When my dad married my step mom 20+ years ago, he was living in an apartment and working in sales. He was paying child and spousal support to my mom and driving an older car. My step mom was in the process of selling a house she owned with her previous husband. She worked for social services and drove an older car. A couple of years later, my grandfather passed away and left him (and my uncle) his business. My dad bought out my uncle and runs the business alone. My step mom worked for social services while going to college at night for her Masters degree in psychology. She graduated and started her own private practice. She used the money she got from the sale of her previous house toward the house she and my dad had built together.

Less than a year after opening her private practice, she suffered a brain anuerysm and has never regained cognitive ability. My dad brought her home to take care of her to the house they built together. Not long after, my step sister agreed to move into my dad & step mom's house to take care of her mom. (step sister had been delivering pizza's for a living) and she lived there with her husband and two children for two years. During that time, my dad paid the entire mortgage, utilities and provided her with a car that he also insured. Their agreement was that she would live there, taking care of her mom (with a respite worker that my dad paid, helping two days a week so she could go shopping, etc.) and when her mom dies, she would keep the house. After two years, stepsister decides she doesn't want that deal anymore and moves out. She still wants a cut from the house so dad has to refinance the house to give her $60k. and she goes off and buys her own house. Dad came back to live in the house and step daughter continued to take her mom a few days a week (for pay of course) and that allowed her to stay at home with her kids. Eventually, that became too much of a burden for stepsister and she stopped taking care of her mom completely. Then, last year, step sister and her two brothers I can't bring myself to call family in any regard, file against my dad because he's conservator of my step mom. They demanded that he account for their mom's assets and income. He provided proof that her care exceeds her income and her assets were used up long ago. They wanted to tie my dad's (inherited) business into "community property" and once their own attorney acknowledged that it was separate, they all went away. Her sons have never come to see her, never ask how she's doing or call. To them, she died ten years ago. To my step sister, she probably stuck around for the money and when she realized her mom's money was gone, it was no longer worth what she was getting paid to take care of her own mom.

I'm sure that at some point in my step mom's life, she might have wanted to make sure her kids got an inheritance from her. Perhaps she thought, like a lot of people do, that she had plenty of time to make a will, etc. She was only 50 when she had her aneurysm. She turned 60 yesterday. None of her kids called or stopped by.

and btw, my dad did give my step sister all of my step mom's possessions, clothing, jewelry, and even her car after he finished paying it off. (She had bought a brand new Mustang when she got her Master's Degree as a present to herself)

as far as I'm concerned, once your kids are grown, you no longer have a responsibility to leave them everything. My husband has vowed to care for me in my old age and if he is with me until the end, he gets whatever I have. If my kids are decent, then I don't think my husband would have a problem giving them something, but they are not entitled. It's different when you have minor children to think about.

I know that is a common mantra with stepmoms -- that children are not entitled to anything. I think most people going into a second marriage at my age feel differently. I know my X does. I think it is self serving for a second wife/SM to say kids not entitled to anything. As far as I see it the GF who didnt help X get anywhere doesnt deserve anything when he is gone.

A number of stepparents here have complained that they are jealous or resentful of the fact that they aren't the first - their first child would not be their husband's first child, etc. That is obviously in no way the stepchildren's or the biological mother's fault, but they are the targets of resentment nonetheless.

I'm not referring to step children not being entitled to anything, I'm referring to my OWN children. or children in general. It's nice if parents want to leave it to their children, but grown children are NOT entitled to anything.

and if a divorced parent marries and dies without a will, in a community property state, it DOES go to the spouse, whether they deserve it or not.

Thats why things like trusts and wills and prenups are used. My Xs will is everything to DD. Actually considering he is not married, I think that would be the situation even without a will.

And with the older older set, even those devices are not be sufficient to deal with medicaid/medicare issues. The governments position is that every dollar owned by a married couple has to be accounted for, in determining certain eligibilities, prenups notwithstanding. One attorney I know says that everything older "engaged" couple that comes to him re the medicaid/medicare issues decides not to get married. Realize I am older than most here.

well nobody is entitled to anything. Grown children are not entitled but also second spouses are not entitled.

iammommy you said your children were resentful of your DH because you were single for 6 years. 6 years is not that much at all! And unless I confuse you with someone weren't you married 3 times and also were a cohabitating girlfriend at some point? It does not sound like you were on your own that much, is it possible that your kids were resentful of thaT?

