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Pie crust made with oil

10 years ago

Does anyone still use oil in their pie crust? I find it easier to roll out crusts using oil but all pie crust recipes that I read about now use shortening or butter. Is it because it's more flakier?

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Comments (6)

grainlady_ks
10 years ago
I'd suggest you make the kind of pasty you like, but here's the technical differences so you'll know what to expect.

Oil makes a very tender crust, but they are mealy and can tend to crumble easily, rather than flaky. And as you mentioned, are somewhat easier to roll out, especially if you roll out between two sheets of waxed paper to make them a little easier to handle.

Oil is considered a warm fat, even if you chill it before adding to the flour, and it coats the flour so well no gluten develops.

When using solid fats (butter, shortening, lard, or mixtures of them) the little pea-size lumps of solid cold fat turn to steam and lift layers of the pastry to create flakiness.

The "perfect" crust is a combination of tenderness AND flakiness. Tenderness if formed when fat is thoroughly mixed with the flour into small particles. The ultimate pastry recipe will have half of the cold solid fat added to the flour until it's thoroughly mixed in to create tenderness. The other half is left in larger pea-size pieces in the mixture, which will build flakiness. Where the fat covers the flour, water can't penetrate and form gluten - it "shortens" the gluten strands - hence the term short-crust pastry.

If you have a problem with rolling out pastry made with a solid fat, you may need to switch to a low-protein flour and keep everything cold. If you use all-purpose flour try adding a little extra fat. Avoid adding too much liquid because the more liquid that is added, the more gluten develops, which ends with a tough crust.

If you need a stronger crust to hold a hearty meat filling, choose a pastry recipe that contains an egg. The extra protein in the egg will reinforce the structure of the pastry.

Some recipes call for vinegar. An acidic ingredient like vinegar brings one more tenderizer to the recipe. Acids soften gluten, enough so they break apart the gluten strands. The result is a tender pastry, but not as much flaky.

Once again, use the type of pastry you like. But a word of warning from a seasoned Foods Judge at Fairs, don't take a pie made with an oil pastry recipe to the fair to be judged. Oil pastry recipes don't pass the test for judging pastry. Many people just like the ease of these recipes, the results and flavor, and at the end of the day that's what counts. So go for it!

