It was explained to me that DE is much finer and can filter finer particles. We have a DE filter and our pool is always crystal clear. I can throw a quarter in the 8 foot deep end and tell whether it's heads or tails. I have never seen what a pool looks like with a sand filter but I am very pleased with the DE.

moochie22,
Houseful is correct.
DE filters can filter particles down to about 6-8 microns in size. Sand filters particles down to about 12 microns. Cartridge filters can filter particles of 18-20 microns in size. This doesn't seem like much difference and in most areas the water clarity will be very good. DE filters work better in areas where the source water quality is not so good because they will clear the water faster.
Water in newly filled pools can be clear, green, red, brown, or most any other color of the rainbow.
Other considerations might be the space available to backwash waste water (DE must be replaced and it leaves a white residue wherever you backwash and sand just leaves the dirty water at backwash), city ordinances can also dictate where waste water will be put. Good luck.

We have DE and crystal clear water. My parents have a DE with their pool and when we were choosing our options we were considering a regular cartridge filter. My dad pushed us to get the DE and we are so glad we did. Less maintenance (my neighbors are outside 2 times a month during the summer cleaning off their cartridges) and it is simple to just backwash.

I like the link below for this question....My vote D.E. with a mutiport valve.

Here is a link that might be useful: Filters

Ok not what you are asking but I went cartridge due to no good place to backwash. I only clean my filters 3 times a year and then only because I feel like I should get the dirt out not because the pressure has gone up. If Dischnell's neighbor is cleaning twice a month they must be way undersized. Heck I only clean my cartridge filter in my fish pond once a month

We have what would normally be a sand filter, but instead of sand, we have Zeobrite® in it. Zeobrite® filters down to 3 microns and our water is crystal clear and sparkling. Everyone who sees our pool comments on how clean and clear the water is.

Zeotech is the company that puts out Zeobrite®. This company also manufactures a product called Turf-AidÂ. It's a soil amendment that is used in many golf courses. When you eventually have to replace the Zeobrite® in your filter, you can simply use it as a soil or garden amendment.

I had a cartridge system but went to DE because of ease of cleaning (yes this is opposite conventional wisdom). My cartridge system was a 4 cartridge system and it was simply a nightmare to get truly clean with all those pleats X 4. After installing the DE I was shocked at the difference in clarity in the water. I will never go back to cartridge. Cleaning the DE is not really all the difficult (once you get it down) and it is quicker for me than cleaning my cartidge system was. Your mileage may vary.

-- john

I have the Polaris System 3 with the cartridges...I was told by my builder I could, if I wanted to "rip the guts out and put in a DE that I could." That was a quote! Is this true and if so how do I do it? I have plenty of room to dump the DE and I think I'm due for new cartridges. I'm not excited about $400+ worth of filters. I live out in the country with lots of dust and debris.

Gary

System 3 is a StaRite product. System 3 for capable of all 3 filter media, with a conversion kit. Same tank goes to sand, cartridge or DE. Avoid the Cartridge as they are non-generic and extremely expensive.

I disagree with this post.

"DE filters can filter particles down to about 6-8 microns in size. Sand filters particles down to about 12 microns. Cartridge filters can filter particles of 18-20 microns in size."

Cartridge will filter smaller than sand as stated.

We had also been told that cartridge filtered finer than sand. We also don't clean our filter every month. We've only cleaned it about 3 times in the year we've had it.

You are right, it is a Sta-Rite product, I cought that about an hour after I sent it. So you are saying it is possible, but I have to get a conversion kit? Where can I get one? Thanks for your help I really appreciate it. So you do advise switching from cartridge to DE??

"DE filters can filter particles down to about 6-8 microns in size. Sand filters particles down to about 12 microns. Cartridge filters can filter particles of 18-20 microns in size."

As the Repair_Guy states, that is incorrect.

DE and Zeobrite® can filter down to about 3-5 microns; cartridges can filter down to about 15-20 microns; and sand filters down to about 35-40 microns.

Ah yes, but you must remember that Zeo only filters that good for about the first 10 minutes. Once the passages get clogged, it's no better than sand. DE doesn't suffer as it gets dirty. But you always forget to mention that part.

Also, cartridges are getting better all the time and the "new" generation are much better than 15-20 microns, especially if you go for a hybrid cartridge/DE filter where you get the convenience of cartridge with the uncompromising efficiency of DE.

D.E. filter 5-10 Microns
Cartridge 15-30
Sand Filter up to 100 Microns

The Sand is probably the lowest maintenance, but as you see above that comes with poor filter quality

The D.E. Filters the best with the most maintenance.
Back-washing monthly and Cleaning yearly.
DE powder recharge every time you backwash.
Not to mention some cities are cutting back on allowing you to backwash to the sewer. League city will not allow it to go directly into the sewer.

The Cartridge is in the middle as far as filter quality, but it only has to be cleaned once per season.

"Zeo only filters that good for about the first 10 minutes."

Jeff, please cite your source for this statement.

I will repeat my request.

Jeff, you made a statement, phrased as fact, that Zeobrite® only filters as well as DE for "about the first 10 minutes."

I've read a lot of different articles about zeolites and Zeobrite® in particular, but I have never seen or heard anyone make such a claim before.

So, please cite your source for this statement. If it is just your opinion, please say so.

Thank you.

lindsay_ca said: "DE filters can filter particles down to about 6-8 microns in size. Sand filters particles down to about 12 microns. Cartridge filters can filter particles of 18-20 microns in size."

