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openskies

Need Wife/Ex-Wife Advice

17 years ago

My ex left me about 10 years ago for someone else. I eventually met someone and remarried. The relationship between the two women is not good. Consequently, there isn't much communication between them. My wife sometimes decides she wants to be equally involved in communication with my ex, but from my standpoint, it is so unhealthy and volatile that it isn't good for the kids.

I'd love advice on this. My daughter asked if she can take an old piece of sporting equipment that is her stepsisters, to use in her sport once, a sport that her Mom signed her up for. Before I could say "sure", my wife told my daughter to let her Mom know that she could borrow, but it needs to be her Mom that calls to request it, since it is her that would have had to pay for this piece of equipment. Myself and my ex each handle some of the non-extraordinary sports expenses.

The problem I'm having, is that my ex found it silly that she would have to call to ask for something that exists in this house where my daughter lives 50% of the time, when the kids regularly take things back and forth between houses. My wife is highly annoyed that my ex would not make this call or email, and told my kids she is disappointed. I always try and rise above anythink that the ex does that annoys me, and just do what is right for the kids, so in this case, I'd just let my daughter take something from here (that I contribute $$ towards anyway), and not put her in the middle as a messenger. The issue my wife has is that we pay my ex lots of $$ so she feels like she should be forced to buy this item that would be used only once.

Sorry if this is confusing, but I just need an unbiased opinion as to whether it is reasonable to ask for a phone call from my ex to officially request borrowing something, or should it have been a simple thing where we simply make it right for my daughter. That is always my approach, because I feel it isn't worth making an issue out of. I am feeling lately like my wife and I need to attend counselling to discuss these sorts of things, because the dynamic involving my ex is quite prominent in our household, and my wife doesn't like that I suck it up alot for the sake of the kids and pick my battles carefully - she tends to want to fight back when these things come up.

I know this probably seems like a minor issue, but it is one of many similar and they are getting to me - I just want to focus on what we can control in our home and be happy.

Thanks.

Comments (136)

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I doubt SM is looking for acceptance by Mom, but if you are right, Mr. Openskies should point out that mom has not been trying to get full custody (assuming that is true). That to me should indicate acceptance. Again, the appreciation has to come from Dad. SM is helping him out with the 50/50 custody he wanted.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    "I forgot to mention, just to provide a clearer picture, that a big thing for my wife is that she believes I should force my ex to have to communicate with my wife, such that it is transparent in our household which one of us my ex talks to about issues."

    It seems to me from this comment that it is not that his wife wants a relationship with his exW, but that she wants the exW to know who is REALLY in charge - she is. I don't see how this can be interpreted in any way other than a power play. Of course the exW won't agree to put her in charge of raising her daughter during the fifty percent of the time that the girl is with her father. That is for the father to do. Why on earth would the mother talk to the SM about "issues" - behavioral, scholastic, medical, or anything else?

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  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    And why wouldn't she? This is a woman who left her husband for another man ten years earlier. EX is the control freak here, she is used to controlling two men. So what if EXwife thinks it is silly? Exwife just wants to carry on as if Wife doesn't exist.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    The exW is the girl's MOTHER. She and the girl's father are the ones who make decisions on medical, educational, and other issues regarding their daughter.

    How on earth does the fact that she left her husband for another man make her a control freak? Those two things have nothing to do with each other. My exH is not a control freak - he (and apparently a lot of other men) is a conflict avoider most of the time.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    One thing I will say about the girls mother is as much as I am sure she doesn't like me she has always respected me as another adult helping to raise her children. When the girls are at our house and they'd ask their mom for a snack, to go outside, to get down a toy, exc...she would always reply "Ask your daddy and Dana." I was always included because she understood that even though I am not the girls biomom I DO take care of them 90% of the time and it is MY house. I believe she also knows that I love her children and they love me so differences aside, she respects me for that.

    Adults need to AT LEAST be amicable to each other when there are children involved. I'm not saying they have to be best buddies but there does need to be communication between ALL adults caring for the children. It takes a village afterall.

    The wife in this case is making a power play but it is no more a ridiculous game than the ex trying to pretend she doesn't exist at all. They both need to get a grip.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I dont think the Xwife has done anything to imply the current wife doesnt exist, she just communicates to Dad. I dont see that as less than amicable. For all the complaints here by SMs, I cant even imagine why one would want to get in the middle. Oh yes, to remind Xwife the power that SM has over her DD. I would think it would backfire.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    If it were a neighbor's child and her mom wanted you to call, would you have a problem with that?

