katie,I have a small kitchen that I am remodeling the first of the year. The one thing I would not give up is my table. I think bar stools are hard for little ones to sit on and I like to face my family when we sit down to dinner. I think it's a way to connect with everyone especially when kids are in school and life gets crazy b/w work soccer games and so on. I saw yor thread on layout and I think rhome and some of the others came up with some great ideas. I guess you just really have to think where you would be eating your meals nightly.

I got rid of my kitchen table and now have an island with four stools. The previous dining space with table was pretty much unused space - we always ate at our dining room table - dining room is really part of one big great room adjacent to kitchen. Now we eat at our island a lot. No little kids in this household though.

I have a nice dining room and deliberately didn't include a table in the kitchen when I remodeled. Forces us to use the dining room. We have a peninsula, and sometimes we sit there, but almost always are in the DR.

Katie -- I sort of have a kitchen table, and sort of don't. Let me explain -- there is a kitchen table, but it is usually covered with backpacks, boxes, books, papers, etc. (I can't blame just the kids -- a lot of it is my work that I bring home from 2 part-time jobs, plus volunteer stuff, plus we're clutter-slobs). We have a small house (no mudroom, no dedicated office, small bedrooms, few/tiny closets). Our STUFF ends up on the kitchen table on the way in or out of the house.

So we eat at our dining room table most of the time.

But when I get that kitchen table cleaned off w/ everything put away, I love having it!! It's right in front of the window, and we love waving to the neighbors as they walk by, and seeing who's outside doing what. It's nice for the kids to have a place to play, color, and do HW while I cook or clean up. They can do that in the DR, but I can't see them in there as easily.

And it's great when we have company over -- grownups in one room, kids in the other. If it's a fancy dinner: DR table is set hours ahead, kitchen table is still free for use -- seats up to 6 (we'd never have a peninsula *that* big!). It would be great to have an additional island or peninsula w/ seating (my kids covet bar stools!), but I wouldn't trade my kitchen table for one. In my favorite two remodel designs (to add a mudroom and expand the kitchen), we keep the DR, the kitchen table, and add an island/peninsula w/ seating (remodel is on hold for now).

Chris (current kitchen table report: 60% cluttered tonight w/ a chance of clearing tomorrow).

Our kitchen is small. It had a small place for table & chairs but as the kids got older we outgrew that area. My old kitchen also lacked counterspace and storage. We also had a DR that, when the kids were young, was a playroom. Once they got older we converted it back to a DR but found that we never used it except as a junk collector and sometimes computer desk for my work laptop.

When we started discussing remodeling the kitchen we looked at our options. We decided to
(1) remove the wall b/w the DR & Kitchen
(2) make the DR an "informal DR/formal kitchen table"
(3) remove the table & chairs from the kitchen
(4) add a wall of cabinets & counters where the table was
(5) add a couple of seats at a counter-height peninsula b/w the DR & Kitchen

It has worked beautifully! We do not miss the kitchen table and I now have enough storage space for my kitchen needs and plenty of much-needed counterspace...especially as my children are now starting to cook & bake as well. We now use the DR for all meals except breakfast. The peninsula is used for breakfast as we're all on a different breakfast schedule.

Would I have done this if my children were still young? I don't know. It was nice having the DR as a playroom, but in all honesty we could have used the LR for that as well since we hardly ever use it (we have a FR). [My DS has taken over the LR as his personal homework den!]

So, probably, yes we would have done the same if we had done this earlier.

Old Kitchen (the cabinets & counter you see are all we had!):

New Kitchen (DR is the other side of the peninsula & refrigerator):

I hope this helps with your decision!

