I have several questions.

What is sq footage of main level and basement level?

You realize you may need to upgrade your electric service to handle heat strips?

I think the GreenSpeed system s overkill and you would not be able to justify the additional cost.

I would like to know your oil cost, oil furnace efficiency, and electric cost.

Oil heat is great but expensive. You will not get the same degree of heating comfort with a HP but should save a great deal of money.

I would look at the two stage Performance 16 heat pump with Performance 006 var speed air handler and Carrier Edge thermidistat. Probably a 10 KW heat strip.

Here s the AHRI HP Directory matching numbers.

5475113 Active Systems PERFORMANCE 16 PURON HP CARRIER AIR CONDITIONING 25HCB636A**31 FV4CNB006 1050 840 36400 13.30 17.00 35400 9.50 22600 1 HRCU-A-CB Yes 259 714 Yes

Carrier makes a nice HP. My only objection is they don't offer electronic demand defrost which eliminates/reduces unnecessary, nuisance, and costly defrost calls.

IMO

Thanks for the information Tigerdunes!

Sq. Ft. for basement is approx. 1750 and main level is 1950 Sq. Ft. As for the electrical panel, it has sufficient space. Oil runs me $360/month for the entire year (payment plan). The electricity is averaging at $140/month. The oil furnace efficiency is unknown but it is 24 years old, so probably not that good.

You pay $4320 a year for oil! Does that include domestic hot water? That is a lot. How much are you paying per gallon? I think is more expensive than resistance heat.

Is you oil tank underground? Good it be possible it is leaking? Do you trust your oil delivery company?

Do you know how much insulation are in your walls and attic? How tight are your windows?

@ Mike_home;
Sad but true. I decided I couldn't take it anymore, hence the transition to an electric heat pump. The windows are new, no leak there. The oil tank is in the basement and it is definitely not leaking. We do heat domestic water with the oil as well. As for trusting the oil company....i wouldn't say I "trust" them, but I doubt they are scamming me, I think.

Cost/gal for oil?

Cost/kWH for electric? Any incentive from electric utility for HP heating? If you don't know, make a call and find out.

IMO

Cost/gal for oil is $3.86/gallon (includes delivery charge). In my original post I calculated our maintnance contract in the price as well, sorry for any confusion. I didn't realize I was adding it until I re-did the math.

The oil company sells electric HP and they sent a rep by the house tonight to give us an estimate. It turns out the rep from the oil company was the same guy who installed the original HP in the house when it was first built. The previous owners took the HP out and replaced it with an A/C unit before they sold us the house because the HP had gone bad.

The rep recommended we go with Bryant 16 Seer HP (225B?) with an SV4 fan and keep the oil coils as back up heat, instead of the electric heat strips. This is obviously a huge saving compared to the Infinity GreenSpeed unit we were leaning towards at first.

I understand Bryant is the same as Carrier, but now my question is: would a 225B HP from Bryant be just as good as Carrier's Performance series?

Sorry, that should read FV4 fan, not SV4.

Also,what I meant by oil coils is we have an Aquecoil (water coil system) on top of the air handler which would serve as the back up/emergency heat source for the HP. The Aquecoil is heated by the oil boiler and is on the current air handler/furnace.

I was contemplating going to heat strips for my emergency heat source, as Tigerdunes eluded to, but checking the average air temps in the area compared to the electric vs oil prices, I believe oil migh be better. Am I on the right track? Opinions?
Thanks

Carrier's Performance series and sister company's Bryant Preferred series is the same. I would want the two stage model whether Carrier or Bryant.

Bryant's Preferred 226a would be same as Carrier's Performance 16.

What is your electric rate?

You were not clear. You have an oil boiler not an oil furnace? Baseboard or radiator? What do you plan with that?

I would make the break completely and get rid of oil altogether unless you just like to throw money away.

If going with HP, you need another competitive quote. Something a bit unnerving about buying HVAC from oil jobber.

IMO

I always ask this question for people who have oil heat. Do you have access to natural gas? If you do then you need to consider using it.

I will post my suggestions after you answer the previous questions.

Agree with Mike. I assumed that you don't have nat gas service available in your area/neighborhood. If you do, then you would want to find out the cost to bring line to your home.

Post back please.

IMO

Yes, if I had natural gas I would go to it but I don't have it available in my neighborhood. I agree with you guys about the oil back up as an alternate to electric heat strips after doing a little more research. Most people in the area have electric heat strips as their back up source.

The electric cost is .11 per kWH.

Here is my fuel comparison calculation for oil versus electric.

To be used as a guide only..

Oil $3.86/gal at 80% eff

Electric $0.11 at 2.75 COP

Cost per 100,000 btu of useable heat

Electric baseboard: $2.90
Heat pump: $1.17
Oil: $3.50

You will see some nice savings. You will note that straight electric resistant heat is even less expensive than oil.

IMO

Are you going to write a good bye letter to your oil delivery man? At the very least you should send a Christmas card. :)

Rintintin,

I see you are in Norther VA - I'm in Rockville.

I installed a new Carrier HP with an oil furnace three years ago.

