Do you want compensation? That means you keep the scratches and live with them.

I'm undecided. I still owe him about $2000 for the entire install. The entire Silestone/granite order was about $4400. My question is how much can I expect him to offer me to keep the scratches.

I'd let him offer first and then do not speak for a minute. Tell him you will get back to him about it. Ask for a little more later on...
If they are in places that will have your kitchen electrics, a spice rack, canisters, etc... then I'd take the cash. By the time you get to this point in a reno, money is usually tight.
I'd expect approx $500 for the damage. If he had to replace it, it would take new materials and labor.
Can you possibly buff it out somehow while in place?

Thanks dianalo. You got it about money being tight...I'm also more than ready for this project to be done. And it isn't as simple as slapping down a new countertop. There is a large cabinet (baking center) sitting on one of the counters that would need to be uninstalled/reinstalled if I go with a replacement. ugh

Silestone can't be buffed. The Cosentino rep suggested pigment as an option, but he wasn't sure if it would work.

What did your Fabricator have to say about the scratches ? or was this done with him in abscentia??? Money off? What ever happened to doing the job right? Cabinets can be removed to remove the scratched top and replace it with one that's NOT scratched - and yes - Silestone CAN be surface polished - how do you think they get it shiny at the factory ?

Honestly - give your fabricator a chance to make this right - without whacking him for a "discount"... you said yourself - "money is tight" - don't you think he's entitled to a fair chance to make this job right WITHOUT having to forfeit money to you - just because you and others here on GW "think" that you should be entitled to some measure of a discount for your inconvenience?

Have you ever made an honest mistake at your job -or do you all walk on water? Put yourself in your fabricator's shoes and try to see what I am saying here.....

If your fabricator re-fabs the top in question, tears out the old one, replaces it with a new one - don't you know he's going to be way upside down as far as making any profit from your job?

There's always two sides to any story, and so far - Luv2Laf = we've only heard yours.....how do you know for sure that the "scratches" were indeed done by your fabricator, and not someone else? Did you know that two most common people that make mystery scratches are "Not Me" and "I Don't Know".......???

I know that this is not what you wanted to hear on this topic, but I get really tired of the "knee jerk" reaction of "if ANYTHING goes anywhere near to non perfection for any reason - some customers think they are automatically entitled to a discount" - this mentality really wears on me

If he's like me - he takes pictures of the work the day it's finished to prove there were no scratches, chips, etc at the time of completion - if there were no scratches on the day of installation - How'd they get there? or were they there when he was finished?

Maybe your fabricator did make the scratches - maybe he didnt - give him a chance to finish the job right - and if he does - pay him what's owed him - just be fair - that's all......

my .02 cents worth - from a Fabricator's perspective

kevin

just because you and others here on GW "think" that you should be entitled to some measure of a discount for your inconvenience?

Neither the OP nor GWers brought up the topic of compensation but the Cosentino rep. And I think a small claims court would agree.

I get sick and tired of subcontractors f'ing things up and expecting me to pay the total bill.

Plus we are not here to give the fabricator advice but the customer.

"Plus we are not here to give the fabricator advice but the customer...."

This is why I post here too - and yes Deegeaux - I get tired of "fabricators" f'ing things up too because they are knuckleheads and just dont care or know any better.

I figured what I would say would be like pokin a stick into a hornets nest, but all I am trying to interject here is some objectivity and some fairness in the issue - that's all, and I'm speaking from a Fabricator's view point.....

Fact is - I do not know the whole story here - All I know is what Luv2Laf has posted in the OP = maybe the fabricator on this IS a knucklehead too - maybe he isn't = I dunno... IF the fabricator DID make the scratches - he should have caught them prior to install. It would have held up the job, but at least he would have bought himself some time and multiple options for a fix to the scratches/ BUT IF he knew they were there, and he installed them ANYWAYS - then he deserves to "face the music" and take a beat down like a man.....

