Here in the deep South we plant a shellie we call, "October Bean". We plant in mid July for harvest in October. They are a bush bean but may have short runners. It appears to be an oversized pinto and is very delicious when picked mature but tender. They're OK as a greenbean but not as good as Roma II in my opinion. The nearest I've found in the seed catalogs is French Horticulture.

Susan, You asked where all the 'brave' souls are who intended to plant fall tomatoes. I think we're all still here, but the thing to understand about fall tomatoes is that some years you 'need' them because the spring crop is playing out and its productivity is decreasing. Other years you don't 'need' fall tomatoes because the spring tomatoes are still going strong. I can't speak for everyone else, but my spring crop is in amazingly good shape, so I don't 'need' new plants for fall. That was a decision I made in early June, by the way, because early June is when I would have started seeds for fall tomatoes. I also could have started new plantings for fall from cuttings a week or two ago and still could do that now, but there's no reason to do that with the spring plantings still going strong. I suspect that if I kept records, I'd see that I do a fresh planting for fall about half the time, but not last year and not this year. I have grown longkeeping types and they are OK. Their flavor is nothing to get excited about but it still is superior to grocery store tomatoes. The key to success with longkeepers is that you have to have a place to put them where they can ripen slowly. I use the tornado shelter as a root cellar, so I have that. Depending on the space you have in your house, you may have room to store them and keep them as they ripen slowly. They are worth the effort if you don't have a lot of tomatoes frozen, canned or dehydrated to get you through winter. Since I started dehydrating so many in recent years, I haven't bothered with longkeeping types. The ones I've grown have included Longkeeper, Red October, Yellow In Red Out, Reverend Morrow's, Old-Fashioned Garden Peach and Winterkeeper. Sunray is another one that lasts forever on the kitchen counter even though it is not normally described as a longkeeper. Larry, I'm sorry the drought there is causing you so much trouble. I spent a huge amount of money watering my garden in June (the June water bill was three times higher than the May water bill, and the May water bill was twice as high as the April water bill) and would have lost everything if I hadn't irrigated. The rain that arrived here in late June/early July has kept it going a bit longer, but I'm pretty much at the point that if rain doesn't fall here in July, I may not be able to keep the garden going much longer. It is a simple financial decision, you know, because at some point you spend more to water than you'll get in produce out of the garden. Several times in recent years (2003, 2005, 2006 and 2007 come to mind), I've just basically turned off the water and said "I'm done" and let the garden die, and that was after having a water bill in the triple digits. It is the hardest thing in the world to do, but water is very expensive here where I live and it takes enormous amounts of it to water a huge garden in clay soil. So, you certainly have my sympathy. If it doesn't rain here in July, my garden may not survive until August and that's just the reality of a low rainfall year. Even in a good year we don't get enough rain in June, July and August, and we're not having a good rainfall year here in Love County. We go for long periods with no rain and then get so much at once that much of it runs off instead of soaking in. Diane, Here's the difference between Tim and I. Let's say we cut up a couple of big ol' maters and made BLT sandwiches for lunch. After the meal, if I am cleaning up the kitchen, I look at the two or three slices of tomato left on a plate and decide to eat them right then and there so they won't spoil. They are so yummy! If he is cleaning up the kitchen, he puts them into the refrigerator and NO ONE eats them because of the way their taste and texture change. He doesn't even eat them!!!! So, when I see slices of tomatoes in the fridge, I take them out and feed them to the chickens. I don't know why he doesn't just eat those couple of slices himself, offer them to me, or feed them to the chickens. Ezzirah, To keep that fresh-from-the-garden taste and texture, never refrigerate tomatoes. It basically reduces their quality to little better than that of the tasteless red 'excuses' for tomatoes that most all grocery stores sell. You'd think after well over 25 years of hearing me say "don't put the fresh tomatoes in the fridge" that my DH would understand not to do it, but in this case, it just goes in one ear and out the other. The funny part is that he doesn't eat them after he sticks them in the fridge. My DH is VERY spoiled. He is so used to always having tons of fresh garden produce around that he isn't very good at eating leftovers of anything. It drives me nuts. He is great at putting stuff in the fridge, but not at taking it out, reheating it and eating it. That just drives me nuts! (What is the point, after all, in putting it into the refrigerator if you aren't going to use it?) Sometimes I think men shouldn't be allowed in the kitchen, but then he cooks a lot in the summer when I'm canning a lot and sick of being in the kitchen, so I can't very well order him out of 'my' kitchen, now can I? Dawn

Gary, the longan is one fruit I did not much care for while in Thailand. They were quite bland and more "musky"...to me. Of course my wife and mother-in-law thought I was crazy. I've tasted Eggo's and his was more sweet than what I've had in Thailand. As for the humidity in Thailand? It's been awfully humid everywhere I've been. Not real sure about the cooler northern regions but have to imagine it's humid everywhere. So I too believe that they shouldn't be affected by humidity or they wouldn't be growing as well as they do in Florida. Humidity was one of my concerns for my lychee but that can't be either. The tree once thrived in the humidity. It still seems to be on the decline by-the-way. Real bummer. I may just dig it out and put it in a container and see what happens. If anyone thinks of a magic bullet, please let me know! Going to try a compost tea today or does anyone believe I should put it in a container as soon as possible?

Virginia Tech has a planting calendar based on the first frost date. I found it very helpful. Lettuce can be planted as late as early September in Virigia. It grows quickly, so it's not a problem. I had great success with swiss chard, kale, tatsoi, and bok choy last year. The chard was my favorite. Chard and kale actually last the entire winter, and you can pull it out from under the snow. Also try peas (snow peas and snap peas). Since you're in a container, get a bush type snap pea and use a tomato cage for a trellis. The taste is amazing -- no matter how many you planted, you will find you did not plant enough. Carrots and beets also work well in fall or winter.