Junk the two and buy a Honda.The repair/service record of the '88 Accord was much, much better.

The weak-link for Honda was lousy and greedy dealer service.

Both of these cars must have amassed a ton of miles in severe service..
Have your mechanic make up an estimate for the two; I have a '96 Saab 900S, 144 K miles, intend to drive until 200K w/o any major repairs..

So that works out to less than $400 per year for the Ford Explorer; this is ,IMO, below average.

The great,economical Honda would have been more than that $400, had it been dealer serviced all of the time..
DIY savings are greater than one can imagine..

Earthworm: Why do you compare mine with the 88 Honda? Did you have one of these? It's much older than my cars. Do you think I should get an '88 honda?

I, too, was surprised to see how "little" we've spent on the explorer over the past 11 years. There is some body damage due to the rusting caused by the gas leak. Other than that, it was never in a crash or anything.

I think I'd probably opt to repair the Contour. The reasons for this are that it'd be less costly to drive (better gas mileage), and it's newer and has fewer miles on it than the Explorer.

Also, the Explorer would probably bring more than the Contour if you were to sell it. There always seems to be a market for these used SUVs. Get it fixed up well enough that it's in good enough condition to sell, and then you could use the money you make selling the Explorer to fix the transmission in the Contour.

Just my opinion, but I wouldn't buy any other car, even an '88 Honda. I know Hondas can be really good cars, but an '88 is closing in on 20 years old, and its condition is highly unpredictible depending on how well it's been cared for. You could very easily pay a lot of money for something that's not as good as what you've got.

If it were me I would have lost patience and got rid of the Ford Contour a long time ago. The Explorer I would have kept up better so it wouldn't be considered shot at 108k miles.

Given the situation as it is, (and if I were still in my 20's) I'd fix the gas leak in the explorer if that one repair is not too expensive, and that's all it takes to get it rolling down the road. Then sell it and use the money from that sale to fix the transmission in the other car.

If both those cars truely are junkers, I think earthworm has a pretty good idea. I'm sure there are plenty of ok cars for $2500 or less that have a lot of use in them @ 3000 miles per year.

Mary. Either car is clearly fixable provided body rust isn't an issue. The fuel leak on the Explorer may in fact not be that much of a big deal. Someone simply has to get in there, and get it done.

One of the things that I recommend to my customers is don't let repairs wait. Such as when you first noticed the 4WD stopping working. All by itself, it's probably not a real significant expense to restore. But if allowed to wait while other repairs also become necessary the combined expense can be a real strain on the budget.

On a personal preference I am not a big fan of the Contour, but still a transmission repair should not be a death sentence for the car. Compared to buying anything new, you could repair and get a lot more use out of both of these cars for a lot less money than you will spend for something new.

prob. the contour, for the better mpg. and for a winter car the contour would go through the snow, and if it breaks again most likely would cost less to repair than the 4x4

Just my opinion, but I wouldn't buy any other car, even an '88 Honda. I know Hondas can be really good cars, but an '88 is closing in on 20 years old, and its condition is highly unpredictible depending on how well it's been cared for. You could very easily pay a lot of money for something that's not as good as what you've got>>>

I agree 100%. My Accord has about 215,000 miles and still going strong. It's been an exceptionally reliable and trouble-free car (I've owned it since it had only 45k miles and the biggest repair I've done so far was a new radiator at 200,000) I consider myself lucky to have won in the used-car market. I take VERY good care of it, because I frequently take it on long road trips and cannot chance breaking down on the side of the highway out in the middle of nowhere. Thankfully, my preventive maintenance works, because the car has never 'died' on me anywhere. However, too often someone buys a car used (well, even new for that matter) and experiences just the opposite. I've seen Accords, identical to mine, on the side of the road broken down and in the repair shops having major work done. How can my car be so good, and theirs isn't? Perhaps mine was a factory 'freak' or just the fact that I take better care of mine. The bottom line, when you buy a used car, you roll the dice. It's a 50/50 chance. Sometimes you wind up with a gem, other times a complete lemon. Best thing to do is just stick with that you have and what you know... get it fixed and keep driving it. Thats what I'll likely do with my Accord. If I was in your shoes, I'd keep the Contour. More practical, better mpg, newer, less miles and will likely last much longer than the already 12 year old Explorer. Just my $0.02

