Does the thread turn into a pumpkin at 100?

LOL!

dixiedoodle, the 2nd house has midquality vinyl siding on the sides and back and no trim around the windows on the sides and back other than what comes with the window. So what does that do to your opinion? The three houses are for sale near where I live. Actually, the 2nd house is much plainer than the other houses near it, but none of those houses are for sale so I can't post pictures. I'll go to the MLS listing and find pictures of the sides and back of house number 2. The first house is owned by a family with 6 or 7 kids, so they needed an affordable big house.

I think I read about McMansion 2 years ago. But I read something like its an old castle. I don't know what you are saying. Where have u read this before. I want to clear-up my doubts. Thanks alot.

The first time I saw the term used was in the Newsweek article in the link below in 2003.

What a piece of pretentious dreck! Modernist architecture has never taken off precisely because it sees a home as a machine for living. However, the vast majority of people don't feel like their calling is being a cog in that machine.

Hard surfaces, undefined flexible spaces, glass walls and flat roofs. Ugh!

As any issue of Architectural Digest illustrates, the homes of the elite are overwhelmingly post-modern. Witness the residences of Robert A. M. Stern, the dean of Yale University's School of Architecture. Another ungifted schlepper, I suppose. When will they ever admit that Wright was wrong. That Bauhaus barracks for obedient human bees was rightly rejected. Ironically, it only lives on in selected bits and pieces and among those who scorn what everyone else likes on principle. (They probably pretend to like John Cage music too.)

But Worthy, don't you think that what you say---"it only lives on in selected bits and pieces and among those who scorn what everyone else likes on principle"---applies to people who criticize McMansions too?

Can I get a little more salt for my popcorn? This has been one of THE most entertaining threads ever. Lovin the drama and the pics ... priceless.

After reading Worthys last post, I feel a little stupid. I could barely wrap my brain around all of that. Maybe it's just too early and I need more coffee.

Oh well, back to regularly scheduled programming.

Here's a perfect example of Postmodern architecture:

http://architecture.about.com/od/periodsstyles/ig/House-Styles/Postmodern-Style.htm

But our houses are really likely more Neoeclectic, assuming you agree that Postmodern usually involves a more whimsical concept at work. Neoeclectic is easier for the average architect, designer, or builder to design/execute. They just do a quick cut and paste job, taking some from here, some from there. These are the homes that most of us sit in today. Nothing wrong with that; it's just the 'style' of the day. And when you 'super-size' it you get le McMansion, because there's more space to fill with a bunch of add-ons from this era, some others from that one, and so on until you fill all available space on the facade.

http://architecture.about.com/od/periodsstyles/ig/House-Styles/Neoeclectic-House-Style.htm

Below is the location of a Neocolonial:

http://architecture.about.com/od/housestyles/ig/Colonial-and-Federal/Neocolonial.htm

BTW, Robert Stern designed a number of buildings for Disney, so he sits right there in the neoeclectic land of let's pretend!

Here's the link for the neoeclectic example.

I think F.L. Wright had a major concept absolutely nailed (though he is often misquoted on it): form and function should be intimately related. If we would follow that precept our facades would not look all a jumble of useless parts. For example, is your dormer functional--i.e., does it bring light into a living space? If not, it's without function. Mere decoration for decoration's sake. Rip it off. If designers approached it in Wright's way, though not using his style or choice of materials, our homes would be more cohesive and the McMansion would disappear.

Has anybody tried blending just a touch of cinnamon in with that chili powder for your popcorn's butter? Chicago style!!

Pinktoes-

No decoration for decorations' sake? No makeup for women, Christmas tree ornaments, or dentil moulding? It would be a dull world. And I ask this as one who isn't crazy about most neo-traditional architecture.

mmqlsmom: Well, some women need a little spiffin' up, but most could use a lot more restraint with that, too. Maybe it's an inherent design flaw; speak to the Architect. Knock yourself out on the Christmas tree--although most are prettier growing in the ground to me. When you put it out in the front yard, I don't know.

I'm not personally big on much decoration for decoration's sake on houses. Generally you have enough opportunities to do something aesthetically pleasing in the process of meeting the functional needs of the house. Ex, you need to project a wall forward? Here's a design opportunity: roof it in an aesthetically pleasing way. That's all you need; don't need to stick some baubles on it. And don't put a turret (or three) on a prairie house. You know, just kinda pick a general architectural direction and stick with it. Maybe read up on it a little. Couldn't hurt; might help.

McMansion â» definitely a pejorative. Means âstore-bought, off-the-shelf, movie-influenced grandiosityâ to me. Standard features include Palladian windows, double-height main entrance foyer, shallow staircases, double-door entries, walk-in closets, sunken tub, lots of overhead un-usable square footage. For all the square footage bought, many McMansion dwellers are closer to their neighboring houses than I am in my inner-city twin. I call McMansion developments the ârich-people projectsâ.