My ex was married twice (I was the first wife), now he is moving towards his third marriage and he also had 5 years of cohabitation with someone in between. He is young so I suspect this is not the end. My daughter is not resentful, she is overall extremelly well adjusted young lady. My ex is a reasonably good father and she does not care of his personal life. But my ex's son from his second marriage is very resentful of the whole situation. I can see how it effects children.

Finedreams,

I agree with you (although I do find Imas history a little hard to beleive) that treating marriage cavalierly can create issues with children. I am certain your daughter sees you as a rock of stability.

my histoy:

Parents divorced when I was 13. I stayed living with my mom, who "needed" me. She was an alcoholic and has spent the last 25 years reminding me that it's all my dad's fault for their demise. She's been sober for the last 10-12 years.
Dad remarried when I was 17. At first, I wasn't thrilled that my dad remarried. I rebelled. (which I realize I made plenty of foolish mistakes). Later, when I went back to school and worked in social services, she became a good source of support for me. She inspired me to make changes and improve my self esteem. She was a remarkable lady.
Had my first child at 17 (unmarried)
Had my second child at 20 (unmarried)
Had my third child at 21 (still unmarried)
Met the guy I ended up living with when I was 21. Moved in with him when I was 23. He had three children of his own and his ex wife had left & didn't see her children.
I raised all six children until I was 29, when I realized he wasn't interested in getting married to me. During that time, I went to college and worked in social services. It was after taking classes in human services that I realized how dysfunctional my life had been. I left him.
I continued working in social services and stayed alone with my children as a single parent until I was 34. I resigned from social services and started my business. I started dating again when I was 35 and I married my first husband when I was 37. We've been married a little over a year.

and I didn't say my kids were resentful, I said they have had a hard time accepting my new husband. As a single parent, they had different, more relaxed rules and they don't like my husband's rules. They are 18 & 20 so they only have to abide by the rules if they live with us, which my 20 year old has chosen not to do. (he is actually visiting right now and hinting that he'd like to come back because he's having a hard time on his own.)

Ima,

For whatever reason it seems to me you have a strong dislike of your mother, and it results in your being more supportive of SMs. In any event, your history of 3 out of wedlock children by the time you were 21 speaks volumes re children of divorce (and I am not certain if your SM helped you or you just grew up).

How much time do your children have contact with their father(s)?

Ima, maybe in your situation, your current marriage is helpful. Dont mean to be harsh, but your not being married to childrens father makes me question his committment. For people like me and TOS where first marriage was longer and had more committment, may be entirely different.

It must be somebody else on their third marriage, I thought it was you, my apologies.

Is there a father in the picture (I mean bio?), if not then how is that situation better than waiting to remarry until children are grown? And btw you said it is bad for children when parents wait for too long, but you yourself just got married and your children are grown!

Nobody is perfect and sometimes things don't work out the way we plan but it makes no sense when you tell people how things should be for the children's benefit but you don't necessarilly follow it yourself.

Only my oldest has had a relationship with his father. I pretty much raised myself and of course made mistakes. My dad and step mom lived away from us and I didn't have guidance as a teenager. I also didn't realize the consequences to my actions back then. My step mom and I formed a better relationship when my kids were a little older, after I was living with my "fiance". We did live in a family situation for seven years (that I thought was going to result in marriage, he gave me a ring) and being a sort of step mom to his kids probably gave me insight to what my step mom had to go through. Her and I had a lot in common. My mom has her problems and for years, I was the adult taking care of her (all through high school). It's why I feel strongly that the adults need to GROW UP and take responsibility for themselves. Sometimes they are so busy worried about "their" feelings, "their" lives, everything "they" want, that they don't think of how it's hurting their children. I wanted my children raised in a family, not a single parent household. After leaving the guy that didn't want to marry me, I stayed single because I was afraid of being hurt again. I also thought it was better for my kids to not have to deal with a step dad telling them what to do. The problem was, as a single working mother, my kids needed the stability and structure that is found in a two parent household. I would have been better off financially and I would have had help in running the home (schedules, rules, etc.). The kids got used to having a depressed and tired mom (from working 10 hour days) and I wasn't always energized enough to enforce the rules so there wasn't enough consistency. I admit my made mistakes and by sharing them, hopefully someone can learn from it and not make the same mistakes I made. (just as my mom can never change her past mistakes in regard to her children)

I didn't get child support even though it's now owed to me. I didn't have time to chase someone that refused to work, I was too busy working to feed my kids.