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    TOS and kkny ... can I ask how many stepchildren you have? And if you have any, what your relationships are like with their BM, and what your partner/husbands relationship is like with his ex?

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    As I said in an earlier post, if my daughter were to ask her friend/neighbor/whomever if she could borrow something, I would think it extremely odd if the mother were to insist that I ask. Obviously the friend/neighbor should ask her own mother or father if she could lend the item (assuming it was something expensive), but there is absolutely no reason for ME to ask anyone anything.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Any of your children ever borrowed anything of significance from a neighbor? Was it ever broken or not returned?

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    And why isnt it just as good if Dad asks? And if Dad has a better question with the potential lender doesnt that make sense? This isnt about no parent asking? If my X asked (either now or when we were married) that would be appropriate in my book.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I meant if Dad has better relationship with lender.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I think floggin' some dead horses on the lending/borrowing topic. I think it was pretty much agreed upon that the real issue runs alot deeper here.

    Mr. Openskies. Are you still there? How much of the daily routines with your children (i.e., bathing, cooking, washing clothes, picking up after, helping with homework exc.) does your current wife do when your children are with you? I have come to the conclusion that you never hear stepDADS with issues mainly because being male, the majority of them do not do the majority of the child rearing.

    It's easy for women who are working their tales off to care for someone else's children to feel slighted if not given the proper respect. I think if more men pulled their load caring for their children there wouldn't be so much animosity between stepmoms and biomoms. I would be pissed off too if I was the one being the main care giver to a man's children but was treated like a lesser provider by the chidren's mother.

    Now I am in no way saying you do this Mr. openskies but really think about how much your wife does for your kids and whether or not you do as much. It could be fueling the problem. There is nothing worse than being exhausted because you are a parent and then not being treated like a parent. You can't have it both ways. Either raise your own children or include the step parents in parenting affairs.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Also, it doesn't matter whether or not the parents get to CHOOSE the step parent. Kid's don't get to CHOOSE their bio parents either but it makes them no less family.
    Thats what a family is....relationships built with people that you don't have any say in picking out.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    That is not an appropriate analogy. We are talking about the adults here, and the mother DID choose the father, and the father DID choose the mother. Although they may change for the worse, at least you had some say. You even get to choose your mother and father-in-law, your brother and sister-in-law, and your stepchildren - if you really don't like any of them, you don't have to get married. You get to have a say in who your children's teachers, doctors, friends, scouts leaders, babysitters, etc. are - if you object to any of these, you can change them. The only people who spend significant time with your child that you don't have any say about are stepparents/stepsiblings.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I really think this is getting ridiculous. Openskies has said more than once that his Wife wants to be the one in communication with his ExWife.

    That is the problem here and I'm having a hard time figuring out why posters keep trying to imply that Openskies doesn't appreciate his wife, lets her do all the work and doesn't get thanks....yadda yadda yadda.

    YES, we know it is not about the equipment. Got it. Openskies has said his wife wants to be the communicator....sounds pretty logical why she pulled that stunt after knowing that.

    And what the hell is this about asking neighbors? LMAO, the girls father was RIGHT THERE in the room.

    And no, Doodleboo we don't get to choose our Bio Parents. More the reason why Steps need to monitor their own reactions and take accountability for when they are wrong to their spouses children.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    You guys are funny.

    It has everything to do with the wife feeling underminded and under valued. I don't have these problems because my husband totes his share of the load and includes me in the decision making. I help raise his children so he values and seriously considers my opinions. The power struggle come from feeling totally powerless. We have NO power struggles because we work as a team.

    It is understood by ALL adults that as long as I am the predominate mother figure (meaning untill mom can get her act back together) I will be included in the girls affairs and even after for that matter. I have nothing but their best intrest at heart. Even their mother understands this.

    Everyone here says only the parents can make decisions about medical, school, legal issues....blah blah blah. Not in all cases. I may not be able to go to a lawyer but you better believe the girls father takes every word out of my mouth to heart and 9 times out of 10 we agree. We have no power struggles are power play games because I feel like my concerns, opinions and ideas are heard. I am not the person who is exhausted at the end of the day after chasing after two kids that feels like they are not important in the family.

    KKNY

    Mothers and fathers sometimes happen by accident. Ever here of an oopsie? My husband has said many times he loves his children and wouldn't change them for nothing in the world but he wishes to god he could of picked another mother for them. They were contemplating abortion untill it became known it was twins. Mommies and daddies don't always pick each other either....sometimes nature does the choosing. The girls mom was supposed to be sterile.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    So, Doodleboo what you are saying is that it doesn't matter what conflict arises because of a SM, it is always because the feel undermined and under-appreciated?

