, local stores offer numerous shades of pink from very pale, to bicolor to vibrant, almost red. So you might find one you like. They also almost always have a few single pansy very dark purple. So you might be able to actually get some of the Optimara vintage that are still being produced.

When I first began to collecting (not counting years of just growing), my African Violet mentor suggested only buying registered violets. She had a collection of 300. This was way beyond where I wanted to be at the time. My interest grew very slowly. When I studied the Lyon's internet catalog, where we ordered from, I realized there were many lovely unregistered violets. For many years, most of what I ordered were unregistered varieties. They cost less, there was much more to choose from. I usually focused on one color family at a time, as I was learning about different plants and discovering what I liked. Then once my selection was narrowed down after a time of growing, I got the registered version.

It did not make sense to me to buy only registered violets until I tried out a few and knew what I liked.

The theory of why some people buy only registered varieties is that they belong to a club where they trade and show.

Probably, you know that only certain violets meet the qualifications to make them suitable for registering. However, the hybridizers continue to offer us a wide selection of many lovely violets to choose from.

Joanne

There are Noids being sold on Ebay. The Noids are numbered. I don't know if the auction is still active, but I believe the old thumbprint violet/blue Cora is being sold as #9.

Anyone looking for older noids or replacements can check that out. Or sell your own noids as numbers the same way. The seller clearly marks the plants NOID #9 or whatever.

The last price I saw was $1.89 or some small amount like that

I think Kate has a point on how we are more aware of sports these days. it's also become fashionable to show sports around, rather than tossing out a "does not meet description"-plant.

seems everybody wants to register their own variety these days, be it a sub-standard hybrid actually grown from seed, or a sport of something....

a friend of mine had a lot of sporting going on when she used way too much imidacloprid, combined with nicotine and heaven knows what else she got her hands on. (she refused to disbud for almost a year and just could not get rid of her thrip problem no matter what chemicals she used).

anyhow, i am no judge on what pesticides were used in "the vintage days", but suspect heavy pesticide use could be a factor in new sports appearing more easily. - I've even read "somewhere" that a certain hybridizer of chimeras in hong kong actually uses chemicals, high temperatures and other stressors on purpose, to make plants sport. (honestly it could be an urban legend for all the facts i have to support this claim)

i like sports. actually pretty much only pick up supermarket plants if they appear to be an interesting sport of something...

wouldn't take them to a show, but i have self-pollinated one to see if the trait may come out in the next generation (so i can register my own sub-standard hybrid one day ;-p )

Karin