BUT I will say this too....If this was MY job, and I KNEW that I didn't make the scratches - I'd be super pissed at the Cosentino rep for throwing me under the bus.... This happens too - sadly - Like I said before -

"Who made these scratches? it was either 'not me' or I don't know"....."

I guess I'm pretty fortunate that here in Phoenix - we have have some top notch folks at the Cosentino location that I am good friends with and have known for almost 20 years. They are professionals and call 'em like they see 'em - hopefully - where ever Luv2Laf is located - that is the case too.

Bottom line here - hopefully Luv2Laf will get a happy resolution on this project = new tops or money back or scratches removed to their satisfaction - because in the end = all that's desired is a top notch installation

Didn't mean to ruffle any feathers too much with my comments......

kevin

I see both sides of this issue. The OP is right to be upset, not only from the 'I am doing this right and would like everything to be perfect' affliction that GWers like myself suffer from, but also it seems that IF the fabricator made the scratches (in transport or any other way) they would have HAD to notice when they installed the product. When you pay top dollar for a product (and Silestone certainly fetches a pretty penny), you expect top quality product and service. I would be upset because the product was damaged, but even more upset that 'whoever made the scratches' didn't own up to them at the time they occurred or on install. I know that when my fabricator was here installing my Cambria, they wiped down the slabs with alcohol and used a razor to remove any residual 'gunk'. I can't imagine having that kind of damage and not noticing as an installer...

I would also wait and see what the installer/fabricator has to say on the issue. I would expect that they either fix the scratches (sounds like that's not possible), or give you the choice of a substantial discount or replacement. I honestly would expect the discount to be much higher than $500, because it's going to cost them a whole lot more in time and material than $500 to redo the job. Just my opinion. If they were generous with a discount, they might not make any/much money on the job, but they wouldn't lose money and you might feel that you were treated fairly. In either case, I hope you are respected and this comes to a happy resolution.

Azstone...You're right, there are two sides. I pointed out the 'scratches' to the fabricator on day of install. He said he noticed them right away when he picked up the material and thought it was a defect in the material. But, he went ahead and cut it and delivered and installed it. This is why the Cosentino rep got involved. This guy is not a knucklehead. He did a pretty good job overall and I'm satisfied with the project. I'm not trying to be petty or demanding. However, like DreamItCanBe said, Silestone is not cheap and I expect it to be installed defect free. If it isn't, then it only makes sense that I not pay 'top dollar.' I don't think that's asking too much.

The rep says Silestone has a 99.9% customer satisfaction rating. To keep it like that, Costentino will "help the fabricator with the material to make this right." If it needs to be replaced, then fabricator will only be out his cost to fabricate the Silestone.

I think it's good advice to wait and see what the fabricator has to offer. Thanks for the different viewpoints.

I agree that we GWers may have high expectations, but then again, we see well done work and see shoddy work here and no one wants their kitchen to be shoddy (ask me how I know, lol).
We save up, borrow, or in our case, both, to get the work done and have to trust others to take care of things professionally. I lost count of how many times I'd find poor work and then someone would try to convince me it was "good enough". Well, when we signed the contracts and started big writing checks, we were led to believe we'd have a well crafted job and not just "good enough" by their standards. I wonder if they do such poor work in their own homes.
I understand that people make mistakes and no one is perfect. Sometimes you have to roll with the situation, but if the mistake was not by the homeowner, why are they the only one who should suffer for the mistake? I let a bunch of things slide yet am left with many more than should not have been done that way. Now that we are left in the lurch, I am not ok with letting anything slide. If our gc had used professional pride in workmanship and been doing his best to make things right, I would not be nitpicking like I am now. Once the professional shows that they take no responsibility for their mistakes and tries to say the homeowner is unreasonable, then all bets are off. Why should I worry about his needing to do extra work to correct his poor installation of something or poor judgement? I should feel sympathy for their errors yet they show little regard for giving us a well done project. If I wanted a ton of errors, we could have paid much less and/or tried our own inexperienced hands at it. We pay professionals handsomely for a reason. They were not working for minimum wage (and even then, you work an honest day for an honest day's pay).
I think the real problem with this story is that the fabricator knowingly installed the damaged piece without conferring with the homeowner. They made the decision for the homeowner to accept an inferior piece and installed it without disclosure. Now that there will be more expense and risk in removing it, I think it is entirely fair that the OP gives them the alternative of financial compensation.
We have had many similar situations, both big and small, with our reno and it really ticked me off that they'd decide for us and then try to act surprised when we were not happy with what they did.
I make mistakes in my job, but I own up to them and do not intentionally do anything wrong. This guy knew the piece was scratched. If he took the risk to install it on the sly, then he needs to accept the consequences.

