I would hold off planting any more poplars. They grow like weeds around here with little human assistance, especially in cleared areas and from stumps of trees that were cut.

I like white pines and plant them around here whenever I get a chance. If I had the acreage, I'd also plant a lot of hardwoods. You might also plant lots more cedar trees at a closer spacing than recommended to cut for fence posts in the future.

Yes, I was thinking the same of the poplars. They grow fast and die young but if you wanted to use them as an interim bit of "shade" in order to get some undergrowth shade shrubs going then by all means get the poplars going and then replace them later with some larger native shade trees.

I'm from Canada and we call our Natural Resources offices something different from you guys which I think you call "Extension offices" but look them up on the net using the name of your county or give them a call and see what they have to offer for people with tracts of land who want to re-naturalize it. Here in Ontario our Ministry of Natural Resources offices have plans in place for people who want to reclaim land or make windbreaks, VERY INEXPENSIVE supplies of native trees and shrubs. There is a minimum of 25 that can be ordered but in your case I'm sure you would order more than that anyway. At any rate, it's an excellent deal up here because trees are extremely expensive to purchase at garden centers. I live in the city, inside a woodlot so I was thinking of using that service and asking my neighbors if they want to go in on it so that we'd get the minimum 25 trees.

Plan some paths first though. Have some fun on your computer and draft a few differnt plans with the family and then vote on which draft you like the best.

Congrats on your property, it sounds lovely! :o)

Barb
southern Ontario, CANADA zone 6a

You might want to thnk about adding some of the wood's edge trees too like red buds, dogwoods and crape myrtles.

I would not add poplars because 1) they reseed everywhere and 2) they tend to be brittle and drop large limbs that lay across trails. You might want to think about some oaks for the wildlife and some beech for the late yellow leaves. The beech grow pretty quickly, redbuds grow super fast, the oak will take their time.

You want a healthy mix of trees when you take the replanted woods as a whole so that no one disease attack will destroy the whole area.

I envy you 10 acres to plant.

Thanks! We're going to walk the wooded part of the property this Saturday and try to figure out what species are already there. The leaves haven't fallen off the trees yet so ID will not be difficult. I'm sure we can get a lot of the transplants from the woods. The county extension office will sell bulk pine trees inexpensively. I'm not sure what, if any, other species they offer but will call them and find out. I'm not too concerned about brittleness or longevity of the trees for this field, because it's pretty far away from where we plan to eventually build the house. If some trees eventually fall down we don't mind as it will create more wildlife habitat.

We're hoping to have a good mix of native hardwoods and evergreens there, but would like to get the beginnings of a woodland established there as soon as possible. I don't think it's out of the realm of reason to expect 15'-20' tall trees there within 5 years choking out the grass and turning the area into woods. From past experience white pines and cedars will grow fast, but maybe poplars aren't such a great idea for this spot. The Green Ash and River Birch at our house have grown super fast ... wonder if they could be options for this field? I really don't want all the woods on the property to be overrun with poplar.

We saw lots of Poplar (Tulip, Yellow?) and a few large cedars and pines in the woods last weekend. Saw 2 deer and an owl too!!! I remember seeing some Sassafras and Black Walnut trees. Should have paid better attention to the trees but at the time we were walking the property to get the lay of the land. It's going to be fun walking the woods Saturday and seeing what tree species are in there. I'll pay attention to the understory trees this time. There is probably a lot of Redbud ... they are everywhere around here. Usually a lot of Dogwood around too. I'm hoping to discover some wild PawPaw trees and blackberry/raspberry bushes.

Thanks,
Eric

Since you have the luxury of so much land how about planting a few spots of trees in clumps near the pathways? Not good for logging or straight woodstock, but it sure is pretty and makes a woods look more natural. I can always spot re foresting by the evenly spaced rows of single trees.

And I'd throw in a few odd balls too if I was as lucky as you. Something different like witch hazel, hackberry, paw paw etc. Something to add variety to the mix, even if they get crowded out in the long run. By putting the unique or speciman trees near the pathways you can create a varied effect without a lot of expnese.

Update ...
Saturday I bushhogged the fields for the first time. The land is about half wooded and the other half was in tall briars and weeds/broomsage. I tried to leave volunteer trees and there were quite a few of them. There were several volunteer locusts, a few pines and oaks, and a bunch of some other tree I wasn't able to ID without leaves. Next Spring I'm going to try to get a good variety of trees from the county extension service or Arbor Day. They should be a good start in turning this field back into woods. We also decided to try to turn two other fields on the property back into woods. I didn't see any PawPaw trees, blackberry, or raspberry bushes so we are going to plant some in the Spring. One thing we did notice is that there are lots more Black Walnut trees than we had originally thought. There must be hundreds on the property. We opened up a few and had some walnuts. I took about 140 pictures before bushhogging ... Saturday is the first day we have been able to go out and work on the property since buying it so the pics are going to be an interesting "log" of the progress over time.