    You honestly don't believe that every situation is different? Every SM is different, every BM is different? What works/doesn't work in your situation applies for everyone?

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    That's not what I'm saying at all. The man seems to want a solution and I merely asked him a question and told him how I would feel if that was in fact the situation. Would it not stand to reason that if it's a power struggle between the two women causing problems he could eleviate it by either not expecting his wife to help with his kids and tell her to stay out of it OR make it a point to include her more so she doesn't feel out of the loop?

    Wanting mom to call her is ridiculous but it's coming from not feeling included in the childrens affairs and if she is a very involved stepmother I can see why feelings would get hurt and turn to bitterness and cause these types of problems.

    The stepmother was not ugly to the man's child. She was just acting desperatly for recognition. BioMom's demand recognition. How many times have we all heard the "My child" speech, or it's "OUR business" because we are the parents statement. Why should it be out of the question for a stepmothers feelings to be hurt or to feel insulted if they never receive any? It's a double standard.

    I find it funny that the OP had a perfect answer that keeps him out of all the finger pointing as well. No one is perfect and obviously something is going wrong some where. It can't be ALL his wife. He speaks pretty highly of her. I just know from experience that men that avoid conflict also tend to avoid responsibility equally as well.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    "JNM, SMs get into the situation voluntarily. The SM knowingly (at least for the most part) married a man with children."

    Of course they did, KK. I'm not sure why that statement has to do with anything my post regarding appreciation from a DH?

    "I don't see why it is necessary for mom and SM to have a good relationship."

    I can explain this one, and I would hope you would give the explanation some consideration. My SD's mom made it VERY difficult for years on her daughter for loving me. There were insecurity and jealousy issues that she could not set aside for her daughter's benefit, so she would punish or guilt her daughter into tears. As SD got older she no longer felt that she was, as her mom said, betraying her. She felt that her mom was selfish. She would use mom's insecurity and jealousy to HURT her whenever she felt hurt by mom. It then created a nasty circle of manipulation and anger that has been very hard for them to unwind. They are on the mend, but I fear their relationship will never be what it could have been had her mother not acted this way in the beginning. Rather than viewing me as the enemy or the competition she could have seen me as an ally in raising her daughter. SD is with me 80% of the time and mom knows SD looks to me like a mother. Were it me, I would want a relationship with that person to see what kind of example she is setting. I'd want to talk with her how to handle 'those' questions should they come up. If that was beyond her capabilities she could have just kept her opinions to herself rather that screaming them to me in front of her daughter, and to her daughter when they were alone. Either of these paths would have put SD and her mom on more solid ground. Now, 10 years later, SD is thrilled to have her mom and I "friends." She remarks on it quite a bit. At SD's b-day party party her mom and I worked together to handle a problem SD was having of the female nature, and mom even said to me 'She deals with you better on this kind of stuff - why don't you take over?' I gained so much respect for her at that moment - she had come so far, and I knew saying that couldn't have been easy. She look on SD's face when that happened and she saw us working together was priceless - such relief and joy. THAT, KK, is why the mom's having a good working relationship can be so important. It really makes a world of difference to the kids, especially when the SM is custodial or 50/50.

    Moving on -
    "It seems to me from this comment that it is not that his wife wants a relationship with his exW, but that she wants the exW to know who is REALLY in charge - she is."

    TOS, I have to agree with you. I smirk as I say that I am in charge here, for the simple fact that I know the schedules and handle all those mom things - who needs what for what field trip, who needs a present for what party, who needs new shoes because they have a hole in a sole, etc. BUT, when it comes to dealing with SD's mom, this isn't important. That is the child of my DH and his ex, and therefore THEIR call. 99% of the time DH would talk to mom, come discuss with me, and then get back to her for the simple reason that he didn't know if we had plans for Saturday or what time the dance recital started. I would never think that because I kept track of this info mom should call me directly though. Regardless of the relationship SD and I have, and the fact that mom likely does know he's just turning around to discuss with me, it's still THEIR call and THEIR child. Now mom just calls me if she has a question, but that's because we're BFF's. :-)

    Last weekend we asked mom if she wanted a day with SD because it would have been her weekend but we had it for Memorial Day. Before saying yes she called her husband and called me back. I think it's just a matter of respect for people's schedules to discuss these things with your partner .

