Shannon, good luck, I dear say you might be better then the designers I have met with (3 this past house and 2 previous house in 2006). I ended up designing our kitchen... and that's my biggest complaint - is that they seemed to just place the cabinets and NOT design. I really wanted a wow kitchen, but I didn't feel any of them came through.. or LISTENED. I think they need to ask for inspiration pictures and such, rather then just use the 2020 program and place cabinets in that fit.

There's one person that comes in here from time to time and used to be a regular fixture here in the Kitchens Forum named paulines that did exactly the same thing, and she's having a ball with it, from what I understand!. I just emailed her and asked her if she has the time to come in. Also, I'm good friends with an award winning KD out in Walnut Creek, California. Shoot me an email, and I'll get permission to give you her email address.

Wow Shannon! That's exciting. I hope it works out for you.

We used a "Certified" Kitchen Designer that we found on a kitchen walk fundraiser in our town last year. She works out of her home, so her situation is a little different than yours. She had no angle to sell any cabinets, although I've since learned that she does indeed work with one cabinet designer that she'll sell to me, if I'm interested.

Anyway, I liked that she came to my home and looked at all my junk to see how we use our space. She talked about the height difference between my DH and myself (6' versus 5'2") and the inevitable height of my two boys, so she planned for the future. She did indeed ask for inspiration photos. She was also candid. She told me that even with a new kitchen, I should plan on putting some of my less used gadgets into the basement, since my footprint still isn't going to be too big and I'm a horder. And, really appealing to me, she asked my budget. I thought that was key. I know some are reluctant to share that info, but I don't see how a kitchen designer can design without it.

She designed 3 different designs, merged the likes/dislikes into another design and then tweaked that one into a final. She supplied a demolition drawing, space plan, elevation plan and lighting plan. Hers are on actual blueprints and were good enough to go to the Village for Plan Review (which is going to take 3 weeks I found out yesterday!). Cost: $2500

We went tile shopping together this week. All finishing shopping is going to cost $95/hr.

I'm also talking to a kitchen designer at a cabinet shop and am having a rather negative experience. Since I've been considering these cabinets, the KD has changed and this new one has come on. So take that into onsideration, although this will be your experience very shortly. Anyway, the problem with the new designer is that she isn't very responsive. I sent her an email on Thursday night asking if the Brookhaven cabinets are indeed particle board, and I still haven't heard back from her. I wanted an appointment to go over the plan and place the order and it'll take her over a week to fit me in! I think part of it is that they haven't given her her own company email yet, and she's using her school email, which she probably isn't checking too often. It makes the company look shoddy, and her look inexperienced. Ask for an email address right away.

Whew! Probably more info than you wanted.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

Congratulations -- sounds like a fun job! Just given my recent experiences, the number one most important thing to me is great service -- by that, I mean return phone calls/emails asap, even if it is to say that you got your client's message and are working on their design, etc. And make yourself available for meetings, etc. on the client's schedule (to the extent you can). Also, never make them feel bad for asking too many questions -- you'll be working on something they will need to pay for and live with for a long time, so they are entitled to all the information available. Certainly, make sure your info is accurate -- the second they catch you making a mistake, they will start to lose confidence in you. (Along those lines, make sure your measurements are correct.) Finally, be interested in their project and don't make them feel like you're doing them a huge favor by helping them! Good luck to you.

Tinker nailed it above. The biggest problem I had with the two KDs I had (and ditched) was that neither one listened to me. I had very specific things that I did and did not want, but they knew what my kitchen would look like before they ever met me. They wanted to make my kitchen fit their plans rather than design a kitchen that would meet my needs. I would have appreciated their ideas and suggestions much more if they had incorporated the things I said were important to me.

The other big issue for me was respect for my budget. Both KDs listened to the amount I told them I had to spend and assumed that I really meant I'd spend about 50% more than that. I can understand some cost overruns as a job progresses, but to plan on being over budget from the beginning was just rude--and it cost them both a job.