I know two co-workers who bought McMansions. One has been in it for years, complains of ânail popsâ; in her family room I can hear the upstairs toilet flush.. She wants to sell it and move, says itâs too expensive, but her hubby feels the house is a symbol of âhaving made itâ. Coworker two is in the building stage, and although she has shown me her a$$ every day since I started this job, she is nicey-nice when she wants to âshareâ her house building photos and news. So, to me, McMansions, regardless of size, attract those who want to show-off and/or have a need to impress. I know Ms. Nicey-Nice is going to invite me to the housewarming, itâs the only reason sheâs being nice to meâ¦not sure Iâm going, simply because I know it will stick in her craw if I donât go. Of course sheâll think itâs jealousy, which is OK by me. Iâm satisfied knowing she spent the money and didnât get the chance to show-off to me. Let her show-off to people she really likes.

Chinese McMansion.

Whoa@ Th7at& b&& sum wikkED P()$T! :-)

But it does provide a concise a definition of McMansion as possible. A McMansion is a home with features I don't like: double height ceilings with "wasted" space, as if a home were more than a filing cabinet for people; Palladian windows because, well I dislike the Rennaisance; and, finally, because it's bigger than my house with walk-in closets and sunken tubs. What's wrong with a good wardrobe and a sponge bath on Saturday nights? (That's what my father used.) Of course, my home is appropriate-- not too big, not too small. It's juuust right!

Worthy, here are some pics. We got C of O yesterday - what a hassle that was!

I think that this has been mostly a constructive thread. It certainly demonstrates that a house is so much more than a home. Our homes reflect our egos, dreams, aspirations and self-esteem, and our criticisms of other people's homes have undertones of envy, jealousy, self-doubt and moral superiority. The pictures helped me to visualize the various definitions and also demonstrated that the definitions really are subjective. What it also demonstrates is that you could never build a home that pleases everyone, so you might as well build one that pleases yourself--but that isn't easy, is it. Why is it so important that other people like our homes? Chazas--lovely home!!!

Lowmaintenance,

One could just as easily say that the McMansion craze was the unfortunate end product of "envy, jealousy, self-doubt, and moral superiority." Basically, the entire phenomenon of going bigger, higher, grander was "keeping up with the Joneses" on a much larger scale. We're all guilty of it in different ways. Some of us buy oversized expensive luxury SUV's we really can't afford nor really need. Or we buy way oversized flat screen T.V.s that take over our family rooms. We all have our rationalizations and excuses, but we really have to face the truth- we are a nation of excess. Bigger is always better. More is better than less. Size matters, so as they say SUPERSIZE ME! When you apply these standards to something as conspicuous as a house you open yourself up to ridicule and contempt, OR maybe praise and admiration from people who have the same values as you do. Maybe there is an element of jealousy there from some, or maybe there is an element of cautioning restraint by others. Either way only YOU will know if your home qualifies as a so-called McMansion as some have defined here. The OP was asking about the definition of the popular media term "McMansion". It was not a personal attack on people with large homes and lots of square footage. If you truly believe your home is not a "McMansion"-as I'm sure most posters here most assuredly would, then why would it bother you? If you go about acting defensively on every post on the matter in subtle or not so subtle ways, then you might have some people thinking here that the man or woman "doth protest too much."

It's Friday; we all need a laugh

Ready for a mountain of sweets?

A funtasy

finally! someone says it, "Wright was wrong"...
thanks worthy i always felt a bit "suburban" next to my classmates at parsons school of design who seemed to worship all things flat and square.

What a thread to read at 1am!! LOL! I have to say I live in Austin and I have never seen any of those homes :-)

As far as the word McMansion, I have never used it to describe a house but have heard people use it before. I always thought it meant a house that was to big for the area where it has been built.

Great thread though!

I'm glad to see that this thread is still going along nicely with no in fourm fighting.

For me personally anything over 2000 sq ft would be a
mcmansion..only 2 in my household & 500 sq ft per person works nicely for us,
Families have different needs, space wise. And to me having 8 people in a 4000 sq ft home sounds about right.
I've used the term mcmansion..but never to the homeowner,
but in the privacy of my own circle of friends.
It is just human to comment on the marble floors, metal windows & lowest SEER hvac..or it is for me. But it is not for me to judge these people. I just feel sorry that no one educated them to make better choices.

I've been in many homes that sacrificed performance for show..and have the high utility costs to deal with monthly.
But that is thier choice.

Someone commented on the Katrina/Rita areas & the utility costs that have been passed on to us ratepayers..and it is sad. Building for efficiency so that you can afford to live in the house is a no brainer for me. With some rates in excess of .10 per Kwh, utility bills are something that should be considered ..its not like the cost will go anyway but up.

