Healthy soil system may or may not 'deter' pest insects, however, your plants may be better able to tolerate normal infestations. A healthy soil system will be alive with a wide variety of creatures, some of which will help you maintain 'control' over the pests. It is also very important that you know which of your garden plants are prone to certain disease or insect problems. The healthiest and most balanced of soil systems is not likely to prevent a susceptible variety of rose (just for example) from black spot or aphids. Or hornworms from tomatoes, peppers, and eggplants. ;-) Knowledge about your specific plants, their ideal growing conditions, and any known susceptibilities is important. That knowledge, along with your understanding of what it takes to build a healthy soil environment, is what makes organic gardening successful. You can have a perfect soil, but still be over-burdened with pest problems if the cultural conditions are all wrong, or you've selected a highly disease or insect prone plant for your garden. For instance, plants that are either under or over fertilized are more likely to be inviting to pest insects, many of which (but not all) tend to be somewhat opportunistic. Pest identification is important and there are forums right here in the gardenweb where you can post pictures or just give good verbal descriptions. We will help identify a suspected culprit for you, and make helpful recommendations for prevention and control.

I drew that conclusion, Henry, because you fail to note two things in the real world. #1: many rose growers have serious BS problems in their gardens, despite their good garden/rose-growing practices. If they go fungicide-free, there is only one possible outcome: roses devastated by BS. Your advice to them is a guarantee that their roses will suffer serious harm from BS. #2: My post (which you failed to note) was NOT about those articles. It was about the new group of posters every year who come to this forum asking about the baking soda cure or proclaiming its virtues and wondering why those of us who have been growing roses for years are so ignorant that we don't realize we could go 100% organic and just sprinkle a bit of baking soda around--and all BS problems would disappear. Variation on this was the new poster who put manure around her roses and proclaimed the manure kept her roses free of BS and us ignorant ones ought to go organic and just spread around the manure instead. The same questions/assertions get made every year by some newcomers who visited an organic forum and think banana peels or coffee grounds or some such quick fix that is organic in nature is the obvious answer to any rose-growing problems. Strange how we do not hear from them in subsequent years about the tried and true organic methods of curing BS--or if we do, they confess that none of those methods worked after all. It was those kinds of so-called organic cures that I was referring to. Now if you want to believe that the Cornell baking soda formula supercedes chemical fungicides, you just go ahead and see how well your roses resist BS. In the meantime, I will engage in practices (such as buying disease-resistant roses) that CUT DOWN ON THE NEED FOR SPRAYING--which was the point of my previous post. And I don't mean, cut down on spraying by learning to tolerate ugly BS-ridden roses. I mean, buying roses that don't get BS or only get it a little bit once in a while--that is how you can cut down on the need to spray. But until a whole new generation of disease-proof roses are created, I honestly don't see how fungicide spraying can be completely eliminated. It can only be cut down on by exercising good judgment and wise choices --such as, in searching for and growing only the roses that rarely get BS and therefore rarely need any remedial action. Buford, I know what you mean. I had to do some long hours of searching to find roses that rarely or never needed spraying, and like I admitted, I still have a few that are much less disease-resistant than I want, but I do love those roses, so ......... Sigh! Kate

