Oh my! Such a nice group of responses to my post. And I thought I was the only one visiting this forum during the holiday weekend. anntn6b - I'll have to get up to speed on the terminology ('abnormal' is about as technical as I get) but will take your advice and look for the doohickies you mentioned. The asymmetrical leaves will sometimes have lobes (think of mittens with one or two thumbs). These lobed leaves are found directly under or very close to the rose bud itself but not in a compound set. The compound sets, however, will sometimes have an uneven number of leaves or be asymmetrical from one side of the stem to the other. And some sets show the beginnings of a spiral - perhaps a 90 degree turn. I'm thinking these are early signs of RRD - especially in conjunction with other signs or when I see more than one occurrance on the same cane. My garden is a no-spray zone. Not because of any principle but mostly because I'm a lazy girl. My roses have been selected for hardiness and disease resistance. I've learned to tolerate or squish the bugs and my robust feeding & watering seems to take care of the rest. The more I look at my roses the more I see signs of RRD - or maybe I'm just paranoid. My cats and other family members are worried that I'll see signs of RRD in them and take the pruners to 'em. I suspect that RRD has been in my garden for at least 3 years. It was nice to be blissfully unaware of the situation but I can't go back to that. Have a lovely weekend everyone, Karol

No, all of these are older leaves (but not dead/dying leaves). I don't have a pic of the leaves up close but honestly, there really wouldn't be much to see. They look almost normal. Somebody on another forum suggested that there might be a near break in the vine , so I am gonna check it out and see if I see any damage. I will try to post a pic of the plant tomorrow if I can-

Odd update... I pruned off the witches broom cane as far down as I could go, but left a couple of bud eyes on the cane right above the roots. This action just about woke up the bush... it has sent off two new shoots from that trouble cane from those two bud eyes I left and then another 3 new shoots from the second cane coming off the graft (this cane hasn't shown any RRD symptoms). All the new growth is normal - reddish at first, turns green, no thorns, leaves not distorted. I'm stunned. What happened?

Jiffy peat pellets have been around for a long time, and are sold everywhere in NA - I do not know about other countries. They are used by many (not all) commercial and/or home-growers -jiffy peat pellets- It is generally advised to get rid of original potting soil since it is usually peat that have not been handled properly. Most often, plants are overwatered - totally saturated, and sitting in peat muck. Or they are totally dry, and peat has become hydrophobic. This is not because of growers, but stores carrying plants. If one happens upon very 'fresh' shipment to the retailer, plants are usually in good condition as watering goes. But stores have watering days, when everything gets hosed down, without any regard to type of plants - they do not have time for separation and perhaps not enough knowledge. "Disturbing roots" to some extent is usually np and could be beneficial. Most succulents, when they loose roots - and this happens very often if they were kept too wet for too long, or are dry or they brake off with hardened/hydrophobic peat - will regrow roots if repoted. In better mix, they will grow much better, stronger and healthy roots. Very seldom are succulents sold poted in the airy mix - it requires repotting and using bit more expensive substrates (=cost of materials+labour cost of making it+repoting adds up for thegrower). Plants could grow in peat or peaty mix - but one has to pay much more attention to proper watering. With a plant or very few, and knowing about peat's behaviour, it wouldn't be much problem. But with bigger collections, it is a pain...Peat/peaty mix is good for starting plants from seeds - they need more moisture.