Carry on folks, good thread!

andyk--I think that you are right and that every house is a mc mansion to someone. Do I protest too much? I don't know. But I still think the term mcmansion is mostly name calling and not constructive criticism, which is my beef with the term and why I chimed in on this thread--but I think this thread has helped people see just how subjective that term is. You can call my house too plain, too big, too symetrical, too small, too ugly, too ornate, or whatever, but at least IMO that type of criticism is constructive, even though it would hurt to hear that type of criticism too. But the term mcmansion is not constructive IMO and is just a put down. I would hate to have someone not build the house of their dreams just because some stranger calls it a mcmansion--the power of the putdown is immense.

mee too~ That is hilarious! Pass me a Pepsi, please!! :o)

Our house was advertised as "own your own mansion on a hill". While most of the home is brick, there are a few areas of vinyl siding on the upper portion at the rear. I thought it was just an architectural design to break up the vast amounts of brick. And the home is much larger than any of the homes around it. Apparently we were duped. We didn't get a mansion.... we got a big MCMansion. Darn. :op

Actually, who really cares what others call it? We love our new house, and can't wait until it's finished and we can move in. We are a family of 7, and this small two bedroom plus loft house we're in now is killing us.... LOL! :o)

The comment above "I call it a shack because that's what it is" was priceless. I was laughing hard at that one!

Here you go, totallyblessed!

Hope you all get moved into your new place soon.

mee tooo~ Thanks for the drink. It helps kill some of the salt and greasy butter on the popcorn.... ha, ha.

Thank you for the nice thoughts. We are headed out there in two weeks to twiddle our thumbs and watch the subs get to work on plumbing, electrical and HVAC. Which sounds worse than watching paint dry, but we're still excited to get back to that part of the country and begin exploring our new neighborhood. :O) Thanks.

Personally, if I had known that the word "McMansion" was taboo and somewhat offending to some posters on this board I would have never had joined the discussionm but since I'm a newbie I didnt know the history of this term on this board. I think my own concern, being a first time homeowner and home builder is the generally accepted notion that the quality of construction nowadays is going downhill especially during this previous housing boom. Maybe the discussion should be about the state of building practices rather than the size of people's homes which I understand could be offending to some. If this thread was offending to some, I apologize for contributing to it, but I think discussion about the quality of some homes that are going up (especially those which are sacrificing quality over size- which we all know had definitely gone on in this industry) is an important one- if at all to educate the general consumer population. My advice- don' let it bother, enjoy the nice homes you are all building, remember the saying "sticks and stones"? Just be on top of your contractors and make sure things are being done right and all will be well.

You will not believe this. Our house is in the framing stage and I sent out pictures (mistake number 1,001) to family and friends (mistake number 1,002). A friend of mine emailed me back with this...

"Thanks for sharing the pictures of your McMansion. Three people in that BIG house!"

I was like...HUH?! LOL! Our house is 2178 sq ft. One living, 1 dinning, 3 bedrooms and 2 and 1/2 baths. Perfect for us...key word US! I had to just laugh my head off when I read that! Andyk you are so right! Sticks and stones :-)

Forget the Pepsi....I need a bottle of wine!

Kelly

My definition of a McM would be a home where rooms sit empty, wasting heat/air conditioning. If a family needs 5,000 or 6,000 sq ft, and utilizes the majority of the space, I don't have a problem. The problem arises when building such a monster is nothing more than a means of flaunting ones wealth.

Several years ago Aaron Spelling built a 12,000 sq ft(or was it 15,000??)home on I believe two lots where previous homes had once stood. The BH locals were up in the air over the size of what was deemed the 'school house', and was the biggest monstrosity in 'the hood'. Youngest DD lived in the BH area for a couple of years, so we decided to make a drive-by one day. It was the type of house you would expect to see on one hundred acres of land, or at least fifty. Squished on two lots, it looked like a single postage stamp on a large manilla envelope. It was so over the top and grandiose in the exterior I could only imagine the interior, and the money spent on furnishings alone. I think the term wasteful is an understatement, but in certain 'circles' when ya got it, flaunt it. ;o)

It is 56K sf. Reportedly on sale for 150M.

http://www.tmz.com/2006/07/05/spelling-mansion-secretly-on-the-market/

Guess Candy needs the money. ;)

We're actually building a less interesting version of this plan so watch your tongue! (note the 60K price drop and the 10K allowance).

andyk wrote:
" if I had known that the word "McMansion" was taboo and somewhat offending to some posters on this board I would have never had joined the discussion..."

Well and good, I just want to clarify that 'McMansion' is by definition a perjoritve and an insult. It shouldn't be used unless that is your intention-- really has nothing to do with this board or the members thereof.

Patty Cakes, I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree: by your definition the single wide trailer my late uncle occupied was a McMansion because he never used [basically never entered] the second bedroom...