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    But here, Openskies did discuss with his partner. And this is not a situation where Xwife has abdicated responsiblity.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I think, actually, she responded before they discussed it? Not sure though from the OP. I agree she was out of line here - there hasn't been a question of that. I'm delving more into the 'what made her react this way' part of it - that often things aren't discussed? Maybe this was a breaking point? Hard to say.

    Say say you about the ease of a good mom/SM relationship though . . . or are you still giving my post careful consideration? :-)

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I'm sorta surprised by the responses to this thread. I have read through them all. I hate to admit this, but I agree with kkny and TOS. I'm not sure how a lot of posters have made the leap that SM is trying to gain some appreciation from BM. That very well may be the case, we don't know all the facts, but why can't it be simply the way Dad explained it - these two women just don't get along and so he prefers they don't communicate.

    Since they have been divorced for ten years I am assuming daughter is at least a preteen but possbily even a teenager. I don't think it is unreasonable to expect the daughter to make sure the sports item is returned and make the sole responsibilty be on the daughter. I agree that this was a failed attempt by the SM in some sort of power play with a woman who she just can't get along with. This was a poor decision and it didn't work.

    What is suprising to me about this thread though is how many times have we seen countless posts from TOS and KKNY where they have accused the majority of the SMs here for having the attitude of "SMs are always right, and BM is always wrong." I always get so angry when they post things like that. Ladies, I think you have made a strong case for them that there might be some truth in that statement. SM in this case made a poor decision, and there are so many posts in here excusing SM for this by saying she must not be appreciated. That very well may be the case, but the fact of the matter is, SM made the poor decision and that's it and now husband is paying the consequences of it by being put in the middle. Are we all really so aligned with SMs that we try to find an excuse for their bad behavior? I'm disappointed.

    I agree whole heartedly that it is most beneficial if all the adults can get along with each other. It's a shame for the daughter that she has to be stuck in the middle of BM and SMs power play with each other. With the information that openskies has provided, I think it is admirable that he recognizes the harm that his daughter would suffer if these two women have to deal with each other. Even BM recognizes this and chooses not to communicate with SM, as is perfectly within her rights. The only one who doesn't like that arrangement is SM and in this case, I think she needs to get over it.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Doodleboo, this is exactly what I am not understanding. It has been stated over and over by me, the OP has posted that his Wife wants to be the one in communication. He has *not* posted anything deragotory about his ExWife other than she does not want to and prefers to communicate with OP. What is wrong with that? And since this is the case, making the case that Wife is doing a lot of work and is unappreciated is even ~more~ bizarre. OP is doing his share of work, the Wife just wants to be the communicator.

    This isn't a power struggle. Quite frankly, I'm struggling to understand how some posters on this thread have jumped to the conclusion that it is one.

    Starr, I'm right with you. I agree with KKNY on most things, anyway though.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Starr, who said that the stepmom was right? I'm confused. I never saw where anyone said that she was in the right. Rather people where giving suggestions of why she might be acting ridiculous.

    Openskies seems to want to stay married so I don't think telling his wife to "get over it" is the answer he is looking for. I think it was a case of wanting suggestions on how to smooth the situation over so all parties are semi-happy. I don't think this woman is a controlling crazy person or he wouldn't be speaking so highly of her.

    I never said she was in the right for telling the daughter to tell mom to call her. Never. Just to make that clear....

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I dont think we can tell what is driving SMs request. She may be resentful of the mom -- not having to work, and wants to make it clear that if the equipment is broken or lost, the mom, not the dad will pay. However, that is between dad and mom. But Openskies says this is a general request, that she and X speak. I think Openskies should ask his wife WHY she wants to talk to X? If I were Openskies I would tell wife that before she knows it, DD will be off to college.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    KKNY - I agree. There needs to be some getting to the bottom of the reasons why this is so important to SM.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Maybe he did try to tell us -- "forgot to mention, just to provide a clearer picture, that a big thing for my wife is that she believes I should force my ex to have to communicate with my wife, such that it is transparent in our household which one of us my ex talks to about issues. "

    I am not quite certain I understand that -- but it may mean that SM wants to make certain that mom understands that SM calls the shots. Again, whether SM calls shots in her household is between her and DH. DH is there to see that child is treated fairly. He can communicate to X.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Thanks for reposting that KKNY. One word out of that perked my ears -- "transparent." That word is commonly used by marriage counselors (of a certain variety) to help in adulterous situations.

    I.E. Husband cheated on Wife. Wife now wants the passcodes to read Husbands email to start making their relationship/situation "transparent." The wayward partner is supposed to make everything "transparent" in his life to repair the relationship, the relationship is then to become "transparent" so that the betrayed partner can start building back trust in the wayward partner.

