If you have red wine available, you can use it to make your own red wine vinegar. It takes time, but it's not difficult. The method I used is like this one from: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/283306 "First you need a vinegar "Mother" this is the bacterial culture that turns alcohol into vinegar. An easy cheap way to get one is to buy some "live" unfiltered cider vinegar from a health food store. I think one name is Bragg's cider vinegar. If you can get a "Mother" from someone who has a good one it will be better than starting with a raw vinegar. You can also buy a "Mother" from some wine and homebrew supply stores. Pour this into a large, 1 gallon or larger, wide mouth jar. Then pour in up to the same amount of wine/alcoholic beverage, never add more wine than you have starter or the vinegar will take forever to process. If possible shake the wine to get a lot of air mixed in before adding. This will help give the bacteria an oxygen boost. Cover the jar top with a piece of thin cloth such as a bandana, held on with a large rubber band. This will keep out fruit flies, also called vinegar flies, but allow air in. Then stick the jar in a dark place that is around 60-70 degrees and leave it alone for awhile. A month or so. After this you can gently add more wine every week or so. You don't want to jostle the vinegar because if you do the "Mother" that is growing on top will sink and drown. This slows down the process and can over time cause off tastes from the drowned and dead "Mother". The mother can get very thick, 1, 2, even 3 inches. When my jar starts to get full and also full of mother I take out the mother and squeeze the vinegar out of it over a very large bowl. This is a nasty slimy weird job but the mother is 99% vinegar and the best part to use for starting more vinegar. Some people describe "Mother" from red wine as looking like placenta / afterbirth. A somewhat accurate description. Every now and then you can pour out a quart or so of vinegar. Filter through first a bandana then if you want a coffee filter. At this point you can either: Put in a sealed jar and let it sit for at least a month or six, to take off the raw edge. Then filter again and you can use it. This will be a lightly filtered live vinegar. Or you can put in a mason / ball jar and process at 165 degrees for ten minutes. Then let it sit and age for a month or six to mellow it out. Then filter and use. This will give you a vinegar that is dead and will not age as fast but will be more like commercial vinegar. You can use any low alcohol beverage such as wine- red, white, desert wines, saki, beer- any decent type but it will only be as good as what you start with, hard cider, fruit wine, champagne, sherry, port, etc. Commercial vinegar is watered down to about 5% acid, the vinegar you make will have apx. the same acid content as the alcohol content was in your starting liquid. A wine of 11% alcohol will make a vinegar of 11% acidity. You can dilute the vinegar but I use it straight and take allowances in my recipe or use." I bought mine from a winemaking supply store, but gave lots of my mother away once I got it going. I gave it up when I had my kids (like so many other hobbies, LOL), but now that they're bigger I might start some again. Leigh

Could you clarify your question please? Using the vinegar or using the mother? I assume you saw this discussion about this question a bit further down the page? It addresses using the vinegar itself. As to uses for the mother itself, I'm not aware of any role for it in food preservation. It is normally filtered out of the vinegar prior to use. However there are several articles about its uses for health benefits. I linked one of them below. Dave Here is a link that might be useful: What are the health benefits of MOV?

princesspez - Whee - this is a really oldie but goodie post. In re-reading it, I have confirmed what the writers have offered. Perhaps at the time of reading them, I was too busy "doing my own thing" to really appreciate the great advice. However, your recent post mentions "adding more wine" throughout the year. Personally, I wouldn't disturb the wine/mother combination until it has reached it's final fermentation. It may take several months - and when it tastes as you like, remove the "mother" and start another batch if you like. Strain out the mother and save it - or start anew. Then I bring the completed vinegar to a boil to stop any tail ends of "mother" left that would continue fermentation, and store in a capped bottle for present use. You could measure the acidity with a meter if you like, and if you intend to use it for pickling - it should be OK as long as it is 5% - as mine turned out to be). I hope to do some string beans this next summer with white wine vinegar - and perhaps now that I'm thinking about it, should start the wine "cooking" now. The instructions on the commercial "mother" is as follows: Use a clean 1 gallon jar or bottle. Add to the culture: 16 oz. of wine. 8 oz. of water. Air is necessary for conversion of alcohol to vinegar so plug opening with cloth - I used cheesecloth and a rubber band. Keep in 80 to 90 degree temperatures. Complete conversion is possible in 3 months. Use the finished vinegar as a culture to make more vinegar using the same proportions. The instructions don't continue to include stopping the fermentation - but I remember inquiring at that time and so did the boil step as well. About sourdough bread - since my posting, bread making has improved somewhat. For what it's worth, I have added potato water (heating to 80 degrees and adding yeast and sugar for proofing), in the recipe I'm using in place of the water called for. It seems to give my bread a lighter consistency. One other "helpful hint - from ???) is to allow the bread to rise slowly, acquiring more air. I put the dough in my microwave - no heat) until it rises, rather than a warmer room temperature might be. Also brush the bread with water both before rising and before baking - nice crusty crusts. I add back water and flour to the culture and store in the fridge. Take it out the day before, and let it "do its thing" all day - smells great. My son (my critique person) really liked the last bakings. He puts grated roman cheese on it - and toasts. Anyway, this is my upate. Just my 2 c's. Bejay

I had never heard of Vinegar Pie so this was an interesting search! Here is one explanation I found - and the rest of the site is pretty interesting too I will be watching this thread to see what others have to say. Alexa "This search is for my friend and third grade teacher, Wava, who will soon celebrate her 90th birthday. She remembers her mother making Vinegar Pie when she was a small girl and WavaâÂÂs grandmother made Vinegar Pie as a Kansas Pioneer, while living in a sod house in Western Kansas. Vinegar Pie was a pie that pioneers made in the winter when the dried fruits had been depleted. IâÂÂve included two Vinegar Pie recipes. The second Vinegar Pie recipe is very basic (the instructions are a bit vague) and probably more like what the pioneers made when supplies were low. The pie is suppose to have a rather fruity flavor. Click here to check out these Vinegar Pie recipes." Here is a link that might be useful: Old Recipe Detective