I ended up doing my own plan (with help from the kind folks here) and my cabinet maker tweaked it. He quoted me a price as soon as the basic plan was done, and he never wavered from that price, even when I made some changes that I know cost more. I appreciated that more than I can say, and along with his excellent craftsmanship, it is one of the main reasons that I will refer him to anyone I meet who is redoing their kitchen. I will not refer the previous KDs to anyone. In fact, I will steer people away from them. Reputation is so important in a field like this, and the KDs I dealt with did not seem to understand this.

I agree with holligator on the two most important things besides an eye for design and being very familiar with the market... listening and respect for budget.

We paid the KD hundreds of dollars for a number of drawings and variations of drawings, all but two of which had the refrigerator where I had expressly told her I didn't want it any longer... what we received was useless to us. She also insisted on drawing our old kitchen, which ate up money and wasn't needed. We went elsewhere.

Thanks again for the heads-up Bill (I sent you an email).

Bill wrote, "Also, I'm good friends with an award winning KD out in Walnut Creek, California." - I'll also add that her designs have been published in many better design magazines and she is a judge in/for upper end KD competitions - very respected in the field. She contacted and motivated me to design professionally and thus my start.

That said, here's what I can offer you, Shannon.

As others have mentioned, listening is key. I have found it much harder to listen and absorb, than talk, lol. It's a skill that shouldn't be taken for granted.

Assess your client's needs. Are they primarily a cooker (what types of food?), baker, entertainer or all of the above? Do they have small children/elderly folk/special needs/pets in the home? Are they planning to sell the home in the near future? Be observant - is DH 7' and DW, 5' tall? Is the home an older home where systems, structure and/or walls can be of issue? How can you improve the flow of the home?

Budget. My own kitchen remodel was done on an extremely tight budget and clients can have an effective and beautiful kitchen for *relatively* little money. Think outside the box and be creative. Present your clients with three choices (low, middle & high end) for their material selections, make your recommendations, and then let the client set their priorities.

Know your products/materials (and vendors). How do they perform? It sounds as if you will be working for a shop that carries certain lines? - what is the pros/cons of each line and what is the value to the client? I will only recommend resined stone to clients that want stone. I've done much research and imo it's a better material. I think hdpb is fine for most applications and a great money saving alternative. Which u/c lights (and what's proper placement) give the client optimal focus lighting or ambience lighting?

Good management/people skills. Be responsive, if you don't have an answer to a question(s), let the client know *exactly* when they can expect the answer from you. Folks tend to be a bit ansy, when they're eating mw dinners off paper plates in a dark, dust filled space with men in work boots at every turn, lol. Advocate for your client and never say it can't be done until you've exhausted every option!

Love of food/cooking/entertaining - I'm a foodie (had a small catering/party planning biz for many years). This has translated perfectly into KD. JMO, but I wouldn't do business with a KD who doesn't cook, lol

KD is a crazy, demanding, rewarding profession. I wish you th best!

Thank you all for the great and valuable advice! I know that I will be great at this! I have many years experience in diy home remodeing and I am a crazy researcher when it comes to each project. It may be the wrong economic time to go into this business, but I am going to give it a shot!When we do bounce back I will be ready to go!

Hopefully I can learn the fine art of listening! Sometimes I can be a lil chatty!

Thank you all again!

Sadly, I had a *bad* experience with my kitchen designer. I paid him $1500 for plans. I told him my budget parameters were $125,000 (for planned costs) up to $150,000 (for budget overruns). He presented me with a proposal for $180,000. I balked and told him that I needed to stay within my budget parameters. He hinted that his design retainer had just about been exhausted. (At this point, he had spent about 12 hours working with me).

Nevertheless, I asked him to eliminate some specific cabinets to reduce costs, specifically a bank of cabinets for a message center and another bank of cabinets for a microwave oven. He also reworked an apron around the island that he had designed which he stated would have required some costly hand carving. These modifications reduced the cabinets costs by $14,000.