    Initially I found it curious that OP used that word, then quickly forgot about it. In no way am I stating that Openskies cheated on his Wife, but I am curious to know if Wife perhaps has had issues in past relationships.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I just see it as SM not only wants to control, but wants to make certain mom knows it. Seems counterproductive to me. Likely to annoy mom.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I've wondered as well if SM has some insecurities regarding her husband's relationship with his ex thus resulting in her need to be seen and the head honcho. Interesting take on 'transparent.' Openskies, if you are still around can you shed some light?

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Ok folks lets remember your asking a DAD to read al these posts!lol
    Lets all pay atention to his first line"My ex left me about 10 years ago for someone else."I eventually met someone and remarried. That is the story in a nut shell. Read it a few times.
    Now in every divorce there must be ground rules with all party's. Dad needs to be responsible for his daughter and her needs and step mom needs to take care of her daughters needs.
    As children get older their needs change and in order for her needs to be met she needs to communicate with her parents. If mom signs up daughter for sport those costs should be shared by both parents child support generally does not include activities .If they were married still how would this have been handled. That is how it still should be handled. The parents are no longer MARRIED however they are still parents.
    Step mom needs to raise her children and in no way shape or form should the BM have to ask her for anything. The daughter should be told when you have a item that you need for school, sport ect ask both parents and decide who will take her to purchase it. Let daughter start taking responsibilty for her needs it will help her for when she is on her own to know steps to doing things.
    step mother needs to face the fact that when she married him she knew he came with a daughter and he wants to be a father. SM needs to attend to her own children and there father .Blending families are very challenging but if everyone can stop and realize this will pass and they will be grown up and then depending on the childrens feeling for you will mean whether they include you in there future. Weddings grandchildren ect. Look at the bigger picture. Set good examples for how to deal with situations try not to rock the boat. Make a packed to love each other enough to step back and let each person be a parent even though they are no longer married to there exs remember they were parents prior to marriage to you ,fact is you signed on for the whole package . Your children will thank you one day and your spouses will love you for being a positive support for them.
    Now Dad move on your no longer allowed to drag that dead blanket of "my ex left me for someone else" Your remarried to a person who deserves you only thinking about your future with her not your past with someone who was soooo stupid to leave you. The best revenge is happiness. try it. Just thank your ex for leaving you so you could find the person you were meant to be with. Tell your current wife you love her for being there and loving you and your daughter and one day this wont matter. good luck Sandi

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I am not certain Dad is dwelling on his X left him, he may be just trying to tell us that his current wife was not involved in the marriage break-up. Which I think is important background info. Others may disagree. It sounds to me that he does love, honor and respect his current wife. I suspect current wife is a little on the controlling side (NOT crazy as someone said). If Dad is doing a good job, and mom is living up to her responsibilities, I don't know why SM would want to communicate. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Justnomartha, I suggested the same thing in one of my previous posts (insecurity). SM might be having an issue with her DH's relationship with BM (talking too much on the phone, being too nice to her, or maybe not being completely over her etc). Insecurity came to mind right away. And trust. SM might not trust her DH. So she wants to be the one in control. I suspect that what it is.

    Other than that I cannot think of any other legitimate reason. If My X's wife asked me to call HER if DD needs to borrow anything in her dad's house, I would assume his wife lost her mind. I don't think it is a normal request, so there is more to this story...

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Hi! I don't think any issue in the best interest of your children is minor. I think it's great that you are reaching out. I agree with you, I think counceling would be key. I wish my hubby was on speaking terms with his x wife she refuses to speak to him regarding their two children, it's sad. I urge him to develop a civilized relationship with her for the sake of their children, but she refusues. I wish it to be as normal for the kids as possible. I guess I feel a break up between parents doesn't need anymore negativity added to it. In my opinion my hubby's x still harbors anger and resentment towards him for their failed marriage and getting remarried? I believe a lot of x wives feel they are entitled to more? I think your current wife has feelings of anger in having to deal with her in your daily lives along with being taking advantage of? I bet she also feels that your x is ungrateful for all that you guys do? I agree that your x should not have to call her for approval and she definitely should not involve the children. Counceling may help her see this without thinking your taking the x's side? As a human current wife myself these feelings aren't welcomed, but there they are and it sucks because you feel bad, but you don't want to be a door mat either. my hubby and I also send tons of $$ in CS and his son lives with us. My hubby's x still collects $$ for him and refuses to straighten this out with CS since she's local, she wont budge. We had to hire an atty. When you or someone you love is being taking advantage of our reactions aren't always nice. I've tried to be disciplined with these feelings, but I think we too may eventually have to seek counceling someday? I think you're great and with patience it will all work out. Best of luck!