That was my concern too when I redid our 1969 kitchen. The previous owner had a large area where a good sized kitchen table could fit, but the dining room was also right off the kitchen. Seemed redundant, so I tried to find a way to use better space of the kitchen area. What I ended up with was a larger kitchen than in the original house and a sitting area off the kitchen where we can hang out. I put a peninsula in that can seat four (missing stool on kitchen side right now). So far, I love it. DH, DD (2 years) and I use it all day long. We eat all our meals there. We're expecting another baby next Spring and eventually I see us using this space for breakfast and lunch (when we're not all together) and then at dinner using the dining room which is just to the left of the photo below. For us it works great not having the kitchen table since the dining room is nearby.

Our old kitchen had a small table that was never used because it was always piled up with random schoolwork, mail, stuff from the garden, etc. We always eat dinner in the DR or on the patio when it's warm enough(although the last 2 mos have been paper plates in the car while shouting "eat that and get your helmet on" to 12yoDS driving between cross country practice and football practice)

Our new kitchen has a penninsula that sits 4. Not so much of a clutter catcher, makes a great buffet type spread for entertaining and we can eat breakfast there.

We have never had a table in the kitchen. There are times, rarely, we eat at the kitchen island. It's usually breakfast. The new kitchen will have a small table-like end of the island toward the breakfast/dining room. Very much like pdxgal's. We may not use it much for eating, but it will be a nice place for folks to sit and chat while someone is working in the kitchen-and a handy place to give them something to do while they are chatting ;) It has the benefit of a table and an island workspace.

thanks so much for all of the input. pdxgal - what are the dimensions of your peninsula? what is the rest of your layout? i'd love to see more. thanks!!

I have both a table and peninsula with seating and would have been happy to omit the table. Well, the counter seating is just piece of a table top attached to the back of the old cabinets as a mock up so we could decide how useful it would be. I much prefer to have the kids at the counter, for both interaction and clean up, but our table area is a little cramped at the moment so that is an influence right now.

Table, peninsula or both was a huge debate with my husband but the table is new and I really do like it. In the end, we found ways to make the kitchen smaller but more functional and have both. If I had to choose, with all things being equal, I would definitely go for more cabinet space and counter over making room for a table and chairs. Especially if you have a DR nearby.

We are a family of five and my kids are 5, 3&3. Any counter seating we added to the kitchen would not have been for family meals so we went with three generous/four tight spots and use the table when my husband is home for dinner. It would be almost as easy to go to the DR as it is to carry plates to and from the kitchen table so my favorite part about the peninsula is having it connected to the food prep when it's just the kids and being able to set up a buffet outside of my work zone when we are at the table.

We don't have seating in the kitchen and use the dining room for all our meals. We have 2 little ones (5 & 3) who are pretty messy, but I love our setup.

We use FLOR tiles in the dining room - I can replace the particular soiled tiles with fresh ones and clean them. We also have a reclaimed wood table that's pretty distressed, so it doesn't matter that the kids make a mess, bang forks, etc.

By no means do we have a formal DR...it's informal. It a big family table that gets used every day several times a day, and it's fabulous!

Deb

The kitchen in my last house had a table but in this house we have a penninsula with no table. I have to say I much prefer the penninsula for so many reasons.

First, I like the open space in my kitchen...have been in some where you have to walk around an island or table and it's annoying to me. Makes my kitchen look so much bigger to have the empty space.

It's great for everyday use, either prepping, or helping with homework. Mine is actually big enough to do both at once which really came in handy when my son was still in school. We often skip using the dining room table and sit informally at the counter. invariably, the most popular seats in the house when guests are over are at the counter. It's so great to feel part of the party while cooking or whatever and guests like the proximity too!!!

Great place for buffets...which we usually do when we have a big Sunday or holiday dinner, when most sit at the dining table.

Good luck making your decision.

Katie - Our peninsula is 60" by 35". It is definitely wide enough and can fit two people on the 60" side, one on the 35" side (the end), and one person on the kitchen side (it's 36" on that side, not the full 60" because part of our cabinet base is under the peninsula for added storage and support).

