My first guess would be heart disease, but that is a wild guess since obviously we can't see him or listen to his chest. Check the color of his gums- if they are pale then he's an emergency. You can also check his capillary refill time by pressing on his gums for a second or so, until they turn white. Then lift your finger and count how many seconds it takes for them to return to pink. It should take 1-2 seconds. Longer means he is not getting enough blood to his peripheral tissues (heart or lung disease, anemia, etc.) shorter with bright red gums means he is in shock. You can't do a CRT if the gums are already very pale. Even if his gums normal I think given the symptoms, he needs to see a vet ASAP. Cats will often live with heart disease and have no symptoms at all until they go into congestive heart failure or otherwise decompensate. They tend not to cough or anything like a dog, they just get really quiet. I am worried about the flumping over thing. Usually cats with heart disease can be treated for a while and they can have a good quality of life, albeit a shorter life. But all that is pure speculation...

Let us know what happens. I am thinking about you and your kitty and hope everything is OK.

Thanks, meghane, for the quick response. Needless to say I'm not moving far from the computer tonight.

The interesting thing is that when I went to look at his gums, he's perking up and fighting with me. He's suddenly not as catatonic as he looked 10 minutes ago. He gums look normal, from what I could see, but I'm sure you can imagine, it's not easy holding a 20+ lb cat while trying to pry his mouth open and pinch his gums.

However, I did notice a bad odor on his breath. The best way to describe it would be "old, bad seafood".

But as soon as I let him go, he wandered over to the corner and laid himself down.

But getting back to the flopping over on the side, yes, that was scary, and I'm wondering if it was some kind of seizure, or stroke or something. He didn't lie down gracefully, he PLOPPED down. I didn't see it, but I heard it.

Unusually bad breath can be a sign of diabetes. As are some of the other things you described.

Bad breath can be indicative of renal failure. As toxins build up in the cat's body, the toxemia causes horrible breath. He may also be dealing with some sort of nasty oral infection. In any case, he really needs to be seen by a vet right away - tonight would be best. Without knowing the cause of your cat's illness, you have no way of knowing whether he is in an emergent state or whether he will survive until tomorrow. Regardless, the sooner you get him under veterinary care, the better your chances of resolving this issue successfully.

Have you taken his temperature?

Laurie

I can't give suggestions, but I am saying a few prayers for your kitty.
Blessings,
Lisa

Laurie, I was thinking the same thing about the bad breath, but I thought I heard there is an alcohol smell in that case. But yes, it's a possibility.

As far at the temperature, no, there's no way I would be able to do that myself. While he is normally just laying around looking "droopy", he's putting up a fight when I try to do things he doesn't want. Petting is fine, picking up is fine, but he's not letting me force him into anything else.

As far as the vet goes, as much as I hate to say it, but money becomes an issue. I'm financially strapped right now, and while I know this vet trip will be expensive, it will triple if I go to the 24 hour vet tonight. Believe me though, if he was unresponsive, I would be there in a heartbeat. He does move around, and he will slowly look in your direction when you call him, but that's it. If I had to use adjectives to describe him, I'd say "sad, droopy, tired".

To everyone else, thank you for the kind thoughts!

It does not sound good.

I recommend getting an animal to the vet at least on the third day (if not the second day) of obvious behavioral changes. Cats are very stoic, and if he is showing extreme signs, he must be very uncomfortable, and as owners, it is our responsibility to address those problems. He can't.

Good luck today.

Hope you got the personal e-mail I sent you, and that you managed to get your vet to see your cat this morning.
Please keep us posted. Thinking of your Gizmo,
Anne-Marie

Thanks again for all your thoughts!

Took Gizmo to the vet today. She said he was suffering from dehydration, and apparently lost 5lbs (he's now ONLY 17 lbs!). She took blood, and should have the results back Tuesday. The good news is that she tested for HIV/FFL and that came back negative.

She gave him fluids, and he seems to have perked up a little bit. When I brought him home and let him out of the cage, he immediately went over to the food and ate a little, then jumped up on the couch and cleaned himself a little, which I think is a good sign. Now we just have to wait until Tuesday.