Having divorced parents is very different from not having one parent at all. In the second case it is probably beneficial to find a good partner as soon as possible so there are two adult figures, but in the first case there are two adult figures and finding the second partner might be more beneficial for you than for your children.

I can see that your children would benefit if you would be married early on so they have both parents involved. In some of our cases it is not as crucial because children raised by both parents even if parents live in different households.

Having or not having stepmothers makes no big difference for my daughter because she has me, and it is not important for her if I am married because she always has her dad. I think that is where your situation differs and that's maybe why you are a big supporter of remarriage and stepparenting. I am in support of remarriage as well, I just don't find it that important.

I'm a supporter of marriage in general. Children will learn how to have a good marriage if they witness one. Just as they won't benefit from staying in an intact family that is a bad marriage. If a couple divorces and has children, don't they want their children to grow up with all the benefits they can have? I'm not saying that all divorced people should run out and get married, but if they do, the ex shouldn't sabotage or make that marriage harder. That is putting children in the middle because they usually love both parents.

Being divorced and getting along with your ex is not the same. It's also important too. That may show the child how to get along as an adult, but it doesn't teach a child how to resolve problems in the marriage (except to divorce, which is what they've witnessed)

Ima,

Thanks for posting your history. It is helpful. But is it fair to say you have never been divorced and dont have an X husband. I think that to describe yourself as both a birth mother and and a stepmother is a little, well if not misleading, slanted, in the context of this board, as you havent dealt with divorce, or having expectation that the child's father has to "step up to the plate"? I hear that you think you were maybe more noble (?) by not going after CS. That of course seems to be many of the SMs positions here, that the mom should just leave Dad alone.

I dont mean to attack, but I wish you wouldnt attack moms, and describe yourself in somewhat slanted language, but you werent divorced and you dont have an X husband. I think my staying married for 25+ years and sticking with him through thick and thin says more. IMHO. And you have now been married for 2 years. Congradulations. Come back and chat and give me advice when you last a few more.

What is misleading? I AM a birth mother. I gave birth to three children. I AM a step mother. My husband has a daughter that isn't mine. I am also a child of divorce. My parents were divorced. I am also a step child. My dad remarried and I have a step mom. I have not called myself an ex wife. and I did also raise my ex boyfriends' kids for seven years, which is obviously not the same as a step parent, but it did prepare me for what to expect when I chose to marry someone that has a child. And married or not, I did have an expectation for the child's father to step up to the plate. Do you think I gave birth and said, "go away and leave me alone so I can be a single mom?" How absurd! I accepted my circumstances and my responsibility for putting myself there and I did what I had to because he was obviously a deadbeat. In regard to support, I've never said that a mom should leave dad alone and let him shirk his responsibility. But, I also don't think it's best for the kids or anyone when a bioparent spends all their time and energy dragging the NCP back into court every time they don't like something. I support less conflict. That's what's best for kids.

As far as support issues go, the CP submits income/expense info and the NCP does too. The court makes an order and that's it. If they don't pay, they have penalties and just because you don't like his lifestyle or current partner's lifestyle, it's not a reason to drag him back into court to up the support. If your child is entitled to get help through college, it's up to the court to decide the amount, not the CP that thinks the NCP can afford it. I don't think of myself as more noble because I haven't collected the child support due to me. However, I am proud of my accomplishments in life, as I was once considered a teen parent/welfare statistic. I was told by my mother that I ruined my life and would never do anything with it. I raised my children without welfare and have kept them from becoming any of those statistics that are associated with children of teen parents. I've experienced more in my life than you probably ever will. Both Good and bad. I may never know what it's like to be married to one person for 25 years, but I hope to live that long and find out, although I probably won't. Life is too short to waste on reliving the pain from the past. I've had a very painful life at times and I choose to look toward the future and make it as good as I can, not dwell on the past and my mistakes.

This is a step parent forum. Not all bio parent's are ex wives. My SD mom was never married to my DH. I dont' know why you think I attack "moms". I have told step moms that I think they are wrong when I think they are.

I have repeatedly asked one question that you and tos have never answered.

WHAT GOOD DOES IT DO FOR YOU OR YOUR CHILDREN TO COME HERE AND POST YOUR ANTI-STEP MOM MESSAGES. How does it help your life? What do you get from it that is good for you?