If anything, most of the pictures and opinions in these posts re-inforces my original thought: the word has little or no objective meaning beyond insulting others while asserting one's own superiority.

The true definition of this term was derived from a report done more than 10 years ago that had to do with the booming large home (mansion) market in CA at that time.

The report had to do with the ready to move in mansions that where being built at a record pace at that time.
These mansions where being build as ready to move in, just bring your cloths. They where already stocked with everything from TV's to silver and plates.

The report nor phrase never had anything to do with a large home on a small lot or and large home with many un used rooms.

Hence the name Mc mansion i.e. complete and ready to go just like Mc D's

Since this thread is still going, I thought the following link was interesting http://www.antisleep.com/archives/2004-05-07_0247.php

And I think the link below is too. Note , you need to rate a house to get to the next picture of a house.

I should have also mentioned that in my link where you rate houses as being McMs or not, if you just click on "view the gallery" at the top you can flip through the pictures of the houses, see the final rating of each house and read people's comments on each house.

I went to Mc D's yesterday, and they through me out after I insisted they give me a TV and a bag of silverware...

I hope that those who say people with large homes are just showing off realize how that sounds. :o(

kelntx~ Your friend should be ashamed. Oh... and find new friends. Stat. :O) Just kidding.

We haven't even told most of our friends that we've bought a 2nd home, let alone how large it is. We didn't buy it "to show off". We bought it because we got it for a great price, and it adequately meets our needs. Yes, it is much larger than what we were searching for, but we're not going to complain.

And you know what.... if a room sits unused, the cooling/heating won't be wasted. They have invented these great things called "vents" that can be turned off for individual rooms. :o)

Sorry if I'm sounding testy. But I don't get the mentality of "let's be critical if someone has a large home". Who cares?! Seriously. If they want a million square feet with a strip of grass all around... I guess I don't mind.

And before you surmise that this is hitting close to home.... no, we bought 25 acres for our horses. Otherwise, I'd love a small-ish yard. Less upkeep, and your garden can look that much better with gardening time devoted to less space.

Okay, I'm getting down off my soapbox...

totallyblessed... in a properly designed HVAC system, vents/rooms are not meant to be closed off. It can put the system's air flow and static pressure out of whack and cause all sorts of future problems. The cooling/heating IS wasted because you are simply forcing it to back up, then go elsewhere, where it wasn't designed to go in the first place.

Now, back to the nonsense at hand...

dallasbill-but if you have a zoned system you can control heating/cooling of seldom used rooms like bedrooms after the kids leave home.

I'm sorry I don't have a link, but Congressman Dingell of Michigan recently put forth a bill that would remove the deductibility of mortgage interest on homes over 3000 Sq Ft, or McMansions as he referred to them.

I'm thinking that he must be worried about all the sewer gases emanating from those McMansions and their many bathrooms, or something ;-)

And the unintended consequence of that legislation (which will never pass; he's just grandstanding for the "poor workin man") would be a blow to the higher-end production and almost all of the custom building trade. It's like running for sophmore president in high school.

I'd just as soon put a tax on "gaudy, tasteless, overdone homes of indeterminate architectural heritage." And maybe provide a tax appeal process that would let all of the owners qualifying under that category have their mortgage interest deduction if they would erect a permanent monument out front engraved thusly: "I have more money than taste."

Then, would everybody be happy???

lowmaintenance~ Yep. We're actually ending up with 6 units. But in the end it will be more energy efficient to do it that way, so that's what we're going with. DH just spoke this morning with the company we are using. They will begin in 2 weeks. Woo-hoo!

Dallas bill~ Your Mcd's comment gave me a laugh. :O)

My sister was interviewed awhile back on the NBC Nightly News. Josh Mankowicz was doing a story on the McMansions being built in Beverly Hills, where my sister lives. Contrary to what you may expect of Beverly Hills, many of the houses are unimposing to the extreme. When my mother was growing up there in the 20's, she lived in a 1,100 square foot Spanish colonial home on what was probably a 4,000 square foot lot. Mankowicz was focusing on the 3-4,000 square foot houses that were replacing the original small homes and getting a reaction from the neighbors.

My sister's comments were NOT complimentary. Her primary objection was that it was significantly changing the character of the neighborhood. Now granted, when you pay $2 million for an 1,100 square foot house, it may seem reasonable to try to add a bit more space. But what makes these new homes McMansions is that the focus on the exterior is CLEARLY ostentation. And that, coupled with the lack of proportionality between lot and house is what distinguishes them as McMansions, rather than merely mansions or large houses.

Bob

Kemptoncourt, that's the best post on this entire thread!

I would like to be the last to post since we are at a disappointing non build at the moment.

I would just like to order a Happy Meal! (It doesn't need to be supersized.)