I have been checking in from time to time today to see if you had posted. Glad to hear Gizmo is feeling a little better. I hope the tests come back showing something minor causing the problem. Prayers for you both!

I am so glad you got Gizmo to the vet today. I hope your vet will be running a thyroid test as well as a full blood panel, but you should call on Monday to make sure. Thyroid is a blood test, but it is run separately from a blood panel, so you may have to request it specifically.

I'm sure that the fluids will make your boy feel much better. Dehydration can REALLY make a cat feel sickly. How was his temp when the vet checked it? I assume it was normal, otherwise the vet would have sent you home with antibiotics.

Please post the results from his blood tests when you receive them. I'm sure I'm not the only one who has read this thread and is concerned about Gizmo.

Give him a snuggle for me.

Laurie

Glad he's feeling better already. That's a lot of weight loss for a kitty, especially a big one. Got to worry about hepatic lipidosis on top of everything else now too. Doesn't sound like a heart problem at least- that's good. Hopefully he'll get over whatever it is quickly.

Hope Gizmo had a good weekend. Just thought I might suggest you ask for a copy of the tests. I did not used to do that, but I have learned a lot by studying the results. This would be especially helpful if Gizmo had a condition that needs some long-term treatment.
Please keep us posted,
Anne-Marie

SATURDAY: As I said, Gizmo perked up a little after getting fluids, but once he got on the couch, he just stayed there, pretty much passed out. It was around 10pm that we felt his ears was VERY warm, and his nose was warm and dry. We came to the conclusion that he had a fever. We took a gamble, and decided to give him an antibiotic on our own. I crushed it, mixed it with milk, and fed it to him with an eye dropper. He felt better pretty quickly, and even started purring. It was then that we noticed his purr was a little raspy, like he was congested. This made us think he had some sort of respiratory infection, possibly even pneumonia. We had flounder for dinner that night, and gave him a small piece to see if he would be interested, and he ate a tiny bit.

SUNDAY: He was feeling a little better. We again gave him antibiotic, a little milk, and watched him. He seemed to get up and about a little more. He even got upset when I rubbed his tummy, and tried to wrestle and bite my hand, which is normal for him. Lately, he didn't care what you did to his tummy! That night, he slept in his usual position by our feet on the end of the bed for the first time in days.

MONDAY: Continued antibiotic. although at night I didn't bother to crush it, I just popped the pill in and he swallowed. We washed it down with some water. When my wife came home from work, he came over to the door to welcome her as normal. Still a little slow, and not as energetic, but he did it, which is a good sign. Our vet is closed Sunday and Monday, so we had to wait until morning for results of the blood work.

TUESDAY: The vet calls to inform us that our Gizmo is a diabetic. His blood sugar was 452 which is much too high. Also, there were indications that he had liver problems. She asked me to come back in so that we can discuss treatment options for him. After hanging up, since I had time before my appointment, I researched feline diabetes online. Boy, what an education. The biggest part was in reading that the three major indications of diabetes are: increased appetite, increased drinking, and frequent urination. I said, wait a minute, we noticed NONE of that with him. It's a little odd, if his body needs fluids why isn't he drinking much on his own? It didn't sound right. My wife (a nurse) suggested that while he may be a diabetic, if he DOES have an infection like we suspect, it could raise his blood sugar level.

So I took Gizmo back in today, and told her our theory. She said if his blood sugar was SLIGHTLY high, she would buy that idea, but it's through the roof. He's definitely diabetic, and there are liver problems. She showed me the blood test (yes, I got a copy Anne Marie!) and shows me the numbers. His white blood cells were up high too, indicating a problem. I said, "Right... like a respiratory infection, right?" She took his temperature, and it was a little high. She said that we could test his urine, because if he was diabetic, his sugar level would be high in the urine as well. Well don't you know, 10 minutes later, she's shaking her head, because she cannot believe his urine sugar is NORMAL. There were several results of the urinalysis that showed problems, but the main ones were: NO diabetes, and a little blood in urine (so it's a UTI). She couldn't believe it!

