Newbie to water softeners

14 years ago

I've had this Fleck water softener (5600) in the basement since we moved in.

It wasn't running when we moved in and would like to see it up and running.

First question is; It's 17 years old, at best guess. Is it still good?

I found a manual online and believe I have over filled the water level and under filled the salt.

It asked for 5 gallons of water (believe I'm close to that) and 3 bags of salt (40-50 lb bags) I now have 2 in there.

My water level is higher than the salt level and read that's wrong.

I'm heading out to get another bag (or 2) and lower the water level.

Second question; Am I on the right track?

I now I'm not giving you enough info to tell me if the size of the unit is correct and hoping you'll ask so I may learn about this softener and how to operate it.

I have my water test and think I'm ready to forward info, just not sure what....

Here's hoping someone out there can educate me!

Thank you for reading.

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Comments (7)

User
14 years ago
Without knowing the history of the softener that's a hard question to answer...

Odds are, if it wasn't in service when you moved in it had a problem and was put out of service for a reason.

Quality softeners that are sized and setup correctly can last 17 years with routine maintenance DEPENDING on the water conditions.

Now that you've done what you've done, don't do anything else right now.

Post the results of yuor water test.
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olddawg
Original Author
14 years ago
I have a feeling they had the same problem I'm having.
Water tastes like salt.
Water test results;
Nitrate Nitrogen Nitrite Nitrogen <.01>Lead <.005>Iron <.1>Copper <.1>Manganese <.03>Chloride? hole punched through name Sodium Hardness 44
ph 5.92
Fluoride <.2>Radon 941
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I don't sell water softeners so I have nothing to gain or lose in this conversation. That said ... the negatives regarding the pre-built softeners are ... Lower quality materials, mostly ABS which ages and becomes brittle. ABS does not do well with really hard water. On 3 gr hardness city water most any softener will give a decent service life BUT harder water than that seperates the pre-built box store softeners from the quality ones. While all ion exchange water softeners use resin and "tanks" there's a big difference in the resin and resin "tanks". Again, the pre-built softeners do not use the top quality resin from companies like Purolite or Ionac and the materials their resin "tanks" are made of are not the same quality as the Structural brand (10 year warranty) resin tanks the top quality softeners come with. Most of the parts are proprietary and available from limited sources and they tend to be expensive. The pre-built softeners are "cabinet" (all-in-one) designs and are much harder to work on. The cabinet design puts the resin tank inside the brine tank. The routine cleaning of the brine tank is more difficult and takes a lot more time than a conventional design softener but the Sears type does take less floor space (the ONLY advantage in it's design). The greatest falsehhood is that pre-built BOX store softeners are less expensive than the industry standard softeners. The Sears softeners around 40000 hardness capacity generally run a little under $500. For $466 you can have a Fleck 5600SE electronic on demand metered softener delivered to your home including shipping. You'll need to assemble it (takes less than 30 minutes) and install it. You can have a plumber assemble it and install it (you'd need a plumber to install the Sears softener also or DIY). You'll get a control valve that has proved it's reliability over 20+ years, is made of state of the art materials (Noryl) which does not turn brittle and is totally inert. You'll get a 5 year warranty on the control valve and ten year warranty on the resin tank. You can buy parts for the Fleck control valve locally (usually) or all over the internet. Complete parts and service/repair manuals are available for download and there is always someone everywhere who can service Fleck control valves as they are the long established industry standard AND they are as easy OR easier to program than the pre-built softeners. They tolerate the hardest water with no problem. Real softeners generally last 20+ years EVEN on ludicrously hard water while the service life on a pre-built softener seems to be under 5 years (if you're lucky) on really hard water and lasting longer than that is a rare exception. Sears, GE, Waterboss, North Star and the like are the most commonly complained about water softeners on this forum and all over the internet. The Fleck, Autotrol, and Clack water softeners just work and work and work and work and work. IMO it's a simple choice. Spend uncounted hours cruising the internet reading up on how to fix your box store softener and having to do it often OR just walk over to the sink and have soft water. If you want to take the time to learn how to overcome the many design problems of the "cheap(?)" softeners and spend much more time on them when they need maintainence and repair that's your choice OR you can just have soft water and EZ minimal maintainence with a quality softener.
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If there is water in the brine tank to make brine and the control valve is not sucking it out during the appropriate regeneration stage... clogged or blocked brine pickup or brine line in the brine tank or a loose connector. venturi problem in the control valve drain line on control valve restricted or blocked That's a VERY old Culligan and you've got your money out of it a few times over. You have to deal with Culligan for parts and service which can be expensive. If it isn't a simple problem to correct consider a new industry standard softener where parts and tech info are readily available and it would be more water and salt efficient.
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At a typical water usage of 60 gpd/person, a 1 cu ft resin tank will regenerate every 6-7 days when regenerated with 6 lb of salt. Do they have any high-water-use fixtures, such as a jetted tub or multi-head shower? I would not, under any circumstances, get the resin/carbon tank, whether the media is mixed or in a split tank configuration. It forces too many compromises: 1) The resin portion of the tank won't be tall enough to allow the right amount of expansion during regeneration, 2) the carbon portion will be too shallow to do its job - you need 2-3 ft of depth, 3) The flow rate for backflushing the carbon adequately is higher than that which is acceptable for the resin, 4) carbon beds should be backwashed daily, whereas resin regens happen weekly, so the carbon bed will become compacted and damaged, 5) that damaged carbon media will require replacement very quickly. If they really need all of the chlorine removed from their water, a separate properly-designed carbon system is the correct way to go about it. However, be certain they have just chlorine and not chloramines or a carbon system will do little good.
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Answer....that depends. :-) I see that most water softener salt is, simply, sodium chloride. Some is potassium chloride. Some are other salts. We'll assume yours will indeed be sodium chloride. It's cheap and effective. ETA: 103 mg/L easily translates to 103 PPM. Which is a fair clip, actually. /ETA If rarely irrigated and flushed through by ample rainwater, practically nothing is the result. So if, like me, you're in the habit of irrigating once or twice a year, absolute maximum, then don't worry about it. Even sodium-sensitive plants won't notice that. If you happen to live in a semi-arid or arid area and irrigate all the time, irrigate in smaller amounts that never wash the sodium below the root zone, and never receive ample enough rainfall to leach the sodium out of the soil, you'll eventually end up with a dead, sodic soil that won't grow much except sodium-tolerant marsh grasses. And then, not even those. But maybe you can manage a few things that tolerate areas like the Dead Sea. From the description, "not regularly" means your impact is towards the former. I'd be less inclined to worry about it, but would make sure to apply more water less often during dry summers to avoid sodium buildup. Pro tip: Turn off your water softener when you're irrigating the lawn and simply let the hard water hit the lawn. The lawn really doesn't care about that and would much rather have the calcium than sodium anyway. Also, it's far cheaper in terms of your water softener salt. You can certainly turn on the softener temporarily if you need to use the water yourself, but why pay to soften hundreds of gallons that hits the lawn and doesn't do any good?
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User
14 years ago
You're on a well aren't you?