-Grainlady
lazycook
Original Author
10 years ago
Grainlady, wow, thank you so-o-o much for all this info. I'm making 2 pumpkin pies to take for Christmas dinner and also an apple pie. Since pumpkin pie only has a bottom crust I suppose it would be ok to use the oil pastry. However, for the 2 crusted apple pie I probably should try for a flaky crust so will use shortening. Re the oil pastry I didn't know that I had to chill the oil. How much difference does that make? I always roll out my dough between 2 sheets of waxed paper on my granite counter no matter what kind of dough.
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I just realized this was a year old thread. Anyhow, if anyone ever reads it again - pie crust isn't all that hard to make. Just remember that what you're doing is shortening the flour, in other words you're rubbing grease onto the flour grains and that prevents the gluten from linking up too easily and making a chewy, rubbery crust. You want to develop gluten in bread, you don't want it in crust. What would you use besides butter? Maybe duck fat or even lard. Don't use margarines or commercial shortenings - they ruin the dough and leave a horrible coating on your mouth and to their credit, the good folks at the NYC Dept of Health banned them in baked goods. Butter has different amounts of water / butterfat ratios. That water isn't going to work on your crust like the water you add to the dough, but it will have an effect on the final product. When you cut the butter in, make sure you leave some larger pieces - pea size for example. It shouldn't be all uniform, which can happen if you use a food processor and run it too long. Pulse it. I always add the water by hand. Add a bit then pinch it together with your fingers. Toss those bits aside and add some more to the dry stuff. It's hard to give precise measurements because you have to go by feel, but figure one part butter to 3 parts flour and slightly less than one part water. And a bit of salt. So in measuring cups, that's like a stick of butter, 1 1/2 cups flour, and somewhere between 1/3 and 1/2 cups of flour. And obviously you can vary those proportions - a little more flour, a little less flour, and your need for water will change accordingly. So add the water by hand and just gently work it with a fork and / or your fingers to make the clumps of dough stick together. Then gather them into a ball and smear the mass across the counter with the heal of your hand. You don't want to knead the dough like bread, but just smear it once or twice. The French call this fraisage and the purpose is to distribute the water and fat. Then gather into a ball and let it rest. Don't roll it right away. Leave it for an hour or more - you'll be surprised at how much easier it is to handle once it rests. The globs of butter you've distributed thru the dough when you rolled it out will melt, the water will create steam, and that will fill the vacuum created by the butter, blowing the crust apart into flakes. If your butter has a higher water content than some, you'll get a harder crust than if it's got a higher fat content - that's because the moisture will be incorporated throughout the crust with the butter. But even with the widely available commercial butters, you'll get a delicious crust. Duck or goose fat make a beautiful crust as well, as does good lard. The texture will differ however, as the water content is different from butter. Also, if you're using rendered duck fat, you may want to eliminate the salt from the dough if the duck has been salted. But taste and adjust accordingly. Any liquid will work, but water is the basic one. Milk contains some fat and solids. Cider, which I use sometimes, contains sugars, which affect the taste - not always for the worse. Vinegar and/or lemon juice also affect the flavor. Cold stock, which is kind of cool to use if you're using duck fat or lard, will have it's own seasonings and may have additional salt. Make sure the liquid is cold - you don't want to melt the fat at all, or make it too warm. It's tricky to use duck fat because it melts so quickly, so you have to work extra fast. Good luck.
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My hunch, if it was central VA and a BBQ place, was that it wasn't a pate sucree or something similar. It was probably an "American" pie crust. You can make a great flaky crust in about four minutes with butter, flour, and a little ice cold water. Can add a pinch of salt if you want. Leave some pretty large chunks of butter and make sure you do the fraisage. Like always, let it sit for an hour or so or even a day before rolling it out. Most likely based on cost and region, they probably used shortening, but don't. It tastes bad and makes your crust have a bad mouthfeel. Just use butter. Bake it well, maybe weighing it down, and make sure you bake it very close to the time you are going to use it. In other words, don't bake it today for use tomorrow or the next day. It's never as crisp as it is the first day. Let it cool, fill and serve immediately. The water from the filling will start to soften it right away, so you don't want to let that sit if you want to maintain the crispiness. This post was edited by rosesinny on Mon, Feb 18, 13 at 17:57
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I have used this recipe for a couple of years now and it is the best I have ever tried. It truly is a NO FAIL crust. And I can't cook! AuntCarol's Pie Crust Â Never-Fail Type This pie crust recipe is one thatÂs SUPER easy to roll out Â one that never gets soggy Â leaving that last piece of pie as good as the first Â itÂs the ONLY pie crust recipe IÂll ever use Â itÂs the BEST Â Ingredients Â 1 egg Â 3/4 teaspoon salt Â 1 tablespoon WHITE vinegar Â 7 tablespoons water Â 1 cup shortening (CRISCO) Â 3 cups flour BEAT egg. ADD salt, vinegar, and water. ADD shortening. BLEND with fork, while ADDING flour about a cup at a time. FORM into one big dough ball. THEN DIVIDE into 3 equal-sized dough balls (or you can divide it into 2 equal-sized dough balls like I do sometimes). ROLL OUT thin on a lightly floured surface and then PLACE into pie pan of your choice. Note: Prepared pie shell should be put into the refrigerator 30 minutes before filling Â and REMEMBER all fruit pies should be baked on the lowest rack in your oven Â ENJOY Â Trish in SC
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westsider40
10 years ago
Hi Grainlady, What is it about a pie crust made with oil that would fail the test in front of you as a seasoned Foods Judge at Fairs? Or any foods judge? And what kinds of oils have been used that are not so good in pie crust? I wouldn't like olive oil as it is too strong and usually 'fruity'.
And I am not a fan of coconut oil or any tropical oil. Thanks.
grainlady_ks
10 years ago
Lazycook-

It sounds like you have everything under control. So few people make their pastry from scratch these days, everyone will love just having pie, without even considering what type of pastry it is. Always chill the oil and the water when making a pastry made with oil. You always need to keep pastry cold, so start with cold ingredients. It doesn't even hurt to have cold flour. Rolling dough on a cold surface also helps. Some people with warm hands will even chill their hands in ice water before handling pastry to keep it chilled - but that's an extreme in pastry making.

If you make a French Apple Pie or a Crumble Apple Pie instead of a double-crust pie, you only need a single crust and crumbles on the top, so you could use your oil recipe.
westsider40\- The standard judging characteristics for pastry products simply cannot be met using an oil crust. The standards are set to certain criteria. We teach 4\-H students how to make pastry to these judging standards. As judges, we receive training in order to judge and we follow a set of judging standards. It's not simply whether we like or dislike something. Judging is based on certain standards for appearance, texture, tenderness, and flavor. You can achieve tenderness with an oil pastry, but the flaky layers from the solid bits of fat forming steam and pushing the dough apart during baking cannot be achieved. Good pastry is a combination of tender AND flaky. And don't confuse the fact that an oil pastry will shatter when you pinch off a piece for flakiness, and the characteristic blisters on the oil pastry are also NOT flakiness. Blisters on the surface means the pastry was over\-handled, or too much flour was used during rolling. The judging characteristics of the texture of the pastry should have layers evident when the pastry is broken. It should be crisp and flaky, not mealy. Oil pastry tends to be dense and mealy. Tenderness is judged by cutting it. It should cut easily with a fork, but holds shape when lifted. Not so tender it falls apart. Oil pastry tends to crumble easily and almost "snap" when being sliced because they are more dense than flaky layers. Oil is considered a warm fat, so it is absorbed by the flour, while solid fats coat the flour. It makes all the difference for gluten formation. A lack of flakiness (mealy or crumbly) can also be caused by too much fat being added, or the solid fat being too warm. \-Grainlady
kitchendetective
10 years ago
What a great thread!
dedtired
10 years ago
Yes -- a great thread. I tried the oil pastry once and did not like it. I like the vodka recipe. However, I am not famous for my fabulous pie crusts or any other baked item!

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