If you are stuck on using Armstrong Grand then I would put it in after the cabinets. This way it will be easier to replace in a year or two. Seriously, ours is only 3 months old, it looks BAD. Here is warning post on the Armstrong, seems I'm not alone.

http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/flooring/msg0116115722924.html?5

Sorry Barb, it does look beautiful ...for the first month at least. Please, don't make this mistake...it's not a cheap one either.

Good Luck!!

KAT

Armstrong laminate was one of the top rated laminates on Consumer Reports. You have to read these 'warnings' with a critical eye. Cause someone dragged a refer over new flooring and 'yikes' it scratched does not make it the dirge of the industry. No one is going to have the same experience because everyones expectations are different.

Wow! Thanks for the advice, I really appreciate it!

Kat: I'm surprised to hear how bad your floor is doing. I assumed it would be harder than most floors due to it's 30 year warranty. I have a sample of it and ran a key over it to see how it scratchs and it seemed really hard. I sure don't want to replace a floor often. Did you install your floor under the cabinets or after? I'm concerned about possible "buckling" if under the cabinets.

Boxers: Yeah, I had looked at Consumer Reports. They really like the Armstrong. The Grand Illusions sure looks nice!

It's just me and DH, so the floor isn't really going to get a lot of abuse. I have the cheap Pergo Presto in my home office and really love it! I was hoping that the more expensive Grand Illusions holds up even better. I love the look of real wood, but that's guaranteed to not hold up as well in a kitchen.

I certainly have a lot to consider. Thanks again.

Barb

warranties mean very little. Search on this forum for advice from a hardwood rep for those looking..... I wrote it a few yrs back. Advise still stands. Please don't repost it but keep for your info.

FYI I did my own consumer test of the Armstrong
Grand Illusions with a sample that I had purchased. I took a 5 lb metal 6"X10" square door stop and dropped it on my sample at 40" height. Yes, it put a very small hole in it from the sharp metal edges on the door stop. BUT, ANY floor would have the same result with that kind of abuse I think. As I had mentioned before, I had also tried to scratch it with my car key with no scratch left behind. I had two samples that I locked together and ran it under running water on the seam for a minute. When I undid the seam, there was no water that got into it.

Again, I really appreciate all of your advice, it's a big decision to me what floor will be in my new kitchen. I sure don't want to make an expensive mistake.

Barb

get a couple of witex samples and try those same tests.

Bungeeii: Gee, I never heard of witex, but I'm going to definitely look on the internet and get a sample. Thanks!

Barb

ARMSTRONG GRAND ILLUSIONS WARNING
Please read my posting before you buy:
http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/flooring/msg0116115722924.html?20915

Can't tell from the above: is Witex better than the armstrong?

I like the look of the armstrong, but the high gloss finish is going to show a lot more wear and tear than something more matte. So it's a look I admire, but would never want to live with.

Apparently, some of their line has grain matched texture, but I'm not sure how shiney it is-- Can't tell by their home page, can't find anything resembling a dealer locater.

Does seem to be acceptible for use in the bathroom, which is a big plus for me: I have aquariums, and sooner or later there WILL be water.

I need to choose flooring for my new house yesterday, so if anyone has additional info on witex I'd love to hear it.
Here's a link...

Here is a link that might be useful: Witex

like anything, cause some lady dragged a refrigerator across the floor does not mean that you will have a bad experience. Home made tests for durability mean very little but you will have to make your own determination.

Consumers make bad decisions based on some bogas warranty. Read the fine print on exactly what those 30 year warranties, cover!!!!! They cover absolutely nothing!!!

You want something durable.... Wilsonart!

I need to get a large part of my flooring redone (from carpet) living room, foyer, master bedroom and some corridors. I was seriously thinking of getting the Armstrong Grand Illusions because of their glossy appearance. I do have kids and don't want to keep them from being kids because of a floor choice.
Barb, have you reached a decision yet? Have you actually installed the floor and what has your experience been so far?
Thanks!

Barb, have you reached a decision since I do like the Bruce Park Avenue Makore Laminate that is so much like the Armstrong Grand Illusions Laminate. The color is nice. I just wish it was semi-gloss and not high gloss but so far the Makore and the Engineered Amendoim look best in my home. I still have to make a choice soon.

FWIW, friends of ours have absolutely gorgeous brazillian cherry hardwoods that have deep, long scratches in them from appliances and many, many smaller scratches (they have a small dog), and they appeared within several months of installation. The floor is high gloss, so the light captures the scratches, but I still think it looks beautiful.

We also have solid hardwood floors (original to our 1941 home) that we refinished in 1999 that could probably use a makeover. They have all kinds of scratches and a couple of water stains.