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Hi Again,

    I must admit I didn't envision that I'd have to read so many posts to answer questions :)

    There is completely no issue here in our household about either of us being appreciated. You'll have to trust me on that. I am very involved in the raising of my own children and stepchildren, and do plenty of the housework, cooking, driving, etc. We thank each other often for some of the things people sometimes take for granted.

    There are alot of assumptions and interpretations here that are kind of going off on a tangent and incorrect.

    I would like to point out that someone correctly understood that I was not dwelling on the fact that my wife left me, but was merely clarifying that my current wife was not involved in my 1st marriage breakup, because otherwise there would be lots of questions/assumptions centered around the possibility that my ex doesn't like my wife because of something like that.

    To answer another question, there is definitely no concern on my wife's part about too much communication with ex etc.

    All I can say is we all handle these things differently and have different needs. I do not have a need to be in the middle of my wife's communication with her ex. It just isn't important to me. If he calls, he asks for her, he doesn't run things by me. My wife and I do talk and share opinions between us about all of our children, but she communicates either her or our shared opinion to him. So, my needs here are not the same as my wife's, ie. to become actively involved in communication. kkny seems to interpret fairly accurately without me writing a 10 page document that would describe more and more detail.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Sounds like the perfect marriage then ;)

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I just find this whole subject bizarre...I have no desire whatsoever to "communicate" with my DH's Ex. Now, I do NOT mean I have not nor will not talk to her, but her kids are DH's kids, and they need to communicate, not me.
    In the beginning, BM implied that someday we would be friends, or "get along just fine." She also wanted me to call her if I had a problem with (disciplining) her kids- while she was 850 miles away. I would have spent 5 hours a day on the phone with her, and to what end? This kind of long-distance parenting seems odd; doesn't it make more sense for their FATHER to handle their behavior in our house?
    My point is, expecting BM to ask for an item for DD (to use once?) from Dad's house seems strange. SM and Dad could have decided together if this borrowing was ok or not. If it was lost or broken, it could be replaced the same as buying new to begin with. This is why I do not believe this issue is at all about some sports equipment.
    The only way this need for communication makes sense to me is if SM felt put out because BM could easily afford a new gadget, and SM feels BM is being cheap/taking SM and Dad for granted/assuming anything in Dad's house is automatically DD's by default.(My SC have no qualms about going into their "dad's" room, using anything they please, or hiding stuff in their suitcases before they fly home.)
    Since OP did not state that BM suggested this borrowing, I can't figure out what his wife is thinking, but I thought of one reason why SM wants to communicate with BM. Not having any direct communication with BM might make SM feel like she is always left out of the loop. Like BM and DH are running the show, and she is just an observer. Especially since there is 50/50.Perhaps SM just wants her voice heard and to hear from BM first hand, not translated by DH or SD.

    Finally, we don't know how much OP really does in caring for the home or children, but my gut says his wife doesn't like feeling like an unpaid employee who is never invited into the boardroom.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    But the biological mother and father ARE supposed to be running the show, when it comes to raising their daughter.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    TOS, that seems to be the basis for many hard feelings here. Some SMs with absent or virtually absent moms give advice that while I am certain is well intended doesn't translate well to situations where the mother is not absent. Its fine for SM to complain on this board, or to Dad, or to her own mother, but the mom and the dad are the ones who are supposed to be running the show.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    absolutelly agree, kkny, most of the situations described in this forum are situations with moms being on drugs, or criminals, or living far away and very minimally involved in parenting. But these situations are rather uncommon IRL. I have met very few such families in my entire life. So when people tell me I have to be greatful for everything SM does for my kid or SM needs to be in the "boardroom" with mom and dad, it is hard not to laugh.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I think many men (no offense Openskies) tend to leave out little details from their discussions with BM. Then SM is left holding the bag because she didn't have all the info in the first place. There have been plenty of times when I've had to cancel plans that I made because my BF left out a critical part of arrangements made with BM. In that case, I can see why SM would want to be party to conversations. Especially if she's the one that does the planning of things. Maybe it's been a problem. We don't really know. There have been times when I've repeatedly (and I mean like 10 or more times) asked my BF to get woth BM for info on something FSD is doing and he never did. So I have called her myself so I know how to plan something.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    TOS, I agree except this:
    When it comes to people or things in SM and Dad's HOUSE, Dad and SM run the show. Not just dad for dad's kid or stuff and SM for SM's kid or stuff.If each adult has exclusive rights over "their" child or belongings, then we are back at square one- sports equipment belongs to SM's child.
    So, by your reasoning, SM was correct to demand a conversation with at least one BP about the borrowing, although in my eyes she should have chosen Dad. More reasonably, she should have agreed on her own, unless there was a major reason to deny the request. If her denial was questioned by BM, through the SD or Dad, then she should have the right to address BM. It doesn't matter who bought the thing, the question is who owns it now? Are SC's belongings only half theirs if they were paid for by BP and SP? No. If we buy something for my SS, my son doesn't have a "right" to use it just because I contributed.It would be nice of him to allow SS to borrow it, but not mandatory. Do all of our children have the right to eat the food we bought for the entire family, yes. Does SD have a right to the food items bought specifically for her, regardless of who paid for them? Absolutely. I could go on with this for days...
    I suspect that SM might see it as her child only has one home, and one set of things, while SC has two, including a wealthier set of parents in her second home.