The numbers were still no good. Furthermore, I vetted the design on this forum and learned that my kitchen layout wasn't very functional because of a whopping "barrier" island. With the invaluable help of many kind hearted and generous forum members, I came up with a few modifications (slide the fridge a few feet, add a prep sink, shrink the island) and asked the KD to incorporate the changes into the design to overcome the barrier island issue. He like the changes and agreed they made the kitchen more functional. He wrote that he would "make the changes and get the plans to me for approval as soon as possible."

ONE MONTH LATER. I politely email to touch base and inquire when I could expect the revised plans. Two days later, I receive an email from his "assistant" that read as follows:

Hi ...., thanks for checking in. [KD] and I have had many conversations about the

status of your job and the amount of time that we have spent on these designs already.

Our initial design retainer is based on completing a design concept, budget pricing, and perhaps 1 or 2

mild revisions. It is loosely based on 15 hours of design and meeting time and we have certainly

exceeded that number.Â

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If you would like us to continue, an additional $3,000 retainer will be required to continue. This, of course,

will be credited to your cabinet order. We always like to see our designs come to fruition, so please accept

our apologies for the lost time and lack of communication regarding this subject.

Â

Please call or respond to this email to let me know you wish to proceed.

I wrote back that I WOULD NOT pay an additional $3000 to get what I should have gotten in the first place. The KD himself sent me a rather rude reply.

The "break up" took place at the end of March. The irony is that when we started working together - in June of 2007 - we had targeted March 2008 to start the remodel. I'm kind of back at square one. I've worked on finding a replacement KD in fits and starts but frankly my experience has left me burned out. I just dread going through the process all over again.

In sum, my experience with this particular KD has been a real setback and try as I might, I can't get rolling again... Ahhhh.

As a KD, I have a bit of advice for anyone consdering it as a career.

1. Educate yourself in overall construction techniques and all aspects of the trades. This is often a KD's biggest lack in education because it's very often left out of the "design" programs at most universities. Know national and local building codes. Buy the book if you need to. Learn about plumbing, electrical, HVAC, and flooring as well as finish carpentry and cabinet making. Never pass up an opportunity to converse with any of the tradesmen on the jobs. You never know where your next bit of useful information will come from, and it helps to be perceived as friendly and caring to those other trades you should be working with, not against.

2. Know your spec book. Anyone can put boxes on accurately measured walls. That's not designing. That's about 15% of the work of desgining a kitchen. The rest of the 85% is in knowing which boxes will actually work and add function without blowing the clients budget. You only know that by learning your spec book. If cabinet line XYZ has 5 different options of finishing off a cabinet size along with 5 different (but similar) codes for those 5 ways, you'd better have your spec book in hand when designing or ordering. When the new book comes out, take the time to look over every page. You never know what has changed, and the cabinet reps sometimes aren't the mose useful of info sources.

3. Get out of the showroom. Go to any of the sites that are in the middle of installs and watch. Stay out of the way, but learn. Make friends with the installers and buy them coffee and donuts to start the day, and while they're enjoying that, ask them questions about "real world" of installing cabinets vs. the "design world" that some designers never are able to get out of. Installers know what will work in a kitchen and what's a ridiculous waste of space and money. They save your butt by suggesting creative solutions to problems that arise. They're a better source of design education than are many designers. And watching a design come together in 3D right in front of your face really does help to cement the the translation from paper pictures and diagrams to reality. Kitchen designers who are on site and learn from their installers become better kitchen designers.

4.Learn from your mistakes. Sounds simple, doesn't it? It's not. Some people NEVER learn from mistakes and keep repeating them time and again. THey're usually the boss's relatives and can't be fired. "grin] Everyone will screw up some time. Always own up to it right away. NOthing is worse than to try to cover it up or shift the blame. NOt only is it unprofessional, but it doesn't teach you anything. Be solution oriented, not blame oriented. Keep the customer in the loop on the problem solving. That doesn't mean that they should be right there in the middle of a very technical trades issue, but it does mean calling them back even if there is no news to tell them. "Hello Mrs. Smith, This is Isabella at Wonderful Kitchens. I just wanted you to know that we're still waiting to hear from the manufacturer about that issue that you have with your pantry door. I spoke to Becky Lou there this morning and she told me she'd get to me by tomorrow. I just wanted you to keep you up to date on what's happening, even though nothing much really is happening." And document everything. Take notes on everything so that you can go back and review if some question arises.