As the Repair_Guy states, that is incorrect.

DE and Zeobrite® can filter down to about 3-5 microns; cartridges can filter down to about 15-20 microns; and sand filters down to about 35-40 microns.

Me: Sorry lindsay, but zeo will not filter as finely as DE. The little pores in the pieces of zeo may be that small but the spaces in between the individual particles of zeo are much, much bigger than that. Most of the water/dirt will pass through those spaces between particles rather than through the pores in the particles. zeo may be better than sand but it does not approach DE in filtering ability.

I agree that jeff's statement has no basis in fact. To the contrary, all filters will do a better job as they get dirtier.

Kurt -- Please be more careful when you read, and quote, posts. You have just allegedly quoted me when, in fact, I had been quoting another poster's misstatement. When I put something in italics, with a quote mark at the beginning and at the end, that means I have quoted what someone else has written.

My point was that as the pores in Zeo quickly fill, water will seek out the path of least resistance. Since, as Kurtv said, the path between the particles is larger, you quickly go from decent filtering, back down to the level of sand.

And while all filters get better as they get dirty, in the case of Zeo, I feel it is a little different. If the Zeo is properly flushed when initially installed, the filtering can be quite good. But as the pores quickly clog, more and more water will flow around the Zeo, lowering the filtering ability. As the medium gets dirtier, it will start to filter better, but will never again get anywhere close to it's claimed filtering and/or DE.

I just don't get the whole Zeo trend in the first place. I can see people with long established sand filtered pools perhaps trying this, or even bedding with a layer of DE, but in new construction, either DE, DE/Cart, or Cart-only would seem to be a better choice. The new breed large-sq/ft Cartridge filters, using the latest in filtering material are getting near DE in filtering capability.

Jeff

"And while all filters get better as they get dirty, in the case of Zeo, I feel it is a little different."

Then you should not make statements posing as fact when they are simply your speculations. You haven't quoted or referenced anything scientific on which to base your "feelings."

According to the Zeotech web site, Zeobrite® has over 100 times the surface area of silica sand. That gives it much better filtering capability because the "pores can't clog" as quickly as sand.

"I just don't get the whole Zeo trend in the first place."

Well, perhaps it's because it's simply an excellent product that produces excellent results.

Zeobrite® is the filtering media used for the Walt Disney World's Fantasia Pool, the Fort Sam Houston Recreational Pool, and many, many hotel pools and public aquariums. There's got to be "something to it" or they wouldn't be using it.

Lindsey, at least we know you're good at regurgitating Zeobrite marketing material.

You see, in a commercial pool, water park, etc. there is so much crud in the water that it is simply impractical to use something like D.E. With D.E.'s superior filtering ability, the backwashing requirement alone would be too great, and too expensive. Sand has been the #1 choice in the commercial realm for years since, by its very nature, it doesn't filter as well, and thus doesn't require the same level of maintenance. Today however, there are increasing requirements on public pools, water parks, etc. to better control water contamination such as cryptosporidium. By bedding existing sand filters with Zeo, they gain filtering that is better than sand alone, but since Zeo doesn't filter any where as good as D.E., operators can still go longer between backwashing and/or other maintenance.

As for its use in aquariums, it is commonly used in fresh water tanks, not as the primary filtering agent, but as a way to sequester ammonia. Fish tend to generate ammonia, and Zeolites assist in removing it by way of ion exchange. Zeo can't be used in salt tanks because the sodium ions will swap with the ammonium ions thus releasing them back into the water. The Zeobrite cleaning procedure, where you soak it in a strong salt solution, forces the ion exchange. The debate of course, is what if any benefit (past filtering) zeo is to a salt-water (SWG equipped) pools since any ammonium or calcium ions will probably be swapped back for the sodium, thus putting those items back in the pool.

Anyway, I'm no expert in the field, but the above is based on lots of research on the subject, and not regurgitating someone's marketing material.

Aw jeez, they're at it again!

lindsey_ca said: "Kurt -- Please be more careful when you read, and quote, posts. You have just allegedly quoted me when, in fact, I had been quoting another poster's misstatement. When I put something in italics, with a quote mark at the beginning and at the end, that means I have quoted what someone else has written."

Me: lindsey, I was fully aware that you were responding to another post. I failed to add a second set of quote marks and failed to attribute the post you were responding to to repair guy. I apologize for any confusion that resulted. That said, I think an honest reading of my post and a response to the substance of it would have been more appropriate than a pedantic lecture on posting technique. Speaking of posting techniques and conventions, why do you repeatedly insert trademark symbols? It makes your posts more difficult to read and doesn't really add anything. After all, it's up to the entity that holds a trademark to enforce it, not the rest of the world.

Jeff, Very informative and well reasoned post. I don't think, however, that the zeo pores probably do much of the filtering anyway as the path of least resistance is between the particles even with a very clean medium.

Jeff Sessler, ever the gentleman - not.

No, it's not marketing material hype. All you have to do is look at Zeobrite® and silica sand through a microscope to tell the difference in surface structure.

But you've gotten a lot of practice repeating the marketing material of DE filters, haven't you...

The marketing point of Zeobrite is to make your sand filter work like a DE filter. I can see replacing your existing sand with Zeobrite if you have a problem.

We went with a DE filter. We backwash when the pressure gauge starts getting high. It's easy, we hook up a hose and turn the lever from filter to back wash. New DE is poured into the skimmer. Diatoms are a natural product. They are nature's filters. Plankton - it's not just for whales.

KurtV, LOL!!!