In my experience some of the early "English Roses" exhibit a growth habit very similar to what we associate with the Hybrid Perpetuals; i.e. long lanky canes that only bloom at the tips. However, the English Roses are in all actuality a very mixed bag when it comes to growth habits and remontancy. For example, my favorite English Rose MOLINUEX exhibits a growth habit and repeat bloom similar to a Floribunda. HERITAGE has always reminded me of the Bourbons (although the pale warm pink color is more on par with the Alba MAIDEN'S BLUSH) and THE PILGRIM looks like a Tea-Noisette (the light green foliage, climbing canes, delicate yellow flowers and Tea Rose fragrance are the selling points). Then there is WILLIAM SHAKESPEARE 2000, which has flowers that are dead ringers for a highly developed Gallica combined with a short, spreading shrub. It is of my opinion that what David Austin is really trying to achieve is a class of remontant Centifolias. These are the "Old Rose Hybrids" he seems to favor. The flower form is more globular (i.e. cabbage like) than the quartered, cupped or semi-double formation found with so many of the Old Garden Roses. Growth habit is medium in height and bushy to slightly spreading in habit. Remontancy is continuous, similar to a Floribunda or a shrub rose like BELINDA'S DREAM. Disease resistance is steadily improving, with THE MAYFLOWER representing a true success in this area. Fragrance is strong and intense. Among his "Old Rose Hybrids" he seems to favor bouquets dominated by the classic Damask scent, but as we've seen isn't adverse to putting out a myrrh scented rose. All these factors add up to what I think David Austin is trying to achieve in his breeding programs. BTW, speaking of Myrrh - I hate it. The scent first appeared among David Austin's roses with the once blooming CONSTANCE SPRY, which is the result of a cross between BELLE ISIS (Gallica) x DAINTY MAID (Floribunda). I've been told it's strong myrrh fragrance is sweeter than most, but I really can't say for sure because I don't grow once bloomers. I do have a few of his other myrrh scented roses and can report with a degree of certainty that the fragrance mix varies considerably. For example, I really like TAMORA's fragrance, which is a blend of fruit and myrrh. Others not-so-much. Frankly I won't buy a myrrh scented "Austin" until I get a chance to smell it first. Just my 2 cents worth. Best wishes, Patrick

Vintage Gardens, to me, is more trusted with the identity of their antiques because they continue to investigate what they have, compare to old records, and have no problem issuing their identification as tentative by placing the name in double quotes. Tammy posted pics of hers, and that is the "thornless RdV" I remember from another nursery -- dull green color to the stems, leaves wider and more rounded, tapering suddenly. Tammy first said hers had thorns, then took the pics and came back saying what she thought were thorns were merely small bumps. My band is just as prickly as a typical Gallica -- no one seeing it would remark about its "smooth canes" because they're not. That's not what I would call the same "a few thorns" as found on Tammy's band -- I can't put my finger on the stem without touching a prickle. The first reference on HMF for RdV is clearly a translation from the French (as noted by both the French title and the text's awkward English). I would much prefer to read the original and translate it myself. It's very likely that the "also the prickles of the branches" which follows a semicolon (which denotes a separation of the second clause from the first, such that it could be its own sentence if grammatically correct, and that the translation isn't makes me wonder about the accuracy of the translation) is not connected to the comment about "red stipules..." It could very well be that missing from the translation is a negative, turning that last bit into a comment about "also the lack of prickles of the branches" which is less awkward of a clause than "also the prickles of the branches." But I can't tell for sure without reading the original French. Be careful about taking an awkward translation as gospel just because it's the oldest. If several descriptions beginning merely a year later describe the plant as without (or almost without) prickles, I'd take that over the claim that the first description (as translated on HMF) is noting "red prickles" which I really don't get even in that awkward translation -- the semicolon would not be used if the "prickles of the branches" were red like the stipules. A comma would be. Also remember that considering the time for a book to come out in print during those years that close together, it's very likely that both authors were writing without seeing the works of the others. Thus the descriptions are better trusted to be based upon actual inspection, rather than copy-and-paste from other authors -- because there wouldn't have been time to read the first description and write it again in a book coming out a year or two later. Ultimately, RdV has had notes in her description over the years about her relative thornlessness. The band which I received would not be called "thornless" any more than many other roses I've seen which never acquired that adjective in their description. Sure, my plant isn't overly thorny, and its prickles are small, but they are not sparse enough for me (or anyone else seeing it for the first time) to say "my, that rose is thornless." But others seeing the real RdV over the years have. That's why I don't think this one is the "real" one, and the one I grew previously (and gave as a gift) was. :-) ~Christopher