    In the original post, Openskies said,"The issue my wife has is that we pay my ex lots of $$ so she feels like she should be forced to buy this item that would be used only once."

    This is why I believe SM feels put upon or taken advantage of. Just because OP contributed somewhat to the purchase of said item, that does not negate SM's feeling of ownership.
    Of course, remarried parents could play this game right down to the squares of bath tissue.
    It appears petty, but in SM's mind, it might be that she is trying to set up boundaries, before the borrowing of more important things come into play.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    If Mrs. Openskies is worried about more borrowing, she can express that to her DH. And why would Mrs. Openskies think her children only have one set -- they have a father too. As someone else pointed out, assuming that child has assets from other household can be untrue.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    sounds like Mrs Openskies hasn't had much luck expressing her worries/concerns/wishes to her husband.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    "And why would Mrs. Openskies think her children only have one set -- they have a father too. As someone else pointed out, assuming that child has assets from other household can be untrue."
    Wow, you answered your own question.
    OP stated his Ex is wealthier, but didn't mention SM's Ex's financial status.Perhaps her own child truly only has one set of parents (Mr and Mrs Openskies) with any financial means. If BM is more well off than OP and his wife, why shouldn't OP's daughter have two sets? Oh, wait, because his EX expects OP and his wife to buy her daughter extra stuff in addition to paying CS and feeding and clothing her at their house per the 50/50 arrangement. Can you possibly see where SM's angst is coming from, now?
    And before you say it, of course Mrs Openskies' daughter deserves to have a Biodad who supports her, but we cannot assume she does. We can assume that Mr Openskies' daughter has a Biomom that CAN. Does she?

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    CS is determined by another of things, including income of both parents. SMs X is not absent, as OP has had conversations with him. Maybe BMs DH makes more, but stepparent income is not ordinarily imputed for CS purposes. As I said before SM may have envy, and there are no easy ways to deal with that. But it is important for Mr. Openskies to recognize what the real issue is. If it is envy -- the reaction of making demands that Xwife talk to her will likely not be productive.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    You are right, but this is about extras, not CS. If SM feels that on top of CS and regular necessities SD requires (during her 50/50) that BM is expecting Dad (and therefore SM) to pay for extras, I can see her problem.
    It would feel like BM considers her husband's money as separate and not to be used for her child, but SM's to be part of Dad's available income. Who would be purchasing the sports equipment if there was no SM, and therefore no item to borrow? Assuming Dad's income was the same, and his CS and custody the same, could he afford this item on his own, or would he ask BM to split the cost? (BM could use some of her CS, or ask her husband to help.)If both parents were still single, how would the item be procured?
    This is all outside the context of the original post, but it makes me wonder.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    "You are right, but this is about extras, not CS. If SM feels that on top of CS and regular necessities SD requires (during her 50/50) that BM is expecting Dad (and therefore SM) to pay for extras, I can see her problem."

    The problem is that not only are there bound to be plenty of costs for "extras" that are going to be incurred in raising children (I mean, if we're considering anything beyond food ---but not necessarily FAVORITE food, just food--- and, like, Hanes 3-pack basic white tees as clothing and the cheapest uglist Walmart notebook and Dixon Ticonderoga #2 pencils as "extras")... but that the definition of "extras" is very debatable...

    "It would feel like BM considers her husband's money as separate and not to be used for her child, but SM's to be part of Dad's available income. Who would be purchasing the sports equipment if there was no SM, and therefore no item to borrow? Assuming Dad's income was the same, and his CS and custody the same, could he afford this item on his own, or would he ask BM to split the cost? (BM could use some of her CS, or ask her husband to help.)If both parents were still single, how would the item be procured?"