End result: We're going to give him the same antibiotic, and she recommended the right dosage for us. She also sent me home with some pills for his liver, which are apparently all natural. She gave him more fluids today, and wants us to come back in two weeks to test his blood again. SO while he's about 50%-60% of his normal self, he might very well be on the road to recovery. If anybody is still interested and remembers in two weeks, I'll keep you posted again! Thanks again for all your great advice and support!

Greg

Greg,

Thank you for the update. Your story sounds all too familiar to me. Last year I had a diabetes scare with one of my cats. He was in sudden and extreme pain one day, so I rushed him to the vet (a 1 hr 15 min drive from here). Noddy is TERRIFIED of cat travel and SCREAMED the entire way to the vet. At one point, he let out a particularly pained howl and shifted his position in the crate.

At the vet's, his blood test showed a glucose level through the roof. My vet diagnosed diabetes which, although I acknowledged was a possibility, was obviously (to me, anyway) NOT the source of his acute pain. The vet noticed that Noddy had passed some urine in the crate. Even at home when I first noticed Noddy's pain, I guessed that he was suffering a urinary blockage (which he had once before many years ago). When the vet noticed the wet spot in the crate, and I thought back to the very painful howl Noddy let out on the trip to the vet, I surmised that Noddy had a crystal blocking his urethra, causing great pain, which he managed to pass in the car. The vet, however, discounted all of that, insisting that the problem was diabetes and ONLY diabetes. He insisted I start Noddy on insulin when I got home. BTW, Noddy was perfectly comfortable on the trip home and exhibited absolutely NO more signs of pain in spite of having received absolutely NO treatment at the vet's office.

So, I started Noddy on insulin even though I really didn't believe he was diabetic. I consulted another vet, as well, but both vets insisted that Noddy's very high glucose couldn't possibly have been caused by his intense pain and overwhelming stress. Within a week of starting insulin, while I was still trying to get up the nerve to start doing ear pricks and at-home glucose testing on Noddy, he had two consecutive hypoglycemic episodes, the first of which was life-threatening (and finally forced me to do my first ear pricks!). On my vet's recommendation, I withheld insulin for a few days. During that time, I tested Noddy's glucose every day, and he was NEVER above normal range! I continued to test him once a week for a while, but agaiin his glucose remained perfectly normal. I never gave him any more insulin.

It's true that cats can go into spontaneous remission with diabetes, but I do not believe that was the case with Noddy. I believe that Noddy's very high BG at diagnosis was simply a result of his pain and stress. As in Gizmo's case, my vets tried to insist that such high BG could ONLY result from diabetes, but that simply isn't the case. There are cats whose BG can shoot into the stratisphere when ill, in pain, or severely stressed.

I'm very glad that Gizmo's ailments are treatable. I'll bet those liver values will fall right back in line once his infection has been eliminated. Just make sure he keeps eating because, as Meg said, he is at high risk of hepatic lipidosis. If he won't eat on his own, you will have to assist feed him with an oral syringe. It is very critical that he eats!

I'm glad that Gizmo is on the road to recovery and look forward to reading your updates as he continues to improve.

Laurie

Cats can be transiently diabetic. It's one of those things that cats do differently than other species. Basically they become diabetic because of pancreatic beta cell exhaustion +/- insulin resistance (especially in fat cats). But both conditions can be reversed with special (IMHO a more kitty appropriate high protein, low carb) diet and weight loss. Then you have a cat that had required insulin and suddenly he no longer does because the conditions causing it are gone. But being a good cat mom, you religiously give the insulin every day as the veterinarian directed. Meanwhile, kitty is making his own insulin very well, you are adding more, and the horrible hypoglycemia crash occurs.

Vets REALLY need to do a better job of warning diabetic kitty owners that this can happen. Sometimes, kitty is given insulin in the morning just before everyone goes off to work, and mom and dad come home to a comatose or worse dead cat, because he went into a hypoglycemic crisis. Nobody told mom and dad that cats can be transiently diabetic.