5. Be prepared for a lot of hard work and long hours and not very much money. That's a deal breaker for most in the end. It's like real estate, or Mary Kay. 80% of the people that go into KD really are in love with the fantasy of being a KD, and not the reality. THe reality is, you'd better love your job, because it takes a long time to work your way up to making any real money at it. And, the whole while you're broke and eating peanut butter sandwiches, you have to dress for success to impress the clientele. People want a designer who looks like she is a "designer". They don't want somone in jeans and a t shirt no matter if they have 30 years of experience. Thrift stores and stock overrun places are your friend, and nothing says "designer" like a wierd scarf and some goofy eyeglasses. It's a stupid game, but those are the rules the clients expect you to play by.

6. NEVER stop learning. Hang out here. Read all the magazines you can get your hands on. Go to appliance seminars if you can. (Ask the local appliance store to let you know the next time a manf. rep will be in and go talk to them.) Have an insatiable curiosity about everything kitchen or construction related. Know about sun tubes, the insulating prperties of icystyrine, the standard size of Kitchen Aid mixers, the Janka scale hardness of oak vs. Brazillian Cherry, where to get rain glass locally, who will take donations of old cabinets, which plumbing firms to smile when the client asks about and which to frown about. If you don't cook, learn how and make dinner in your own kitchen at least twice a week. Learn about different cuisines, even if you don't like them. LEarn about different kitchen gadgets and how often they will or won't be used. Keep up on color trends, wood trends, as well as "classic" style.

Be an information sponge.

7. Know when to shut up. OK, you've amassed all of this knowlege and you do this for a buisiness and your client only does this once in her life. So you start telling her about all of this knowledge in your head that just wants to burst out. She doesn't care. What she cares about is HER kitchen. And, every kitchen will be different, even if they look virtually identical. Listen to your client and TAKE NOTES about what SHE finds important. If you see her searching for ideas, then offer to educate her about her choices. Always mention that there are other choices/alternatives to what she wants, but unless she shows some interest in hearing about those additional choices, you come off as pompous trying to tell her about what she wants in her kitchen. If she's making a really bad decision about her kitchen in your experience always bring that to her attention gently. "Mrs. Applebottom, have you thought about trying a mock up of having only 30" aisles around that 48" wide island. I think it might be a good idea to try that to see if that really will be functional for you." I know I said to know your bulding codes, because they are usually there for safety reasons, but your customer really doesn't care about codes. SHe DOES care about safety. Explain the reasons behind the code if she's about to do something stupid, but she doesn't want to hear that it's against code. If she insists on doing something stupid, then you have your notes (remember, I said take notes) to fall back on when she comes to you a month after the finished product to whine about not having room to open her oven door because of that darn big island.

Being a KD is wonderful fun! But, it's also like renovating your own kitchen every day, every month, for years ongoing. YOu have to stay on top of the details. And if you find you don't care about the details, then it's time for you to quit.

Wow, this has been a very interesting thread to read! We just finished up with a total kitchen gut and remodel in late-Novemeber. We used a great KD, but it took a long time to kind a good one. This is my short list:
(1) * remember that this is their kitchen, not yours. Find out what their cooking and eating habits are. What their dreams and dislikes are and create their dream kitchen, not a variation of yours.
(2) Listen; take copious notes, stay organized and return calls promptly.
(3) Know your products, backwards and forwards.
(4) Always keep their budget in mind
(5) You'll need thick skin, a good sense of humor and the patience of a saint!

Good luck with this new venture of yours!