Lee - Up to a point I incline to agree with your antipathy to exotic plants in a Japanese garden. Perhaps it amounts to feeling uneasy with anything that looks somehow out of place because few things of that shape grow in the wild here? For instance, I feel a bit uneasy if I see Phormium Tenax or Pampas grass. I'd probably feel even more uneasy with a Monkey Puzzle tree, especially since somebody who'd seen them growing in their native habitat in S. America said they looked out of place even there. On the other hand, a restrained use of bamboo doesn't (to me) give that feeling. That brings me to what I'd call exotic artifacts. I wonder for instance, how a sleeve fence made from cedar lath compares with one made from bamboo? Here in N. America does the one made with cedar lath look more at home in its surroundings? I lean towards using the cedar lath. Coming back to the Bear artifact, I've got some more pictures of it (of them actually - it's a mother Bear & her cub). The carving is rooted in the ground - the owners told me that it used to be a big tree in their garden, & when it got too big, they had the top removed, leaving an 8ft high stump - and a young fellow then carved the bears from it with a chain saw. They said he did it in no time. When I consider those stone foxes with a red bibs round their necks that you see in some Japanese garden settings, it makes me think of the Bears as their western equivalent (though the red bibs don't suit!). Another artifact that I saw illustrated a year or two ago - I think it was in this forum - was a wooden post or tablet, carved in the style of Native Indian work, that somebody had positioned in his garden. He may have referred to it as a Stele, but I'm not sure. (It certainly wasn't what you'd call a Totem pole), It was in just the right place & it looked entirely at home - it was just as effective as a stone artifact like a lantern. Does anybody remember it? Herb

I have been taught to grow organicly since I was a very small child in the 1950's. When my father was transfered to duty outside of Madrid, Spain for 3 1/2 years, the entire family went ( 9 of us)1963-1967. Where we lived outside of Madrid was in a home where provisions were already for us to self sustain, nobody there were using any chemicals which I knew of or ever saw. (Exception! The military base where we moved to for 1 year in Spain weekly mosqito spraying down all residentual base housing...us kids always ran behind the fogger...soon after I came down with a skin rash and almost died- I was isolated from my family for 10 days! I was diagnosis with a disease and they showed me pictures of people with skin rashes where their entire body was peeling off. There are many other stories I've heard and seen that convience me that organic is the only way. And Feild...I disagree with your closing statement > I believe that thats the problem...what someone else does effects my rights and prividges, it does not feel good to be forced to live in a manner that is not healthy when a neighbor or another person does as they please and those actions makes one compromised in health and thus the entire planet becomes slanted towards the trends of mass media brainwashing rather than the nurturing biodynamics of organic and sustainable life styles which produce the that of optimum health. Besides, its not always as simple as just moving to find a place where it is ok to live where everyone can do as they please and everyone would be respecting others rights of environmental space usage. I am not saying that all plastic and snythetic materials should become void. (although that would be rather interesting and well with me) What Iam saying in the wisdom I am limited with; There is a common sense of understanding how chemistry is everything and that manwith manipulated constructs regarding our food, life style and evnvironment has greatly historicly altered the planet due to petroleum and of science. Science and petroleum in a free country can produce unusual and innovating possiblitites-( as we all experience) What I would like to see is that all consummers start demanding more wholestic and healthy choices! I am not suggesting boycotts...Iam suggesting that people wake up and take responsibility for their actions- and I too, fault on this often however, I try to go into the direction that is responsible as often and frequently as possible. I still drive and burn fossil fuels into the environment I still buy organic material wrapped and packaged in plastic ( is that a oxymoron or what?) I still use plastic all day long (toothbrush, hairbrush, computer, refrigerator, car, storage containers, washer, dryer, kids toys, videos, and fishing equiptment. The ironic part is that I consciously try not to consume/purchase plastics...but plastic surrounds me and the sad thing is that the chemicals in plastics are not healthy or benefical directly as a substance in the human body. Of course I realize that we have potioned ourselves to be dependent on plastic like an addiction of choice. We have been plastic sensationalized since the tupper ware queen was the greatest honor to have. Enough said, let someone else tell their story. Thank you for sharing such a passinate subject, and my apologies to you Field if I undermined your intent to accept others as they are, I understand the kind thought- to bad not everyone is educated or cares about leaving this planet having left enriched wholestic contributions for generations that follow. I believe that most people are tried of all the hysteria and have grown addicted to their life styles and that organic is furthur from being healthy instead closer to disease and muck and dirt and unhealthy life style. Worms! Manure! YUCK! Yuck! ( I have heard this too many times- it makes me very sad) So I come here to find Iam still not the only one out there who believes in magic and that organic is better!