My home is smaller that yours - 2100 Sq Ft. 43 year old house with original windows, extra attic insulation.

My oil bill has plummeted since the new equipment install. My electric bill is also actually less also. And we find the house more comfortable in both heating and cooling seasons. The improvement in cooling comfort is particularly dramatic - 2 stage compressor, variable speed fan.

I also did not have NG available. I changed out my electric hot water heater - replaced it with a GE Hybrid Heat Pump hot water heater. That replacement is saving my wife and I nearly $50 a month in electric cost. (It has already paid for itself!!!)

This post was edited by saltidawg on Thu, Oct 24, 13 at 12:49

Thank you all for the great advise. I am glad I found this site.

I'm definitely NOT sending my oil provider any cards. I can't believe I haven't done the switch sooner.

I am a little nervous about how the HP will do this winter. I'll keep you all posted.

I'm going into this major purchase with a whole lot more knowledge now. Heck, I might be able to install the whole thing myself! Standby for more questions : )

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!

I caution you about getting sized correctly...

IMO

"I am a little nervous about how the HP will do this winter. I'll keep you all posted."

If your experience is anything like mine here across the Potomac, you'll be VERY pleased. As I've gained knowledge and experience, I now have my HP set to provide heat all the way down to an outside temp of 25 degrees. Below 25 degrees, it's oil.

I've had one oil delivery since March 2011 - December 2012 for 107.6 gallons for $424.98

YMMV :-)

EDIT: Just received my 2013 Oil delivery. 68.1 gallons @ $4.249 per gal = $299.50

This post was edited by saltidawg on Sun, Oct 27, 13 at 10:33

Okay;
Here's the latest...Bryant 280anv036 with FE4anf002 with 15 KW heat strips. I know someone had said 10 KW heat strips would be sufficient. Am I doing an overkill?

Any issues? I thought i would need an 003 air handler. The installer is a Bryant certified guy. He says it's good.

I decided to break free from the oil. Not worth it for me.

comments? Thanks.

"I decided to break free from the oil. Not worth it for me."

Did you perform the analysis comparing the cost to heat with resistive heat versus oil? (I saw tigerdunes' comparison.) Will you need to upgrade your electrical service to carry the 15 Kw? The cost to remove oil tank and mitigate oil system?

What exactly are you looking for in a system?

What is your budget?

You must use the the larger air handler to get the best performance/efficiency numbers.

The Bryant 280 is the equivalent to Carrier's GreenSpeed Pump. It will be pricey and for your location, I don't think it's worth it.

I still like the Performance configuration I listed in my earlier post.

Regarding heat strips. Each KW heat strip yields 3420 BTUs. I would not have 15 KW unless it was staged in 5 KW increments. Electric service should be checked for capacity. I like the HP condenser, air handler, and heat strips to be on separate circuits.

Here is a look at various Bryant Evolution model configurations with the Evolution 006 air handler.

5158824 Active Systems EVOLUTION EXTREME PURON HP BRYANT HEATING AND COOLING SYSTEMS 280ANV036****A FE4ANB006+UI 1200 875 650 35000 14.50 20.50 33400 13.00 31600 1 HRCU-A-CB 207 522 Yes

5462795 Active Systems BRYANT HEATING AND COOLING SYSTEMS EVOLUTION 15 PURON HP BRYANT HEATING AND COOLING SYSTEMS 285BNA036****B FE4ANB006+UI 1050 35400 12.50 15.00 33800 8.50 21600 1 HRCU-A-CB 276 754 Yes

5476675 Active Systems BRYANT HEATING AND COOLING SYSTEMS EVOLUTION 16 PURON HP BRYANT HEATING AND COOLING SYSTEMS 286BNA036****C* FE4ANB006+UI 1050 840 36800 13.20 17.00 35600 9.00 22600 1 HRCU-A-CB 262 754

5537737 Active Systems BRYANT HEATING AND COOLING SYSTEMS EVOLUTION 19 PURON HP BRYANT HEATING AND COOLING SYSTEMS 289BNA036****C FE4ANB006+UI 1210 925 36600 13.70 19.00 37000 10.00 22800 1 HRCU-A-CB 233 678 Yes

I would weigh the cost on the Performance 16 or Bryant equivalent, Bryant 280 Extreme, and Bryant 286 Evolution 16 systems.

You definitely want the Evolution controller with any of the Evolution systems. The Edge Thermidistat would be fine for Carrier Performance 16 or Bryant equivalent.

The dealer who quoted the 002 air handler should be tossed overboard.

IMO

This post was edited by tigerdunes on Sat, Oct 26, 13 at 8:26

Update- It's coming up on a year and I went with the Bryant Evolution systemâ¦I asked the dealer to install the bigger air handler after Tigerdunes' advice. The system is AWESOME! I've saved so much money and the heat from this thing is great! I heated the house up in no time and my electric bill was at or lower than years prior during the winter months. Thank you all for your advice.

I am happy to hear this has worked out well for you.

Did you install an electric hot water heater?

Which Evolution system?

What size heat strip?

TD