Step moms come here when they are frustrated and need help, advice or support. Instead they are told they are to blame for everything and that's simply not true. There are some bioparents out there that don't like that their ex has found someone else. Especially if that new one isn't as jealous as they were, or is prettier than they are, or that the new spouse is now making the family life they don't have. And so they set out to make it difficult or sabotaging it. That may not be YOUR situation, but it does happen.

Yes, of course you are a birth mother, or mother as I would prefer to say. But you arent invovled in issues involving stepmother of your childre (it would appear you arent involved with the father(s) of your children). Which does provide more background.

I dont think Ima's history is any more unbeliveable then anyone else's. Life can be complicated.
My life is even more unbelieveable then ima's,but it is all true...not all of us were so lucky to have had completely stable lives.
Some people just find it impossible to think out of their little boxes.

I dont think Ima's history is any more unbeliveable then anyone else's. Life can be complicated.
My life is even more unbelieveable then ima's,but it is all true...not all of us were so lucky to have had completely stable lives.
Some people just find it impossible to think out of their little boxes.

"Yes, of course you are a birth mother, or mother as I would prefer to say. But you arent invovled in issues involving stepmother of your childre (it would appear you arent involved with the father(s) of your children). Which does provide more background."

My son is now 20 (21 next month) but I have dealt with those issues because he had a step mom. His step mom had so much animosity toward me that she assaulted me and I had to get restraining orders against her. Today, my son makes up his mind about who he wants to see. His dad and step mom split up a few years ago. He still has to talk to his step mom in order to see his half brother if he wants. I don't get involved in his relationship with his step mom. How he feels about her is up to him.

I can see where you're coming from with your last post, but I don't fully agree.

My dad remarried after my mom died. I didn't particularly need a mother figure - I was close to my grandma and my sister - but I needed my dad to have a wife.

I also struggle with the term "always" when it comes to having someone in your life. To paraphrase Hope Edelmen in "Motherless Daughters": motherless daughters know that family is capable of being redefined and that no relationship is permanent. I'm a firm believer in extended families, stepfamilies, friends that are practically family, and so on, so that there's a big support network for people to fall back on.
Having your own mother is no reason to not care about having a SM. Just like having a sister is no reason to not care about having a sister-in-law!

(But that's the perspective of an orphan, and I completely see how someone who isn't in my situation would think otherwise)

sorry about the double post

Imamommy has chosen her husband over her 20 year old boy. It is almost impossible for a kid of that age without a college education (which few 20 year olds would have) to support himself while living on his own, either financially or emotionally. Why should he have to abide by your husband's rules? Why should he have to give up his family structure, customs and life as he knew it to kowtow to a stranger?

My 20 year old left when he was 18. I met my husband the month he turned 18. He hardly left because of my husbands rules. He didn't like MY rules and he left. He came back twice before my husband lived with me and once since then. He decided when he was 18, he was a "man" and could do what he pleases. I expected him to be in school to live with me or he would have to work and pay $50 a week, which barely would cover groceries for him (he eats a lot). He decided that if he was going to pay rent, he'd rather have his freedom all the time. He left and has found it isn't so easy. My husband's rules are no more than expecting that they eat meals when we do, clean up after themselves, go to bed at a reasonable hour (because we now have a 8 yr. old here) and be respectful. He hasn't wanted to be respectful and that's his choice. He is here now (for the last week) and is wanting to stay. He is welcome to stay if he does what I've always expected, for him to follow the rules and do something with his life. I'm not going to allow him to be a bum and sleep all day and not work, which is what he's been doing the last year.

So, how is that choosing my husband over my 20 year old son? and I lived on my own at 17 without a high school diploma and worked to support my child (him). I also went back to get my high school diploma and college without the help of my parents while raising my three kids and my ex's three kids. (and I was working full time then)

You may raise YOUR children how you see fit, but I've had to use tough love with my children from time to time and that was before I even met my husband. So you really don't know what you are talking about, ONCE AGAIN!

"As a single parent, they had different, more relaxed rules and they don't like my husband's rules. They are 18 & 20 so they only have to abide by the rules if they live with us, which my 20 year old has chosen not to do."

"He hardly left because of my husbands rules. He didn't like MY rules and he left."

Which is it?