Having owned the '88 Accord for ten years, 100K miles, and having done a majority of service and repair myself, I would have to say that the QC is at a very high level, better than the Saab in some aspects and far better than the '93 VW Passat... The Germans are having their problems - the Contour is a German Ford - looks great on paper.
I think if you really need a vehicle the size and weight of an Explorer, I would repair and service it.

BTW, I cannot see how this gas leak and cause body rust ..

Last year we replaced the '88 Accord with a '97; hopefully we can run this one to 200K and more..

**BTW, I cannot see how this gas leak and cause body rust ..**

Me either. Maybe the gas ate away some paint and the exposed metal rusted?

Thanks for all the feedback.

The Explorer has served us faithfully and well. Hauled all the lumber and drywall for the basement refinishing job. Shrubs and bags of mulch. Very useful vehicle, even w/o the 4x4 working. Hopefully those days are over now, and we can put the old car down.....or find it a better home, with someone who will love it and nurse it back to health.

The car we need is just for driving to work when it's too bad for the Vette (we live in N. Ill) and when our '97 Town & Ctry (95K) is in the shop. Boy, when we buy a car, we buy it for keeps!

See, that's my problem too. If I have a car or truck I really like, I hate to get rid of it. If it were me, I'd probably wind up keeping both the Contour and the Explorer, and then get the 4x4 fixed on the Explorer sometime before next winter. Then if there's a big snowstorm, you can still get around.

I still hold on to my old Ford F150 even though I also have a newer truck. The Ford has almost a quarter million miles on it and I figure it's probably worth more to me than it'd be worth to anyone else. The insurance isn't much because it's on a low annual mileage policy.

If anyone wants to tell me why I should get rid of it, I'd be willing to listen, but I can't see much reason.

Repair the explorer. I would much rather have something with which to haul some stuff in, we all know that the vette does not cut the mustard in that department, unless of course we are talking about hauling a$& LOL That Contour should be worth kelly blue book minus the repair costs so put a sign on that puppy and move it on out. Now of course you may have to chip in on the wrecker bill to haul it off LOL

Thanks for all the opinions! Now the Explorer is running so rough and the check engine light keeps coming on. So we've decided to repair the Contour.

Can anyone tell me how the transmission guys know what needs to be fixed? How extensive the repair will be? Our mechanic will farm out the work to one fo three shops he trusts. Is this a way for him to "mark up" the work? or is it a form of quality assurance in that he'll make sure they only do the work req'd? We like and respect this mechanic, have been going to him for 6 years or so.

I read a very interesting forum on automatic transmissions - these babies can be as complex and costly to work on as brain surgery, and only the specialist should be doing this.
So your mechanic is doing the right thing in sending this auto-trans out.
Same applies to glass, fabrics, alignment, tires, batteries, on and on..
Best to let your man do this, and he will charge something for this service...

If you opt to keep the Contour, make sure to get the 99M03 service done on it!

The Ford dealer will replace the engine wiring harnesses for FREE for up to 10 years or 100,000 miles. Applies to all 95-97 Contours. If you don't get them replaced, the insulation will deteriorate (it becomes brittle and cracks) leading to electrical problems at some point (if you keep it long enough).

here's a link to all the details

Here is a link that might be useful: 99M03

Hey Brian: Thanks for the contour recall notice. Of course, since I bought it used, I never heard about this.

New question: The mechanic confirmed that it is time to go for the Explorer. The 5 stored trouble codes all relate to performance (eminent faliure or logic breakdown), and will at min require a $400 part (mass airflow sensor). The fuel leak and fouled spark plugs are on top of that.

Anyway, Carmax offered to buy the car for $1200 today. Should I try to sell it myself or take the money and run!

I can get good, working mass airflow sensors for $25-$50 all day long at wrecking yards.

