Kinda lacking specifics (for your own protection)but here are my thoughts/questions:

What *direct* relationship do *you* have with the manufacturer? Did you buy equipment directly from a manafacturer and then hire someone to install it? If so, then you must pay the manufacturer for goods that were delivered.

If you hired a sub to install "x" equipment for "x" dollars, and that job has not been completed to your satisfaction, then the manufacturer needs to be seeking payment from the *sub*, not you! They need to put a lien against the sub's assets, not yours. You do not have any direct business relationship with the manufacturer, the sub does.

Another thought is that if they do put a lien against your house, then when the job is done to your satisfaction, and you pay the bill in full, then the lien should be satisfied and removed from your title.

At any rate, it may be worth $150 dollars or so for a consultation with a lawyer.

Good look in straightening this out.

The laws regarding liens are different in every state. We own a distribution business and deal with liens on a regular basis. In MI, OH and IN a lien can be placed on a home where the subcontractors did not pay their material bill. However, if you are working with a GC that takes draws from the bank, it is the bank's responsibility to ensure that the GC receives waivers from the subs before he gets a draw. In our business we've seen subs forge waivers stating they paid their material bill to us when they didn't. That still doesn't prevent us from filing a lien.

If you have a GC that is getting draws based on a construction loan that you signed, I would contact the bank ASAP and put a hold on draws until this gets worked out. This is where having a GC who holds his subs accountable is money well spent.

If you are GC'ing this project yourself, it is your responsibility to make sure that waivers are in place and properly signed by the material supplier. A phone call to the material supplier to back up the waiver is imperative.

Check the laws regarding mechanic's liens in your state.

Gardenchick,

the laws in my state are similar to what you describe; the manufacture can put a lien on the job site... But I am in a situation where I have given a 50% deposit for the job to the sub but they in turn have not fully paid for the material and the manufacture is about to put a lien on the house The product has been so poorly installed that it fails under testing and itÂs a major house item/system along the lines of exterior siding, roofing, windows etcÂ

If this item was not such a specialty item or an item where we could get another sub to finish the job, we would have done so months ago... But in the same breath because of its specialty my GC has never done business with this Sub before and obviously will never again, so he has limited or should I say no real leverage to ensure the do a good job.

So that leaves me in a situation where we are forced to take the products out of the house and replace them with a product that will do the job its meant toÂ

How would you deal with a situation like that? Where the Sub does not and at this point I think can not install the product correctly The home owner takes the product out of the house and no longer uses it because it constantly fails How would you address from the manufacture side, would you still come after the home owner because it was special order for his home, or is the onus now back on the sub for failing to be able to install the product correctly?

I would try to work directly with the manufacturer to find a contractor to do the job properly. The manufacturer should have an interest in seeing that you're happy with their product. Clearly they need to screen their approved dealers/contractors a bit better.

Taking the product off/away from the house won't cure the lien issue, however. You're going to have a problem with the contractor for not paying the manufacturer. That's why I would try to work the manufacturer to get the product installed correctly, since you're paying for it either way and it sounds like the contractor isn't going to give you any money back.

Heimert has given very good advice. I do not believe the manufacturer is going to release the lien without payment, but they do have a vested interest in a good application of their product. If they will not help you in getting the job done right, I would most definitely negotiate the price of the material. Most manufacturers have tremendous markups on material and we routinely settle disputes for 50 cents on the dollar.

You do have some other options. First, I would contact my homeowners insurance carrier and have your agent come out to the home to meet with you and the sales rep. Tell your agent that the product was improperly applied, is failing and will continue to cause damage to the home if not removed. Your insurance carrier may then subrogate the claim to the subcontractor's insurance carrier (assuming he has one) for reimbursement.

A caveat is whether this is an EIFS/stucco matter. If so, there are other rules which apply. I can discuss this with you offline if you prefer by giving me an email address.

I would consult with a trusted attorney, which I fortunately have.

The manufacturer produced a product and supplied it. They're going to be able to file a lien.

The sub botched the install. Your issue is with the sub. You will likely have to pursue legal action against the sub to recuperate any damages. (I'm strictly guessing here.)

Since it's usually in your best interest to release the lien, you'll likely have to take the steps necessary to get that done, trying at a later time to recuperate your losses, whether it's against the sub, the manufacturer or both.

A lawyer will better be able to tell you which way to go. I would also expect the manufacturer to attempt to reconcile this situation by providing the labor to see the job done correctly. You may then have to sue the sub for the 50% that was given to him already. Of course, he may be of the mind that you owe him money and pulled the deal out from under him.

You really need a third party product expert. Someone who can tell you if the product is at fault or the installation of said product. You also need to get your intentions in writing and sent to the manufacturer of the product. They need to know that you are not intending to rip them off but you need to make sure that the product is not defective.

If it turns out that the product itself is not at fault then the manufacturer needs to get paid by you, the end user.

Keep in mind that a threat to lien, affidavit claiming lien or intent to lien and actual lien are all very different things. In my state (TX) an actual lien is very difficult while and intent to lien is very easy.

I think you've gotten some great advice so far. I would second the advice to work with the manufacturer. They want happy customers. As kellyeng mentions, obtaining a lien is actually an intricate process in many states. Have a lawyer check to see whether this compnay is actually on the right track with filing the proper notices. In our build, we only had two vendors properly protect their right to file a lien. We still obtained lien waivers from all vendors. Good luck!

As an inside hint to the lien process, most states have very strict guidelines that must be followed before filing a lien (like others mentioned). In the states we work in (MI, IN, OH), the interested party must file for a Notice of Commencement within 30 days of providing material or labor. This form needs to be filled out by the homeowner and returned to the party that requested it. That must be followed up by a Notice of Furnishing which needs to be filed within 20 days of providing material to the jobsite. In order to file a lien, the supplier/laborer must file for a Claim of Lien within 90 days of last furnishing material/labor to the jobsite. Sometimes a threat of a lien scares the homeowner into paying without realizing that the manufacturer did not follow appropriate steps and cause the lien to be invalid anyway.

As a distributor ourselves, I can understand the manufacturer wanting to get his money any way he can. However, he knows whether his lien would be valid. If you know your rights, he may be more willing to work with you to make sure the job is completed correctly. There is no way he doesn't know of a competent applicator who would work with you. Manufacturer reps usually have excellent relationships with their applicators.

As for going after the sub -- I completely agree that he is responsible. However if this guy does as bad a job as it seems going after him would probably be an effort in futility (and probably a waste of money). Almost every time we go after our subs for material payment they are broke, they've lost their insurance for nonpayment and their personal bank accounts are empty.

I would lawyer up and then fire the sub, both for messing up the orders and the installs.
He should be paying the manufacturer if the problems are his fault, and then seeking reimbursement from you for only the costs not including his mistakes.