DH still grumbles that he wished the peninsula was 1 foot longer. We could have gone out a little more, but I wanted the end of the peninsula to line up with the edge of the island (you can kind of see it in the picture) so not to block the island in. We definitely don't have to worry about it sticking too far out, people can easily get by. Our entire kitchen is only 12' 8" wide (excluding the depth of the bay window). The size we have now is perfect for the three of us, and again was put in as a place for people to sit and hang out while someone is working in the kitchen, but is also ideal for someone who wants to sit down and have a snack, breakfast, etc...As our kids get older I see us using the dining room table even more. The table we have in there now is a bit more formal than I would like, but eventually I will get a table that is in between a casual kitchen table and a formal dining room table.

Oh, I was going to add that our sitting area off the kitchen is approx. 11'6" by the 12'8". The old kitchen used to end where the peninsula starts. So I now have a longer run of counter space in the kitchen and made the original eating area (now sitting area) approx. 3' shorter in length. We are able to fit a regular sized sofa, chair and table in there. It still needs some built-ins at the end of the wall for the TV. I wasn't looking for a full size family room in this space, but more of a place for just our family to hang out while we're making meals. If we have company over there is a living room with more seating for entertaining and eventually a daylight basement that will be finished.

I just renovated a kithchen in our new house and I only have a small peninsula. I very much miss my kitchen table. I don't think I would mind if my kitchen was open to my dining room, but its not. I don't always feel like walking into the next room for a table. I also miss the extra table when we have a lot of family and friends over for dinner. There's just not enough room in the dining room.

Pdxgal...I'm curious, how do all three people share leg/knee room on the end? From what I see, all three share the same leg/knee space.

I would think that you would only have space for 3 people (2 on outside length & 1 on the inside) and none on the end.

One problem with making this decision is that your needs change as your family grows - both in number and in years. For example my sister in law put an island in her new kitchen instead of a table when her kids were small. The twins were constantly falling off the tall stools,and she really liked the idea of gathering around a table for family dinner so she ripped out the island, and bought a table. That was several years ago. Now she is missing the workspace (and her prep sink, which went away with the island) and, regrettably, there are fewer opportunities for family dinners with older kids rushing off to sports and other evening activities. We are fortunate enough to have room for a peninsula with seating as well as a table. But it does seem somewhat redundant. Especially as we also have a dining room with table (which I'm certain will never get used except holidays.) However, we are a family of 6, so we could never fit entirely around a peninsula or island. I do think kitchen tables are underutilized especially when entertaining - everyone crowds in the kitchen and some perch themselves on a peninsula barstool, but who goes and sits at the kitchen table? I think it's because it is so low compared to the rest of the counters. A friend of mine bought a counter-height kitchen table and tall chairs to try and include the table area more in the overall kitchen scheme. I thought about that but I found a traditional round kitchen table that I really love so I am going with that.

Buehl - Leg space isn't really a problem. All the chairs actually push all the way into the peninsula without touching one another. And then when we're sitting there our bodies are scooted a little way back from the edge of the peninsula so it doesn't feel cramped for leg room.

The one thing that IS a little cramped though is the space ontop for dishes of food. We can put a few items in front of our place mats, but if I make a big dinner (not very often) I would probably dish up our plates over in the kitchen rather than putting everything on the peninsula.

Why save a dining rm for only very special occasions? Who is more important than your family? Use the space for a kit, if you really don't like counter height stools, drop part of the peninsula to table height for snacks.

I love having my table in the kitchen .I have a 4 and 8 year old so the tables a great place for them to do homework and crafts while I cooking or cleaning up. I can help Ashley with her homework while I am making dinner without having to leave the room, and there is plenty of room on it for them to both spread their stuff out. The table was a catch all for backpacks exctra so we added a 4 foot wide by 16 foot long inclosed porch for coats/boots, backpacks and its really really been wonderful.

pdxgal - where did you get those stools? i love them and they look nice and compact!!