You can also clean them; sometimes that fixes them.

At a minimum I'd try cleaning the mass airflow sensor and/or throwing a used one on there to see if that helps anything..before I decide what to do with it.

I included a link to a wrecking yard search engine. A mass-airflow sensor can easily be shipped via UPS, in case you can't find a reasonably priced one near you.

To clean them, it's as simple as removing the two screws holding it into it's housing, pulling it out, and then using some electrical contact cleaner on a q-tip to gently clean the wires.

Here is a link that might be useful: used part search engine

take the 1200 and run away real fast, add 100 bucks and you have a nearly rebuilt ready to roll 97 yee haw must be your lucky day

I took the deal on the Explorer. My husband was ecstatic, which makes it easier for me to feel good about the decision. Usually we overanalyze to the point of paralysis (can you tell?) and never do anything!

Thank you all for your opinions!

Posted by: mary_228 (My Page) on Fri, Apr 8, 05 at 12:45

Earthworm: Why do you compare mine with the 88 Honda? Did you have one of these? It's much older than my cars. Do you think I should get an '88 Honda?
I, too, was surprised to see how "little" we've spent on the explorer over the past 11 years. There is some body damage due to the rusting caused by the gas leak. Other than that, it was never in a crash or anything.
Mary, I was simply comparing "useful life" - IMO, the Ford's useful life is longer than 11 years(I disagree with your mechanic's opinion) - maybe even 15 years; BUT, it seems the Honda's life is closer to 20 years !!!
This is the primary reason we purchased a '97 Accord(and pay a premium)..

Now, on the German Ford's wiring recall(and this is serious), I can but shake the head in disbelief !
What is the matter with these stupid German engineers ??
My ex- '93 VW Passat had the same problem with the all-important engine wiring wrapped in the cheapest possible tape and using non-heat resistant insulation. At year 11, the engine compartment wire insulation was cracked open, exposing many potential direct shorts..
On the other hand, the Honda wiring system was still as new.
And I have never seen this condition on any Saab or American car until they were 20 years old or more!
GM and Ford are far from the only ones with QC (quality control) problems..
I would stick with Ford, but only the American made Fords..

"What is the matter with these stupid German engineers ??"

Same problem affected some Jaguar and Volvo vehicles, too.

In the case of Jaguar, the replacement harness is apparently STILL made of the same wire insulation as the original, so it doesn't fix the problem and will deteriorate AGAIN!

At least the Ford replacement harness WILL fix the problem and will NOT deteriorate again!

I verified this by using a high-tech piece of equipment called a cigarette lighter to test the wiring on the new harness. The flame didn't even leave a mark on the new wiring..it charred the insulation on the old wiring.

The wiring on my 1988 Ford Mustang is as flexible as the day it was new. I've no doubt this wiring will last at least 20 more years.

...the Contour was built in Kansas City and at another plant in Mexico.

I don't think where the car is built has any bearing on whether the wiring harness will last. There are SAE specifications for the wire to be used. It's not difficult to obtain the correct wire (crosslinked polyethylene), it's not that much more expensive than the incorrect PVC-insulated wire.

I'm told that Yazaki built these harnesses for Ford. Did Ford spec the wrong material or did Yazaki? Who knows.

Do Ford sedans normally have so many problems at 68K miles? I have a 97 Nissan Altima with ~140K on it and so far no major repairs (knock on wood!).
My parents are on their 3rd Subaru. They consistently put 300K miles on them, driving curvy mountain roads and hauling everything under the sun (they live on a small farm 60 miles from the nearest city).

Well, I have close to quarter million miles on a Ford truck, and a lot of police departments and taxi services stack up that many on Ford after Ford. So I'd say that the answer to that question is no. With any car on the road, you'll find people who swear by it, and those who swear at it.

But anyone who's putting anywhere close to 300,000 miles on anything is practicing very good maintenance and driving a large number of miles per year. That person would be able to get high miles on anything. I pulled up the other day at a gas station next to a guy filling up his S10. He told me he had 443,000 miles on it. He drives 120 miles a day to work and changes the oil every 2,000 miles; that's what he said anyway.