"I lived on my own at 17 without a high school diploma and worked to support my child (him)."

A 17 year old should not be out supporting on his or her own, with or without a baby. If your not living with your parents was their choice, I think that was shameful and cruel on their part.

Twenty years ago it was possible, though certainly not easy, to find affordable rental housing and support yourself without a college degree, and perhaps without a high school diploma. Thirty years ago, I saved thousands of dollars in two years while only earning about $9000 a year - but my food budget was $12 a week and I was paying less than $100 a month in rent, including utilities. In my part of the country, it is virtually impossible to do support yourself without either a college degree or some kind of advanced technical training, such as a plumber's license. A family of 4 with TWO working adults earning the median income can not afford to rent an apartment at the median rent. Two working adults earning minimum wage can not afford to support a family of four. How can anyone expect a twenty year old earning maybe $8.50 an hour to rent an apartment when it would cost him $600 a month if he had a roommate? Health insurance costs almost $300 a month if he is healthy; car insurance on an old car costs close to $100 a month if he is a good driver; gas is another $100 a month if he lives close to work, food is another $300 a month if he almost never eats out. Telephone is another $40 if he doesn't have a landline - that leaves $60 for car payment, clothing, razor blades, toothpaste and everything else. How can you live on that?? The only way my kids were able to get by right out of college was by working two or three jobs and living at home - where they were certainly contributing, but I wasn't charging them $600 a month. In the last thirty years, food has gone up about 5X, rent has gone up at least 6X, but average starting salaries even with a college degree have not kept pace - going up perhaps 3X. And I went to a very expensive private college (on a scholarship, however) - the tuition to which was $5000. Tuition there has gone up over 7X. It is totally unreasonable to expect young adults to manage as well as they were able to twenty or thirty years ago. The gap between the wealthy and the poor has widened greatly in that time period.

He left because he didn't like my rules, he hasn't moved back because of the rules, which now includes additional rules my husband and I agree to. He left before my husband lived with me.

and yes, my mom was an alcoholic and she wasn't in a position to support me. She moved out of the house we lived in and was homeless for a while when the child support for me stopped and she could no longer pay the rent. I moved into an apartment. My dad helped me occasionally but I turned 18 two months after my son was born and I didn't want to move to his house because it was over two hours away and I didn't know anybody. I walked to the adult school to finish my HS diploma and worked fast food jobs to pay my rent.

and the cost of living has increased. I agree with you on that and it is harder to get out an make it on you own at 20 today. BUT WHAT IS YOUR POINT???

I didn't throw my son out, he had he option of living at home and going to college and he didn't want to live by the rules. My father offered him a chance to go to culinary arts school in San Francisco for $30K and he turned it down.

The cost of living in a lot of places is NOT as high as the cost of living where TOS is. I've heard you talk about it before--and I remember how much it cost me to live in southern California (where I was) compared to how much it cost back home. The difference was astounding.

The truth IS, of course, that I didn't HAVE to live there. I made that choice on my own. Where I live now, you can rent a one bedroom apartment for $400 a month (without a roommate) and car insurance is a whole lot less than I paid in LA. Grocery prices are considerably lower.

I realize that many people in the coastal states look down on us midwesterners, but there are plenty of good people here without college degrees doing just fine, thank you very much. I suspect that there are even some people in coastal states without college degrees making a pretty good go of it as well... I know that i did.

Might be more difficult to be without one, but you can still eat every day and have a place to get out of the rain.

If you are divorced with children, even if you are willing to take your children far away from their father, you don't have that option.

Without a college degree, or training in a skilled trade, you can not afford to raise even one child in my state.

imamommy,

And who took care of your child(ren) while you were working those fast food jobs, presumably paying not much more than minimum wage? Even back in the 70's infant child care was around $100 a week.

My point is that just because you chose or had to be a single parent without a degree and on your own when you were a teenager, that doesn't make it right for you to require your son to live on his own at his age.

Did he want to go to culinary arts school? It might have been a great opportunity, but I have heard that it is very difficult to succeed in such schools unless you are extremely talented. I would have turned down an opportunity to go since I would have failed out in the first semester..

Vivian,

Same here. Many of my good friends have children in their very early 20's who are out on their own, in apartments, with cars, without college degrees and they are doing just fine.

In fact my best friend's son, who is just 21 recently purchased his first home. He got a job, he works hard and has been promoted and ahs a good future, even without a degree. He is is fixing up his home in his spare time. And he is the product of a broken home. He didn't get financial help from anyone - he did this all on his own.

