And meet... Bobby Ray! Anita named him. "Bobby Ray! Git me a beer, boy!" It all has a sweet ring to it, hollered out the back window: "Rye! Omie! Fern! Bobby Ray! Supper!!" The kitty room is essentially a closet off the mudroom out back. A kitty flap opens to it from a kitchen cupboard, and a cupboard door opens to it from the mudroom, where I pass in the food and water. A big door opens to it from the garage, where I get in to clean out the litter boxes. It's full of sheepskin padded shelves on different levels, a 5-foot cedar log to scratch and climb, a hanging basket, various strings and dangly toys, and best of all, a screened window facing the back porch, yard and pond beyond. It's where they are safe from dogs when humans leave the house. Yes, the kitty room was built, uh, a year, before the kitties arrived. It's been 20 years since I had kitties. I was worried. I've been waiting for these kitties for a while now. :)

That really does not sound fair. I'm sorry this is happening. I'm not on the other end of the relationship yet. That is, I am a DIL, but not a MIL. Kids are young. It seems that every couple I know is closer to one set of parents than the other. It's not always her parents, it's mixed. The reasons vary, the degree varies. But it always seems that the relationship with one side is great with the other is stressful. Still, it's worth the effort. In our case, we have an easier time with my parents. Even DH is less stressed over visits with my parents than with his. I manage the family relationships in our marriage. That's by default, not b/c I'm controlling. DH just doesn't do it. So if I don't, there would be no relationship. I talk to his mother more often that he does, I plan trips to visit. Probably half the visits the kids have w/DH's parents, I took them without DH. It's possible that in the first couple years it looked like it was my fault. We all lived in Ohio, us and all our parents, and I am close to my aunts and cousins, too, while DH barely knows his. So I took the first grandchild to visit my family a lot more often than DH's. If DH was busy on a Saturday, I went to my family to visit. DH grew up rarely seeing his grandparents or extended family. Theirs was not a close family. It seems like that's how he thought it was "supposed" to be. On his mother's birthday when I say "Did you call your mom?" He seriously asks "Why?" It does not enter his mind that she might expect/like a call from him to say happy birthday. I pick out Mother's Day cards and make sure he signs them, then I write a nice long letter and mail it. Sometimes I wonder why I do it, it should not be my responsibility. And a different wife might not do it, especially in this generation when it's not seen as the woman's job. But I can't leave it, make her wonder why her son doesn't communicate with her. It's not that he doesn't want to communicate with her, he just doesn't want to communicate. Period. At the same time, they don't come visit us. They are retired and even drive from FL to OH every fall, and back in the spring. They have to drive past us to get there, and usually stop for the night, never longer, not once. And sometimes they don't stop at all. When MIL calls, half the time she only gets me. She does not ask how the kids are doing, she goes on and on about other people I dont know. She does not ask to talk to the kids. My parents come and stay with us at least once/year, go places, see the kids play their sports. They call and talk to the kids. The relationship is reciprocal, I guess. With DH's parents, it just is not. I can see a look on MIL's face when I mention visits we've had with my family, resentment or at least annoyance. But what can I do? I cannot build that kind of relationship with her if I wanted to, she does not make herself available to it. DH does not value the extended family relationships. Anyhow. That is not your case, I can see that. I kinda whined my own whine there. Sorry. I just wanted to share my experiences, maybe something there gave you some insight, a thought you had not heard before, something. And to say it seems to be the case for every couple we know, that it is not balanced between the sets of parents. Not that it's right, but you are not alone, others struggle to work this out, too. I'm sorry they do not see how they are hurting you. It is not fair.