Make them replace it. Having paid $4400 for your counters, will you really be happy with $500 back in your pockets now and scratches on your counters forever?

Maybe, just maybe I'd consider keeping the counters for say $1000 off the price, MINIMUM.

Lesson learned though - if you knew about the defects before installation, you shouldn't have let them install the counters.

I just shelled out $5K for marble counters, and they made one inside corner with a radius, another at a sharp 90 degree angle. Didn't notice it till after the install of course, as I was keeping out of the way, and you don't really see both inside corners at the same time so it took a bit of back and forth to notice the difference.

They have all my money but are coming back to correct it. They plan to actually correct in-place - i.e. carve it with a Dremel tool (turn the radiused corner into a sharp 90). I'll be monitoring and photographing the work as it progresses with both photos and video. If they bugger it up, I'll make them replace the counters.

has a 99.9% customer satisfaction rating

For some reason this made me laugh. I'd probably be the .1% they write off as unsatisfiable :)

Lesson learned though - if you knew about the defects before installation, you shouldn't have let them install the counters.

I should've been more specific...I noticed the defects AFTER the counters had been placed and siliconed. They did these two small pieces first thing before I had a chance to even take a close look. I addressed it immediately once I noticed it on the day of install.

Luv2Laf -

You wrote:

" I pointed out the 'scratches' to the fabricator on day of install. He said he noticed them right away when he picked up the material and thought it was a defect in the material. But, he went ahead and cut it and delivered and installed it. This is why the Cosentino rep got involved. This guy is not a knucklehead..."

I will disagree with you only on your last sentence - IMHO - your fabricator IS a knucklehead since he saw the scratches when the slabs were uncut = and this guy installed them anyways - what was he smokin that day ??? Are you legally blind - is that what he was thinkin? (they'll never see these scratches???)

He also said that "he noticed them right away when he picked up the material and thought it was a defect in the material But, he went ahead and cut it and delivered and installed it.." - I'm speechless - no wait...... IMHO this screams out "Hey I'm a fabriator, but I'm also a FREAKIN MORON!!! I can't help it that I'm a DAMN IDIOT !!!!" - (that's what your fabricator really should have said....)

I always try to give the benefit of the doubt to both sides in a mediation situation until all of the facts are on the table - But... it sounds to me like your fabricator is lacking - and the Silestone Rep acted in line with common accepted industry practices - wherein, it is written (and is pretty much a cardinal rule of the trades when it comes to materials and potential defects: "Use Constitutes Acceptance" ..... Your fabricator SHOULD HAVE called Silestone and arranged for replacement slabs if he received them scratched or damaged. He didn;t do this, and now it's HIS responsibility to make the music sweet.....

THIS is what really peaves me - guys see a defect, and they go ahead and run with it anyways - NOW that I know more of the facts on this - I will stand with you and say that your fabricator owes you a remedy or compensation - but either needs to be to your total satisfaction.....

Best of luck to you - I'm sure that since it's Silestone - your end result will be acceptable - which ever way this goes for the fix.....

kevin

Okay Kevin. I agree with you after all. The guy is a knucklehead. I had the feeling from the very beginning that he was trying to cover his "knucklehead" as soon as he said it was a defect in the material. I'll talk to him next week and give him the opportunity to fix it. Thanks for your viewpoint.