On the other hand, I know a 26 year-old who is still living with his Mom and Dad (who are still married). His parents have spent over $100,000 on post-secondary schooling for him - still no degree and no job.

Why should he do anything to get his hands dirty? There is no need - Mom and Dad do it all for him.

Ima, I didnt mean to be critical of your earlier lifestyle. I can see that you have moved forward. I just resent the attitude I see here sometimes that first marriage was hasty. My wasnt. I dont think TOSs marriage was a hasty one. We both went to college, and I had professional degree and certification before marriage. My X and I were married many years before child. I think Xs first marriage showed a lot more thought than his current relationship. I suspect he is finding out more and more about GF.

To have any expectation that current GF, even if she were to become a wife, has shown any reason to be trusted or respected is beyond me. I dont see any benefit of any relationship between SD and her. As to whether she and X might have future children, that is so unlikely as to be hilarious.

iammommy your son has many opportunities, he does not have to be sturuggling on his own with no education. There are bunch of opportunities to get some education and training not full time and not expensive. Community colleges provide inexpensive but very decent education in my area, and it can be transferred to any local 4-year institution. I actually took one class there for some professional development credit and I found it absolutelly excellent and frankly some professors were better than in the graduate school. Very affordable, very accommodating and very wide range of degrees and professions. Even kids who do very well in school choose to go there for two years because it is easier and more affordable. And they accept anyone.

I just wonder when we are all going to stop thinking that one size fits all when it comes to families. What is best is really a matter of individual maturity, temperments, circumstances, and we arent in the position to judge what is best for someone else.

Are some first marriages hasty? yes

are some second marriages rushed into? yes

are some familes better off for a second marriage? yes, and vice versa

Probably one thing we all can agree on is that rushing into any relationship is a bad idea. Other than that, its up to us to figure out what is best for our particular family.

I am in midwest and there absolutelly no jobs without college degree. There are no jobs even with college degrees! People are laid off left and right. And cost of living is very high. I mean modest two bedroom apartments are around 1000. Houses are very expensive. I do live in one the most expensive counties in the US, but even neigboring counties are still expensive. I mean, yes, it is not California but this is not cheap. And who are these people who are doing great with no degrees here? I mean maybe somewhere else in Midwest, certainly not here.

My previous comment refered to statements how people do well in midwest with no degrees.

Yep, my stepdaughter is studying cosmetology vocationally in high school. University isn't for her. It's not for everyone. I have a stepson who is considering the military. Yep, they're going to amount to big zeros because neither will have a fancy paper on their wall.

Yep, that's pretty insulting.

Actually, we all have a choice as to where we live and you make according sacrfices for your lifestyle. You can have ANYTHING that you want if you're willing to work for it. No question.

...and apparently some children can have anything that they want WITHOUT working for it--they just won't be mine.

Kathleen, I agree, every situation different. But this thread started off with one-sided benefit of second marriages.

Also, I see value in vocational education, but I dont see Imas son doing that either. Vivian, in my state a person cant become a hairdresser, etc without training (either at a vocatioanal program in HS, or elsewhere). And I strongly support our men and women in uniform.

Finedreams, I work in NYC. Anyone with breath on a mirror can find a job.

Vocational training provides a profession, that's what i meant. One needs either vocational training or college to survive. Unless they want to work for minimum wages. Both cosmetology and military tarining provide job and income. Very honorable. My point is that if you have no training and no education at all (not necessarilly 4-year degree)and are on your own right away after high school you cannot support yourself.

Of course there are jobs here too (Oakland County, MI), but without training or education these are not type of jobs that one can support him/herself.

iammommy you started this thread commenting how second marriages are beneficial.

But I find it ironic because your own story does not support your statement. Your son is not getting any education and any proper training at age 21. You mentioned previously that situation is somewhat similar with younger son, is he getting education or training? And your young SD seems to be having problems as well. So who is that marriage beneficial for? Does not seem to benefit any of the kids. Actually seems to be the opposite. Maybe your daughter benefits from it, but you didn't talk about her.