I've read a couple of case reports where diabetic cats have had no glucose in the urine, but from what I can gather that's pretty rare. However the amount of glucose in the urine has a lot to do with glucose levels over time; it isn't instantaneous. You have to have high blood sugar for a while before it can spill over into the urine.

That said, it is entirely possible that your cat is not diabetic. However I'm still VERY worried about hepatic lipidosis, especially given that the bloodwork results show high liver enzymes. Gizmo absolutely MUST eat, or the process will kill him, if that is his problem. Not just a little bit of food, but enough to support his- er, shall we say ample- body weight AND stop the mobilization of fat into his liver. If he will not eat on his own, he needs a feeding tube, if he has HL.

And yes, we absolutely want to know how Gizmo does. Please keep us updated. And get that boy eating!

I'm glad Gizmo is feeling better, it's so scary when you KNOW something's not right, but don't know what's wrong or how to fix it.

I have to ask though - why did you have any antibiotics around to give Gizmo? You should never have leftovers from a previous illness, you should never give antibiotics that were prescribed for one condition to another. I'm sorry, I'm really glad it helped, but please, do NOT EVER use antibiotics other than as prescribed. This contributes to the development of antibiotic resistant bacteria and makes treating bacterial infections in the future more difficult.

Please don't take this personally, I am posting more for the benefit of other readers. I really am happy that it helped your Gizmo, but have to point out that antibiotics should not be used incorrectly.

I would never again administer insulin to a cat without FIRST performing an AT-HOME blood glucose test to verify the need. I do not trust the glucose level determined at the vet's office because the animal's own anxiety can raise his BG substantially. In spite of the fact that at-home BG meters are not as accurate as veterinary lab equipment, the results from a minimal-stress at home test are likely to be far more accurate than those acquired from an anxious animal in a vet's office.

There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that if I had waited 24 hrs after Noddy's diabetes diagnosis and tested his BG here at home, it would have been perfectly normal without so much as a drop of insulin ever entering his system.

Laurie

There are many tips and tricks at the link below to help you get Gizmo eating again.

Here is a link that might be useful: Convincing inappetant cats to eat

Just wondering how Gizmo is doing?

Lisa, thanks for asking!
He's been doing much better since he got fluids the second time. He's not 100% back to normal, but I'd say 85%-90%. He is eating and drinking on his own, but not excessively. He is begging for table scraps, which he usually does, but doesn't really eat them, or if he does, he just nibbles. He will come if you call him, and will talk on occasion (he rarely ever said "meow", he does more of a "mah" which is funny, because we can sometimes get him to say "mah mah" which gets people laughing to no end!) but he doesn't talk as much as he used to.

I've included two pics! The first is a few days after we found him, at the age of 4 weeks, back in August of 2001. The second was taken about a half hour ago, next to his "nephew" Munchkin (Gizmo's half-sister's son) who is almost 3. You can't tell in the picture, because of the way they are sitting, that Munchkin is about 12 lbs, and Gizmo is 17lbs, and that's AFTER losing 5 lbs since his last vet visit! There's a reason Munchkin got his name, and if you saw Gremlins, you now probably know where Gizmo got his name!

I'll keep you all posted!

So glad Gizmo has made so much progress and that he is 'mah mah'ing again for you! Hope his weight will stabilise. Great pictures, too! Thanks for sharing.
Please keep us posted, and if you ever know what happened to him that week, I would be curious!
Anne-Marie

Just wondering if your handsome Gizmo got over whatever his problem was.. Hope he made a full recovery. Please let us know how he is doing.
Anne-Marie

Wow, what an ordeal! Thankfully, 80-90 percent recovery as of two weeks ago leads me to believe kitty is 100% today. But do let us know for sure when you check in.

Unfortunately, I have not been back to the vet yet. I was only available one day last week during their office hours, and something came up before I could go. Now, I think I'm going to have to wait until my tax refund comes in before I can bring him back to afford the $100+ for the office visit & blood tests.