Was this water test done recently?

Hardness = 44 WHAT? PPM or grains? Without a qualifier the # is useless.

No bacteria results?

Your PH is low and that should be corrected or the water will be aggressive towards you plumbing.
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olddawg
Original Author
14 years ago
44 mg/l
Does that help???

Bacteria absent

Yes, I'm on a well! You're good!

You may have struck upon my whole reason for getting this softener up and running.
I'm having plumbing issues. Actually just repaired 2 more leaks downstairs....

Am I heading in the wrong direction here???
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User
14 years ago
Was this water test done recently?

As Clint Eastwood said in Magnum Force "A man's got to know his limitations" and with your water you need professional help.

Your water conditions are too complex to address on a forum and while you post, your water is eating away at your plumbing, fixtures, and appliances.

Living on a well is more complicated than living on a water system because you want to make the water NICE and you have to make the water SAFE. There will be maintenance involved that's not difficult but must be done.

Here's what I recommended...

Get a water test from an independent lab. An independent lab has no agenda and won't be trying to sell you water treatment equipment. Go to http://www.epa.gov/safewater/labs/index.html to locate a certified lab near you. This is a MUST DO because without it everything is a guess. A quickie water test from Sears or a water softener company won't be as accurate (and possibly not as competent) as from a certified independent lab. If the water test results you posted are recent they might do.

Hit the Yellow Pages and call at least three local water treatment pros. Make sure you call at least one of the big dogs like Kinetico or Culligan for comparison and at least a couple independent pros. DON'T TELL THEM YOU HAD YOUR WATER TESTED.

Give each an opportunity to offer suggestions and provide you with a quote to meet your water treatment needs. IGNORE ANY THAT DON'T TEST YOUR WATER THEMSELVES as they can't speak intelligently to water treatment without knowing what needs to be treated.

Ask lots of questions. Softening the entire house or just the water heater (IMO a bad idea)? Warranty, parts & labor or just parts, how long and on exactly what? Install, permits required, licensed plumber? Routine maintenance and costs? Do they stock parts? Response time for emergency (water leak) calls? If they don't explain things to your satisfaction that is a good indicator of how you'll be treated after the sale.

After they've gone use your water test to compare with theirs. Are all your treatment needs being addressed?

Ask your neighbors if they have any water treatment experience. They might tell you who's good or who to avoid.
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olddawg
Original Author
14 years ago
The water test is 2 years old, there abouts...
I attempt at doing it every 3 years just to be sure there aren't any changes.

I don't know how to deal with the ph and thought the softener would be the correct direction.

Can you tell me if this is correct?

Thank you for your help!!

I will have the test done again.
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User
14 years ago
Softeners treat hardness, iron (to a point), and manganese (to a point) but not PH or nitrates and bacteria.

With your water odds are the resin in the softener is depleted and would need to be replaced. If your 5600 is a timer model then it is not as efficient as an on-demand Econominder 5600. We haven't even gotten into IF your softener is even close to correctly sized for your water conditions and usage

You need at least a neutralizer and a softener. The nitrates concern me. A neutralizer will increase the hardness in the water so a new, correctly sized softener is probably on the list.

This is more than a learn as you go DIY project if you want it done right and don't want to flush money down the drain. sometimes you gotta go to the doctor.

It won't cost you anything to get quotes locally.

If I lived on your water I'd be getting it tested every year.
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Newbie to water softeners

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