My son that is 21, left our home before we got married. He came to us last night and now says he is ready to follow our rules. He's had that opportunity since he was 18 and thumbed his nose at it. He felt like he was an "adult" because he had an 18th birthday and was legally an adult. He turned down his chance to go to culinary school because he told my dad he wanted to "do it on his own" and he didn't. His problem has been his attitude and he had to go find out, through the school of hard knocks, that it wasn't what he thought to be 18. We've helped him get decent (manual labor) jobs and even co signed a car to help him out. He quit the job because he didn't like it and stopped paying on the car when it got hit & damaged (totaled), he says while it was parked.

My younger son, perhaps realized by seeing what his brother was doing, decided to abide by the rules and go to college. He is doing better, as he also went out and got a part time job and is making payments on his first car too.

My daughter is doing much better in school and also working.

My kids are doing much better since I got married and I can't say that it's because I got married, they were already 16-17 when I married him. But, I can say that before I was married, they did struggle more. In fact, my daughter was at one point failing in school and was clinically depressed. She began cutting when she was put on anti depressants so that was stopped. My now 18 year old son, became addicted to prescription painkillers when he was 16 and was hospitalized. These things were happening around the time I met my husband and my daughter has told me that it's different now. Before, when I was a single parent, they had a lot more freedom because I was working and not always home to enforce the rules so there was inconsistency. My husband moved in when we were planning our wedding and initially, there was rebellion, but all of the children were a part of our ceremony. We even included vows to each other's children. Over time, all the kids are doing better than they were before(except now his daughter is having problems)

My step daughter is having problems for a completely different reason. Her mom abandoned her three months ago. and she is actually doing much better the past month. She's had problems with school because her mom was doing homework for her last year (when she didn't get it) and we sit down with her and help her understand it. Her teacher commented on her progress at her conference two weeks ago. At the beginning of the year (when her mom left) she was having behavioral problems and couldn't do her work because she didn't understand it or know the terminology. Her mom has continued to keep her on an emotional roller coaster by telling her that she wants her to go live over there but that she can't because it's only a one bedroom house. She never calls to say she loves her or goodnight. SD calls and BM never answers her phone, so SD has to leave messages that BM doesn't return. In fact, we just got another call from BM that she can't pick up SD from school today (she's supposed to get her from school on Fridays) but will try to be here by 9:30 PM (and they have a 2 1/2 hour drive back to where she lives) The last time she said she would be here in the evening like that, we were ready and waiting and she called and said she'd be here in the morning. She was late then too. SD does much better when we have a two week stretch without her visiting her mom because she does have the stability of her routine and schedule. She is with DH on the last weekend of each month so we have that two weeks and lately, she's bounced back from her mom's BS better. I think she's realizing that her mom can't be counted on. It may be different if she had a stable mom, but she doesn't.

and no, I don't wish her mom would go away or not exist, I wish her mom would stop hurting her daughters. She also abandoned her 12 year old when she left.

Ima,

I guess what I am saying is you are looking for mothers to be more supportive of stepmothers, based on your situation. Maybe your children would have grown through puberty in any event. Maybe your DH does positive things with your children, gets involved in their eduction etc. Even assuming that your DH has been helpful to the children, and not just you, I hardley think that stands for the general proposition that second marriages are beneficial to children.

and I would also like to add that in my previous relationship, I lived with him for seven years. His three children and my three children were able to (at least for those seven years) live in a family setting. We worked our work schedules so one of us was usually home and their grandma watched them when we both had to work. The kids were able to participate in Boy Scouts (I was a leader for two years) and Girl Scouts, the girls were in tap & ballet, and all (except his daughter) were in little league. She ended up doing soccer. They had some issues I think because their mom also abandoned them when the youngest was only 1. But they didn't really have problems until after we split up.

Here's where I can say that rushing out and marrying the wrong person is TERRIBLE for children. My ex got married less than a year after we broke up. His new wife had two children (she was a widow) and she wanted nothing to do with his kids. She talked him into reversing her tubal ligation and within a couple of years, they had twins. She's been a mommy to her kids and her twins but his kids were either rebellious or she didn't take an interest in them. The oldest one is now covered in tattoos and living with his grandma. The younger son is also covered in tattoos and I don't know where he lives. The daughter is rebellious and in my opinion, raising herself. From what I understand, they now have some sort of contact and relationship with their birth mom, but nobody is raising them.