    I just gathered that there happened to be already in existence in the house an item of the kind that was required, which was not being used by anyone else at the time it was going to be needed. In that case, why SHOULDN'T OP's daughter be able to use it? Is it inconceivable that OP's daughter would loan something to her step-sister in a similar situation? Has that never occured before? I mean, yeah, I suppose that for everyone to be perfectly even and everything to be perfectly fair, there should be two of absolutely everything in the house for each of the girls, no matter how easily worked out a sharing plan may be... just so nobody feels like BM is "getting off scot free" or "taking advantage" of the already-purchased hockey stick (or whatever it is). But why spend the extra money (which Dad would be, since he's presumably already paid for half of his step-daughter's item, we can presume he'd be paying half of this item too) or insist or suggest that someone else (BM) spend extra money when there is a perfectly good item right there, which will not be in use, and which the user of (step-sister) has already agreed to lending? It's not costing step-sister or SP anything to lend it, and if it's damaged it won't cost them anything either b/c Dad & BM would pay for a replacement. The only reason would be to (pardon the pun) "stick it" to the person(s) who would be asked to pay for a second one, in one way or the other. Now, obviously, if the item is lost or damaged, or if OP's daughter will be using such an item more frequently in the future, then it's appropriate to purchase another. But to go around and imply that anything shared in the house that's an "extra" has to be purchased separately even for one-time use is just not very family-like. In intact families, no one would dream of proposing a waste of money (on anyone's part) or excessive consumption (and clutter?) of this sort as a general practice...

    I guess that's what I find so colossally sad in these blended family situations. That, as much as many SP's regard the situation like the SK's are "spoiled" b/c they have two households, it's just as often that they end up getting shafted b/c everything gets nickel-and-dimed and bickered over to death. And I'm not even really thinking about in the *material* sense, but psychologically... How do you think it feels growing up where every little item or expense you require as a kid is argued over, debated, and you're made to feel like you're such a source of financial burden and your parents arguing all the time and the expenses paid for are all conditional on how well you (or your mom) behave? Like someone's sitting there all "ca-ching! ca-ching!" every time you express a cereal preference that costs an extra 80 cents, or scowl ("deduct a dollar for the "extra"-nice notebook b/c of your attitude! I don't HAVE to do anything for you!")... and you may, perhaps, be in the regular presence of a step-sibling who (b/c his/her parents aren't divorced) doesn't face the same kind of nickel-and-diming, or you feel like you have to run a decathalon of requests and requests-for-requests to DARE to borrow the item of its "rightful" owner, whom it WAS procured for, presumably without much hubub... I CERTAINLY can understand the need to budget to the point of splitting hairs (b/c there's no choice) when funds are tight (but in OP's case it didn't sound like that was necessarily the case)... but when the situation is more comfortable, nickel-and-diming is unnecessary and rather depressing. Not to mention an enormous waste of energy and a veritable minefield packed chock-full of potential explosions at every little teensy turn. (Which, btw, ain't so great for the marriage, either...)

    Come up with a plan, an agreement, based on reality, decency, common sense, and what you think "family" should mean and general principles of what will/won't be split (or set a dollar amount limit, or an age limit, or limit the extracurricualr activities by quantity). Figure out and decide once and for all on the definitions of "extras" you and spouse agree on and everything should fall into place. If this can't be agreed upon between current spouses, it is not the ex-spouse's fault, and they shouldn't be dragged into the mess. If the CS arrangement is unsatisfactory to both current spouses, seek to have it changed instead of whining/nickel-and-diming/b.s. psychological games. If it's satisfactory to one spouse but not SP, or if expenditures just CANNOT be agreed upon no matter what, then maybe consider splitting finances. But acknowledge that it is the CURRENT SPOUSES who cannot agree on expenditures or come up with a workable plan, so it isn't anyone else's fault or burden to bear if you two can't work it out between yourselves.

  • 5 years ago

    Geesh, buddy. You are acting like you have two wives rather than one. Pick one and/or grow a pair. If you still want your ex- as your wife, then inform your current wife that you prefer your ex- and keeping her happy is going to be your #1 preference, because that is pretty much the way you are acting now. That way, your current wife doesn't have to try to read between the lines any more and suffer for it.

    Yep! I get it now why your ex- and current wife don't get along, or however you put it. Manipulative, controlling BM and weak, enabling DH = step hell. Apparently you are OK with a 3-way marriage. Your current wife, on the other hand, is not, and personally, who can blame her?

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