Lisa, I can see where you are confused. When I said our youngest son "treats us wonderful", I mean he calls every night, he visits frequently, we go out to eat together, he calls when I'm sick, etc. He does things a son should do to show love. Our oldest son seldom calls us, seldom comes to visit, never knows when we've been gone a week on vacation, etc. I should have said he treats "me" wonderful. His dad rarely calls either one of our sons, until I remind him he hasn't called them in months. He doesn't even know our youngest son's home phone number. Maybe this is just a man thing, but something I'm not used to. Re: the one acre. This acre of land was given to our son strictly by me, not my DH. For years, I have asked my DH to sell this big house so we could get out of debt before retirement, and we could pay cash for a nicer/smaller home. We had this one acre to build on. He said he would NEVER build a house on that lot and to never ask him again (we had this land surveyed as two lots and this one acre is a corner lot and he doesn't like corner lots). One day when our youngest son was visiting, I said, "why don't you build on this acre and start building up equity in a home, and quit paying rent?" I was surprised when he later called me and said he did want to build on this acre. Surprised because he left our home because he couldn't get along with his dad (a combination of youth on his part and depression/anger on DH's part). I felt like I was doing something good; to help him get a start in life. I won't even go into the negative comments I have heard from my DH (my son knows nothing about these comments and never will, but I'm sure he knows his dad has said things. He doesn't need to know "words" that would hurt him that come from a mentally ill person. He even asked me not to tell him anything negative his dad said. I know his dad is happy for him, as he walks over to the land daily to see what progress is being made, and today wanted to buy him a refrigerator for his home, and that's a lot of money. (This is what depression does to you; the mood swings. I never know when he's going to have a good day or a bad day). I have learned to realize that a lot of things he says, I know he doesn't mean or doesn't realize what he is saying. I also have learned not to get hurt so much over his words and a lot of times I ignore what he says. How else would I be able to live with him so long? LOL! Re. the comment: "neither one of our sons have a good relationship with their father", that is very true! Neither one of our sons would go to their dad with any problem they have. I don't call that a "good" relationship, do you? A son can treat a parent "wonderful", and still not have a good relationship. By "good" relationship, I mean a "close" relationship. There is no doubt he loves his dad, but the closeness I have with my sons, he doesn't have this. I think this is because of his depression and the mood swings brought on by depression. Re: grandchildren. I don't think I have posted anywhere that I am "without" grandchildren. I would never deny my grandchildren. I may not get to see them much at my house, but I have a 6 yr. old granddaughter and a 15 mo. old grandson. I think you are confused as when I said "I want to build a smaller home and be a grandmother", I meant I will finally get to be a "grandmother" when my youngest son has children, to be able to paint the spare bedroom pink or blue, and put a swing set in my yard. (Of course, all this depends on my DH's behavior; and whether they can even have children. He is real close to his fiance & I see a wedding next year. She is moving to his new home as well.) Last summer we went to one of our granddaughter's ballgames and my DH was going to walk to the concession stand with her. Our DIL pitched a fit and told me "she is NEVER to go anywhere with him!" I felt this very rude, and I don't know who heard her. You could see the concession stand from where we were standing, it was very close. She asked him to go with her to get some bubble gum. In Feb. our youngest son invited me to go the circus with them, as he was taking our granddaughter to the circus. Our son said, Mom, I know you have talked so much about wanting to go to the circus, Barnum & Bailey. I said, sure. When our DIL got to his apartment with our granddaughter, she refused to speak to me! I had done nothing to her. She told our son in the parking lot before they came inside that "she wasn't told I was going". This upset me so much, I couldn't hold the tears back. She stormed in his apartment, totally ignoring me, and they left after she told our son "we will be here to pick her up". I told them "oh, there's no reason for you to have to get out at 12:00. I'll drop her off." I followed them to their car, she got in with our grandson, and I asked my oldest son, "why can't I bring her home?" He just said we'll come get her, and he got in the car and left. He seemed embarassed, and he didn't know what to say to me. He had to do what she said, regardless of who it hurt, and just left me standing there in the parking lot. Since this circus incident, I have not been to their house much. So there is more than one side to all this mess - my DH's depression and behavior and my DIL's control/anger, sometimes unwarranted by both of them, and me just going with the flow. I hope this helps clear up any confusion. I am just trying to live one day at a time, not knowing what tomorrow will bring. I am not unhappy in my marriage as someone has suggested. We have a lot of wonderful days and a lot of good times together. I am unhappy mostly because of this difficult situation and longing to be a grandmother. I just wasn't willing to "give" if they weren't going to "give", but after reading these replies, I don't feel like I have any other choice. Maybe if I give first and show them more love, they will slowly start caring more. All the replies I have received has helped me realize that unless I change myself, I am going to be missing out on a lot of closeness with my grandchildren and I would have no one to blame except myself. There are many days I get off work early and I could head toward my DIL's house. I say I have no hard feelings toward her, but I have a lot of resentment, so I just stay away. My DH works both Sats. & Suns. and I have plenty of time. p.s. I have never asked if I could take our granddaughter to McDonalds or anywhere with just the two of us because I have always felt guilty doing that behind my husband's back, as I know he would never be allowed to do this. I feel like that would be mistreating him by me doing that, so maybe I need to change my way of thinking on this.

You've learned the hard way that shelters don't always know the breed they're dealing with. Apparently they just repeated to you what they were told by the previous owners and some people who have to surrender dogs will say anything in order to make the dogs look like perfect pets. Since these dogs were not in foster homes, the shelter should have never said they didn't chase cats and were house broken. Regarding the term house broken: it doesn't mean that a dog that was house broken in the previous owners home is going to enter a new home and know exactly what to do. Dogs have to learn the routine of the new household, become bonded with the new owner, and the owner has to learn how often the pet needs to go out to empty it's bladder/bowels. That's why I said you need to start over with crate training, but since you're gone so many hours that's going to be difficult. Your dogs could have a bladder infection which is causing the frequent urination, but it's also possible they just aren't staying outside long enough to finish peeing & pooping. My guess is that after being in a crate for up to 10 hours, they're spending their time sniffing and checking out interesting odors. Just putting them outside does not guarantee they're doing their business so you need to stay with them and work on training them to go on command....... better still.......take them for a long walk. All this will be easier with one dog, but as everyone has said, you've got to want to put in the time and effort that it's going to take. You need to gain their trust but right now your frustration just adds to their confusion of what to expect. You've got to change your whole approach if you want to see results. If you return them to the shelter, be sure to give the staff an honest evaluation. That way the shelter will have a better assessment of the dogs for the next home. My guess is they were turned in for the very behaviors you're seeing......not enough training and little knowledge of the breed.