So, it's not a blanket statement that I made in the original post. What I said is:

"If one or both parent's get remarried into a "healthier" marriage, I see that as a very good thing for the children"

the original post is about children witnessing a good marriage because children learn to have relationships by seeing them. I realize that they can see an aunt/uncle with a good marriage and learn from that or other people, but in situations where one of the parents gets married and it's a good marriage, there are ex's that resent that the other parent is now happy. They may feel like the new spouse is taking over the family that belongs to them and they may feel cast aside. I'm not limiting that to moms, dad's often feel that way when a mom remarries. But to cause problems in the new marriage because of the way it makes the ex feel, is wrong.

If you are secure in your role as a parent, you shouldn't have a problem with your child being a part of a new family where they can be loved as well. It doesn't change your relationship with them. and that may not be YOUR situation, but my comments are people in general. and if it's a power struggle between bio parent and step parent, both need to stop and look at their own actions to see what they are doing to make it better or worse. It's easy to blame each other but it takes two to keep it going. If one backs off, the other may continue to try to stir up problems but if it is ignored, there's no pay off for that person. Eventually, they will stop or just look foolish.

I think it is important to note that if children did not have any male figure in sight (not only father but well adjusted grandfathers or uncles) than certainly remarriage would benefit them if a new spouse is a decent person.

Also if children are troubled emotionally, academically behaviorally etc then I can see that parental remarriage to a decent person can change that.

After you explained your situation with kids i can see what you are saying.

But for so many families none of this is the case! Not every child is troubled, not every single or divorced parent went through some kind of ordeal, not every divorced or single person went through some kind of troubles in life. So many people just have a normal life. Single or not. I know i only have one kid, but she was never troubled, we are pretty boring not troubled type of family. So my kid does not need to be straigtened out. Remarriage is something I might do or not if the right person is there, but it is not because my kid needs that to become a productive member of society.

maybe we can specifically determine that it is beneficial for children to have good role models: either single or married

Children need stability. For some people this stability is in marriage but for some it is not due to marital problems. Some people can provide stability in a signle parent home but some cannot and children end up in trouble. Everybody's situation is very different.

"If you are secure in your role as a parent, you shouldn't have a problem with your child being a part of a new family where they can be loved as well. It doesn't change your relationship with them."

That's how I feel too. I believe "the more the merrier" when it comes to loved ones! Having more people to love and care for your child (or you, or your friend, or father, or whoever) should be a good thing, provided of course that the new people do genuinely love them.
What Mother Abbess says to Maria in Sound of Music ("Just because you love a man, does not mean you love God less") goes for family too!! No one ever 'replaces' anyone who is truly loved; each relationship holds its own special place in our hearts. I don't love my sister less because I have a sister-in-law. I don't miss my mom any less than I would if I didn't have a stepmom.
And, if love "does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking," then we should treat the people who love our loved ones with respect.

Now, I know some bear-poking, antagonistic person on here is going to say "oh, so you wouldn't care if your husband had an affair because the more the merrier?"... No, that's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying that if we love someone, we shouldn't feel threatened by their other relationships. For couples, that's having one romantic love and many other platonic and familial loves. For parent-child, that's having one special mom and one special dad (or if your parents are gay, two special dads or moms; apply to other circumstances as needed) and many other familial loves.

"Children need stability. For some people this stability is in marriage but for some it is not "
"maybe we can specifically determine that it is beneficial for children to have good role models: either single or married"

Absolutely! If a single parent can provide stability and positive role models, great! If marriage will help that, then that's great too. As long the marriage (either first or second) respects the children and provides than with love and care, then I think everyone wins. If the marriage dismisses the importance of the children or is somehow otherwise abusive, then it's bad.
I would like to think we can all agree that's really what's important!

anyone that would like to chat one on one can go to my page and there's a link to my home page.

posted by KKNY
"But is it fair to say you have never been divorced and dont have an X husband. I think that to describe yourself as both a birth mother and and a stepmother is a little, well if not misleading, slanted, in the context of this board, as you havent dealt with divorce, or having expectation that the child's father has to "step up to the plate?"

Actually Ima is in every way a birth mother and stepmother.

KKNY have you ever been a stepmother to someone else's children? Do have any clue at all what happens there?

Dealing with a hostile EX who views your marriage as pretend, even though she was the one who demanded to divorce years before you even met your husband?

And gawd please don't you and TOS bring up that crap about the posters on here again. You sound like a broken record and it is boring, and we have heard it a zillion times from you.

Colleen,

What is your background, mom, stepmom?