I received my box from Deb today. This is what was inside. Thank you very much, Deb. Now I need to get some potted. The flowers the neighbor weed whacked in the highway curb are trying to come back. It looks odd where the blooming Gypsophia ends, though, like the row abruptly stops. I'll be thinking about all of you. Seeds- Orange Cosmos Mammoth Grey Striped Sunflower Sparkler Radish Mimosa Vitex Chaste Tree Unknown colored Cosmos Shasta Daisy "Silver Princess" Pink Oleander Shrub/fragrant (seeds have a poisionous label) Hardcover book- "Scrapbooking with Memory Makers" Tons of ideas, pics. 118 pages package of copper plant markers Roses 1001 Gardening Questions Answered, 131 pages, hardcover Big Crinium bulb! Victoria Principal's book- "30 day plan to look and feel 10 years younger", hardcover. Caladium bulb- "F.M JOYNER" Caladium bulb- "Candidum" More seeds- Lavender '08 munstead Red Kurl Uchiki Kurl Squash Cactus flowered zinnia Lemon Balm Sweet Dumpling Squash 4 O'clocks, yellow Gourd "Straightneck Wrenhouse" Poppy "Peony red" Black diamond heirloom watermelon Zinnia "Cherry & Ivory Swizzle" Scarlet Scarlet Marigold '08 Black eyed Susan vine/Orange Thunbergia Alata "Superstar Orange" Cinnamon Basil Georgia collard greens Marigolds yellow/orange 2 baby cactus 1 Aloe vera pup, rooted 2 cactus pads- outdoor optunia Boston Ivy cutting, very nice!! Thanks again, Deb!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

For all of us "sybarites", I have two looks. When I'm playing ladies, I use my dainty set. It's white fluted bone china with voilet sprays around the edge, and I set it on a pale green damask cloth (second hand from Ebay), with fuscia and gold crystal glasses. Plain white napkins, and an arrangement of delicate fern leaves with plain white candles in the centre. It's all sparkly and delicate when it's set up. Oh, and Vivaldi's Four Seasons in the background LOL But my usual and other look is totally the opposite. Woven bamboo placemats with chunky earth coloured striped pottery bowls, and hot orange napkins. Mpdern glasses with lime green palm leaves etched on the sides, and centrepiece is a black wood dish with big chunky candles set among an arrangement of chiles and/or hibiscus flowers (whatever one is out in the garden). Oh, and soft Calypso mood music in the background! I love the pretty pretty formal look, but I'm simply more at home with ethnic/tropical/casual. One of my DIL's calls the cupboard where I keep the "pretty" things, the Old Auntie's Cupboard. She'll open up the other one where I keep the ethnic pottery sutff, and sigh and say, "This is the cupboard I want to inherit." My other DIL loves the pretty things, so they joke that I'll never have to worry about them fighting about who wants what when I'm dead. They already have it all worked out LOL. I have a tea set of all mix and match cups and saucers that I use when I have "ladies" afternoon tea. All different flowers, that I mix up. And yet, if DH and I want to celebrate something really special, just the two of us.... our most romantic and relaxing very very special favourite? Fish and chips on paper plates in bed, with a good DVD. LOL