Those I know who have solar panels have done so for non-financial reasons. My area has high electricity rates (the top price tier, easily reached by most larger homes, is over 30 cents per kwh) and yet payback periods are rarely less than 15 years.

If your breakeven is at 20 years or longer, what happens if your equipment doesn't last that long? The stuff is new, there's no experience with what's reasonable to expect for functional longevity. It may be subject to a product guarantee but that requires the selling companies to remain in existence. If something goes wrong, the break even point may never be reached.

Panel prices continue to drop but until they reach much lower levels, in all but very remote areas where the alternatives are limited and an off-the-grid system is required, installing a home solar system remains a decision more motivated by personal feelings than by dollars and sense.

I'm all for solar energy, and I think the day is not far away when most businesses will have panels on their roofs. For the home, different story.

(edited to fix typo)

This post was edited by snidely on Sun, Sep 21, 14 at 12:46

We're about to put solar in but will not be installing storage batteries. We're just doing "zero net" with our local utility, so the solar power will cut down our usage of top tier rates. The local utility will then bill us once a year for total net usage.

One of our friends (actually, our former partner and contractor who remodeled our home) works for a different solar company; originally an installer and now at the inspector level. That means he goes around to all their projects in a specific region and is the liaison for making sure the install meets city inspection guidelines.

He was quite helpful in showing us the difference between a cheap install and a good one - nothing like actually seeing the difference in the mounting panels! - and approving the brand of panels we chose. He also helped us form questions for the solar company to ensure everything would be done with the best practices possible (there are different ways to run the conduit linking the panels with the inverter, for example, depending on the layout of the roof).

We are doing the solar for two reasons:
1) Our local utility is one of the highest electrical rates in the country, and they are only going to go higher. Also, the "net zero" # is capped, and estimates are it is going to be reached in the next 12-18 months.

At that point, the utilities in our state are free to renegotiate what they will pay for energy generated by new solar installs, and it's generally agreed that rate won't be as favorable to the consumers as it is now.

2) We plan to sell our home within the next 5-10 yrs. It's been shown that solar is a strong selling point - especially in our neighborhood; where there's tremendous interest in it from everyone we've spoken to (a large and active neighborhood listserv). Leasing, OTOH, has not been shown to be as strong a positive.

Be aware that your contract will usually show a minimum power generated in the first ten years (our showed a guaranteed minimum of at least 90%, dropping to 80% over time), that will drop over the next ten years. Panels do lose efficiency, and neither inverters nor batteries last forever. Factor in replacement costs and average lifespan.

We looked into solar about six years ago. Costs were at least 30% higher then. They've come down quite a bit.

I would not use them. I see to many of them laying around in yards and fields.

To my thinking, jkom, with the expectation of moving in 5-10 years, you'll never see a payback, you won't be in the house long enough. You'd just be wasting money.

When the time comes to sell, you'll have old equipment in place, that's less efficient than new stuff and that cost quite a bit more originally than what current equipment can be purchased for. A potential buyer wouldn't want to pay you what you think should be the depreciated value of the purchase price, that will be too high compared to what it will be worth at the time compared to current prices. And, a potential buyer who's keen on solar power will look at it as a negative, old equipment to remove so that new stuff can be installed. Someone like that will show preference for a house with nothing installed.

You will save money on your money bills (PG+E?) but not nearly enough nor for long enough to justify the installation. That's why I commented, that the people I know who have solar equipment, have done so for non financial reasons. If you used financial criteria, no one would would have it. Yet.

20 years from now home solar will be widespread. Between now and then, equipment prices need to drop substantially and the net zero programs need to be replaced. Because with that, a good chunk of the electricity bill you're not paying is at the low level pricing tiers for which a solar installation is REALLY uneconomical. Only when the utilities need to pay avoided cost (as some are required to do for commercial cogeneration facilities) will it be worthwhile.

My neighbor works for a local electric cooperative. Several customers in the area have tried wind generators and found that there essentially is no payback because the equipment wears out by the time that point comes around. I don't know whether that applies to solar panels.

Well, do you plan to live there 20+ years?
Do you plan to LIVE 20+ more years?

At my age (59), I wouldn't do it. Gee, I think twice before planting trees. But I DO buy green bananas. :)

>>To my thinking, jkom, with the expectation of moving in 5-10 years, you'll never see a payback, you won't be in the house long enough. You'd just be wasting money.>>

Yes, well, we've already established in many other discussions that my thinking does not coincide with yours.

"Worth" is always a personal opinion. The majority of my electrical cost IS at the highest rate, approx 30 cents per kwh which is twice the base allowance price per kwh.

We can easily afford to do this. Our system will be installed next week. so I look at it this way. BTW, anyone should feel free to criticize my #s, LOL. I'm an English/History major, and I don't even bother to balance my checking account.

Based on the cost of the system, if we kept our house for 5 yrs, on a monthly expense it's $225. If we kept our house 7 yrs, it's $183/mo to get to break-even.

Our current charge for electrical runs approx $100+/mo. PG&E has raised rates steadily and continually since I moved to the Bay Area in 1969. They are one of the highest-cost utilities in the country.

They currently have a massive rate increase again before the PUC, which has generated some interesting local journalism on how cozy the relationship is between the PUC (which is supposed to regulate PG&E) and PG&E management.

This happens every year, without fail. Whatever I am paying for electrical thru PG&E, will almost certainly go up. We have no AC; our range, dryer, and WH are gas. I'm paying over $100/mo for lightbulbs (fluorescent and LED) and electronics.

Not everything in life is about a personal "payback". We live in an area with lots of sun, and it beats down on my house unimpeded 365 days/yr. If I can help overall by sending electricity to the grid to share with others, why not?

And flat out it makes our home more salable. Having solar is a HUGE selling advantage in our area. That alone makes it worthwhile, to us.

Jkom, about what price per watt are you paying for your new system? My quotes are between $3.40 to $4.00 a watt with the full installation. Are your numbers similar?

We put ours in without batteries as well. In our area, the battery expense adds too much to the cost. Without batteries, and with incentives, ours should be paid off in about 6-7 yrs (we just got our first state check today, actually).

Do you NEED the batteries? For us, it would have been nice. We have an electric only house, so when we've lost power, we've lost all use of everything. But, realistically, we've lost power for more than just a couple hours less than a handful of times in the last 10 yrs living here. It wasn't worth it for us. We decided if it, for some reason, became an issue, we could get a generator.

What did you decide to do?

LOL @ littlebug5

Thanks for the smile.

Are you sure that you can hook up to sell power to the utility?

Around here, a number of installations were sold based on that expectation ... and when it came time to hook up for compensation for the power generated ... the utility couldn't do it, so there was no payback for many of the people who'd installed the panels or turbines.

ole joyful