I have all GM vehicals now.But I had plenty of Fords with high miles also.The thing that took me away from Ford was I was sick of replacing suspension parts.Ball joints and things like that.There engines held up however.

My 1996 Contour has 124,000 miles on it and so far it's needed a waterpump and an alternator..as well as the wiring harness replacement but Ford took care of that for free.

I did recently replace the swaybar links and bushings because they were making clunking noises over bumps but the average person would just turn the stereo up louder and ignore it...it certainly wasn't something that had to be replaced except that I'm just a little more particular about those things than someone who is just happy if the car starts and moves from point A to point B.

The alternator was killed. It didn't die of natural causes. When I bought the car, the battery in it had a shorted cell. It was fine as long as you started it up every day. Not until I let it sit for a couple of days without driving it would it not start..and when I put a multimeter on the battery and measured 10.something volts, I knew exactly what was up.

I bought a new battery, but the damage to the alternator was already done, and it died completely a few months later. I suspect that the previous owner was just continually jumpstarting it.

Now I make it a point to have the battery load tested every year at least in hopes of catching problems before they kill the alternator.

Interesting, Brian
Now , I must admit, I would never think that a defective battery could place such a load on an alternator as to ruin it...
Something new every day...

And, JohnDeere, I think I would rather replace suspension pieces than engine or transmission pieces..

Yes, bad batteries really do tear up alternators. Though many people refuse to believe it, car batteries cannot just be run down repeatedly, jump started, and then they're okay again. Once or twice, maybe, but after that, they start to lose capacity. Lead-acid batteries in cars are way different from the familiar rechargeables in cell phones, cordless phones, etc., which can be completely drained and then recharged hundreds of times. Car batteries really do not do well if run below about 80 percent of full charge.

I'm glad that new cars mostly have battery run-down protection now.

There's an aftermarket device you can add which connects between the battery and the battery cable which will cut the power off if the battery starts getting too low, but I haven't been able to find it. As I recall you reset it just by trying to start the engine...it senses the additional load and turns the power back on.

I like the battery rundown protection feature also. It will save a lot of batteries and alternators, not to mention the frustration of finding that the car won't start and having to jump start it.

Also, any battery that's run down to the point where it won't start the car should ideally be charged with a battery charger at a slow rate. Alternators hit the battery with a strong charge and in many cases the battery won't ever recover unless it's charged more slowly.

A car battery that's never deep discharged can last a very long time. I've had them go 10 years before. Leaving the lights on to the point where the battery is stone dead -- not even enough voltage to produce a glimmer of light in the headlights -- will essentially ruin its chance of a long life. I'm not necessarily saying run out and get a new battery if that happens, but at least charge it with a charger and don't just let the alternator do it. And realize that the lifespan of the battery is cut every time that happens.

Here's what a good battery can do for you: Last March I had the alternator fail in my Blazer. I was 70 miles from home. It was night, so I had to have the headlights on. I had a Wal-Mart EverStart battery about 1 1/2 years old, never deep discharged. I turned off all accessories except the lights and started heading toward home. I made it 69 3/4 miles -- it finally quit when I was on my road and could almost see my house. I think that's pretty good for headlights on and no alternator.

So now that battery has been somewhat deep discharged, but nowhere near as bad as leaving the headlights on, because those will just keep sapping power until it's down to nothing. The Blazer's computer apparently shuts things down when the system voltage hits about 10 or 11, because it was showing 11 on my tester when I got home; probably under load that would be 10 or maybe less. (First it shuts off the overdrive in the transmission, then the ABS, and finally the ignition system.) According to the charger, it was at 41 percent. So I charged it with the charger, replaced the alternator, and that battery is still in there, doing okay. But it may not last as long as it would have if that hadn't happened.

(On the instructions that came with the replacement alternator, they said if the alternator has failed and the battery is run down, it is not just recommended but is absolutely necessary to charge it with a charger and not just expect the alternator to bring it up, because doing that will shorten the life of the alternator.)