Backsplash tile backer board question

13 years ago

I finally got around to tiling my backsplash yesterday. After doing some research, it seemed it was not necessary to use backerboard behind wall tile, so I tiled onto the existing sheetrock. I was using the sheets of 2"x 2" tiles. When I got to the end of the counter, overhung slightly. (note to self, start at the end) Anyway, I wasn't real happy with it, so this morning I decided to try to pull it up and redo. I was surprised to that 16 hours after putting it up, the mortar was still mostly wet. It came up very easy which I was not expecting. I had used pre-mixed mortar, so I know the consistency was right. I had my wood stove burning away last night, so I know the house was very dry. Is that normal for the mortar to have been that wet? Do I need to

A) Beef up the wall with some additional plaster or

B) use backerboard?

I'm trying to avoid too much bulk since there are several outlets to work around. If I come out too much, I'll have to extend all the electrical boxes. thoughts?

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Comments (7)

puppeez
13 years ago
I didn't do the actual installation of my tile, but 'hovered', and it is directly on the drywall, not backerboard. The motor didn't appear to be overly wet when they troweled it on, and they grouted the next day. I'm not versed in tiling to give advice or pretend to know what happened, someone with expertise will jump in on this one.
Circus Peanut
13 years ago
hi rudy,
I'm not a tiler, either, but I play one on TV. (Seriously, I've tiled large swaths of my house and am no expert, but have learned many things from the pros on this board and elsewhere. So caveat emptor etc.)

I'd say: scrape the initial mortar off the drywall as best you can to give yourself a flat substrate again.

I wouldn't add any backer board or other layers. Your original drywall will do just fine for a backsplash, even if you roughed it up a bit removing the first tile attempt.

This time, use regular mix-it-yourself powdered mortar that comes in a carton or bag. The tile guys all say it's superior, plus you can make however much or little as you want, and play with the consistency to adapt to humidity conditions on site.

Good luck!
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shaughnn
13 years ago
A Message to you Rudy, :^D
Your "pre-mixed" mortar is simply an organic adhesive with a bit of sand mixed in. It's not good for much, but it's fine for a kitchen backsplash as long as you are installing porcelain or ceramic ONLY. It can possibly stain natural stone, it won't cure correctly under glass and metal/metal-finished resins most often don't cure well either.
These mastics take a long while to firm up, as they cure by evaporation, so leave your backsplash alone for a couple of days before you grout.
Best of luck,
Shaughnn
steveinjersey
13 years ago
I'm not an expert, but do have 4 bathrooms, a laundry room, and 2 kitchens under my belt. It definitely sounds like the pre-mix didn't set up correctly for some reason. You should have had difficulty removing the tile after 20 minutes or so, and 16 hours latter you should have needed a hammer and chisel to get them off.

I assume you washed off the tile and are going to re-use the same tile when you redo the job. Go online and find out what kind of adhesive the tile manufacturer recommends, if possible. Otherwise talk to the folks that sold you the tile about the problems you had. You may be able to use a mastic instead of mortar.

If I were you I'd ditch the ready-mix and get some thinset and mix it yourself. It's really not that difficult. The folks who sold you the tile can give you plenty of advice on how to mix mortar or you can find information sheets online at the website of the mortar manufacturer, and find out exactly what they recommend for substrates, how to mix, what the set times are, open bucket times, etc.

You need a good clean surface that the mortar can bond to. If the drywall had been painted, you need to either sand the paint off down to the paper, or replace the drywall. It would probably be easier to just replace the drywall.

The outlet boxes are really no problem. If you're replacing the drywall, of course you can just re-mount the existing boxes for the added thickness of your tile. If you're using the existing drywall, you can get box extenders or plastic spacers to space out the receptacles so they aren't loose.
rudysmallfry
Original Author
13 years ago
It is porcelain tile. I've tiled many floors and all were there to stay within hours of doing the install. I was trying to save a little time and mess by using the pre-mixed stuff. I'll mix the next batch myself, and give it a few extra days to set up.
davidro1
13 years ago
as shaughnn mentioned, 1/ a mastic (ready mix) is OK for your backsplash and 2/ it dries slowly, so that answers that.

New question: in the areas where the surface is not the drywall paper facing, are you painting the drywall compound surface before applying stuff to it for tiling or are you applying your ready mix or whatever you wish onto an unpainted drywall compound surface?
rudysmallfry
Original Author
13 years ago
Well, when I pulled the tile off today. what's left of the drywall paper came with it, so I have to finish it back off with drywall compound. Do I have to prep the compound before tiling for better adhesion?