Of course, the main reason I can afford to put it off is because Gizmo is about 95% of his old self. He's putting weight back on very quickly (we can't feel his bones anymore). In fact, he's still overeating at least 3-4 times a week to the point where he vomits. which is normal for him (nothing works to prevent this, we've tried everything including posting on GardenWeb years ago).

The other 5% comes in on an occasional basis. We've caught the other cats a few times doing what they did last month -- walking over to him carefully, sniffing around his nose/mouth area, and then backing up, all while he just sits there. And once or twice we just look at him and he looks "dazed". Usually though, when you go and pet him, he'll perk right up again. So while we know we have to get him tested, we're at least positive he's feeling a lot better.

Once again, thank you for your concern, and I'll be sure to keep you posted!

Greg

So glad to hear from Gizmo, and to hear that he is 95% back!! Hope he does not get overweight.. haha! Counting on you to keep us posted!
Anne-Marie

For those of you who have been following this story, or for those who are just picking it up now, thank you for reading.

Gizmo left this world on September 3, around 6:15pm. Two weeks ago, he began acting funny again, and losing weight. We began putting him on antibiotics again, and he seemed to not get any worse, but not get any better either. We discontinued the medicine the Saturday of Labor Day weekend, knowing that if he did not improve, he would have to see a doctor again.

Sunday he joined his mommy and daddy out in the backyard for a barbeque and loved it. He enjoyed sniffing and playing with the chives growing there, and nibble on a grape leaf from the vine He also swung on the swing for a while, and wandered around in the grass.

The next morning, he nose-dived. We took him to a different vet on Tuesday, and he took X-rays, bloodwork, and gave him different antibiotic and IV fluids. The X-rays showed a smaller than normal heart (probably due to dehydration), healthy lungs, healthy intestines, but one slightly deformed kidney. Whether or not this was part of the problem, we did not know. He did not perk up from the medicine.

Wednesday morning, the vet called and said the blood work is not good at all. His liver and kidneys were failing, he had a high white blood count, and he also had the opinion that Gizmo was diabetic. If we wanted him to have any chance at all, he needed to be hospitalized immediately, which we did.

When he arrived, he was very much out of it, but still somewhat alert to his surroundings. He knew we were with him, and he knew he was in the car going on a trip. My wife held him the whole way. The vet said in addition to everything else, his temp, heart rate, and pulse were all low. It would therefore be necessary to bring these levels back up before they could even begin testing & treating the other problems. Even after being told that it might be a week's stay and $4,000 later, we still handed him over. Fortunately, Gizmo relieved us of any guilt from making a decision, and went peacefully within 5 hours of dropping him off.

We had him cremated today at an establishment that allows you to view the whole process, so that you can make sure your wishes are respected, and he is back home with us; unfortunately, not in the way we wanted.

Thank you once again for all your kind thoughts. We are now left to pick up the pieces. Of course, the other cats seem to be dealing with it better than we are, but we can tell they are missing him as well.

I've put the link for the memorial park's website down below. I highly recommend them for anyone in the PA/NJ/NY area.

Here is a link that might be useful: Abbey Glen

I feel the need to also add (perhaps for my own sanity) that the doctor at the hospital felt that whatever the problem was, she was perplexed that he didn't respond to any of the treatments., and so she was sure this had been going on for a long time, perhaps even since birth. She was sure there wasn't much we could have done.

You have my condolences... it's so difficult to lose a dear friend. You did all you could do. You and your wife are in my thoughts.

I am so sorry to hear Gizmo passed away. I wish that doing everything possible would somehow ensure a great outcome, but that isn't the way it happens. Your family is in my thoughts.

I am so sorry for your loss. (((hugs)))

I'm very sorry to hear that Gizmo passed away. Thank you so much for all the love and care you gave him throughout his life -- he was one fortunate cat.

I am so sorry, he was a beautiful happy cat and you gave him a wonderful life. Bottle babies get so close to you it is so hard.

I am sorry to hear of your loss. I now that it has been two years ago but we were researching the same thing that Gizmo was experiencing for our cat Melanie. We are heading to the VET monday. OUr fingers are crossed.