Eric, it sounds like you have a good plan, and I know you and your family will enjoy the property even before you build a home there. I think you have received some very good suggestions so far.
We were in a similar situation to yours and are now re-foresting a field where we had a lot of old growth pine cut before we built. They left it in quite a mess and we really didn't get started clearing until we built the house, but I can tell you that you will be amazed at what a difference 5 years will make. We have "harvested" quite a few native trees from the woods and successfully transplanted them. Our transplants include cedar, oak (several varieties), elm, redbud, a few pines, and even a poplar or two. Dogwoods don't like to be moved very much but you can try. For understory, try oakleaf hydrangea. They wil get quite large and you can propagate easily. They would be nice to put along a pathway to provide some additional cover, color, and definition in your new wooded area. A couple of other shrubs for understory would be beautyberry (callicarpa), red buckeye, and viburnum. Most of these like a little shade, so you should start with the trees first.

We do plan to harvest some trees from the woods and plant in late winter. I was thinking too that Leland Cypress might be an option ... any reasons not to plant a few Leland Cypress out there?

I can't think of a reason not to. They are fast growing in our zone and should do well for you as well as adding some graceful evergreen shape to your bare area. I think they are susceptible to bagworms, which are a pain, but you can treat for those once a year. I haven't planted any yet, but have been eyeing them recently and may try them myself where I am planning a grouping of evergreens and conifers.

Black walnut trees contain juglone, a hormone which inhibits growth of certain plants growing around them. There are lists of plants that will grow near walnuts. I'd go for some colorful autumn trees like maples, on the property. Enjoy.

Another update: Sunday afternoon we took the kids for a walk in the woods and I was able to look over the trees even better. There is lots of Yellow Poplar, Black Walnut, and more Cedar than I originally thought. I bet we could pick up enough walnuts to fill up a truck bed. Also saw a good number of Dogwoods and Maples ... not positive on the ID but I think they were Sugar Maples. The remaining leaves are completely brown so not sure there. I also noticed alot of Shagbark Hickory (missed them last weekend) and am very happy to say that I saw dozens of healthy young "Flatbark" Elms which is one of my favorite species. I was really hoping to find a few Beech trees but didn't see any. I saw only a couple of Oak trees so we need more of them too. Will definitely plant some Beech and Oak in late winter. Saw several large trees I couldn't identify ... going to try to figure out what they are. There is a very distinct deer trail through the woods with 3 buck rubs along it. I'm slowly but surely "learning" the woods there and have big plans for it in a couple more months.

I found out that our local county soil conservation service will sell bulk seedlings very inexpensively. They sell around 40 different native tree species. The smallest quantities they sell are 500 for evergreens and 125 for hardwoods. I'm planning now on buying 125 Red Oak seedlings in late February. Some will go in the field we are going to reclaim into woods, other will go into areas of the woods that don't have a proper canopy. And yet other I'm going to plant in some spots on the property we just want more trees in.

Going back to flowerkitty's comment, if you know where on the property you are going to build you might now plant the trees you want surrounding it too, if they aren't in place already.

Growing anything else beside poplar is not easy task,
you need to get rid of allot of poplar to get sunlight in.
Poplar grows like weed!
In this pic, this kind of cutting, trunks laying all over the place helps getting your newly planted trees beeing eaten by moose.

This is how I turn my poplar bush into a mixed forest..

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This is how I "kill" poplar..

We do know the exact spot where the house will be built. There are 2 large maple trees, a sassafras "grove", and a large cedar near the house spot. We are planning to plant an orchard near there in the Spring.

Here are several pictures taken about 2 weeks ago. They show the woods, some deer rubs, my 8 y/o collecting walnuts, me bushhogging the fields, and my girls & I in one of the fields after it has been bushhogged. There are also several shots of the field we plan to turn back into woods (before it was bushhogged).

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It is interesting that you used a bushhog to start a woodland. I took the opposite approach in north Florida. I simply stopped mowing sections of my newly aquired property. I started by planting a couple of local tree species but quit because wax myrtle, sweet gum, pines, black gum, red maple, persimmon, American holly and a few oak species popped up without assistance. Wax myrtles, sweet gums and pines are over eight feet tall in three years and I have had to thin them - especially the pines that are suseptible to fungal disease. Open spaces are filled with goldenrod, asters and other wildflowers. This year, wildflowers appeared that I have never seen in the yard before. Maybe it helped that my soil is poor and the grass was never very dense.

Heavenly looking property Eric, thanks for sharing the great pics... your kids are darling. :o)

Barb
southern Ontario, CANADA zone 6a

The soil is very rich there and the weeds/broomsage/briars were 10' tall in some areas. Not sure bushhogging was the best plan but I was worried the other vegetation would choke out the young trees. We also wanted to see how the land layed and if there were any rocks or depressions. I did leave every volunteer tree I could see from the tractor. It seemed most of the volunteers were Loblolly Pine, Sumac, Honey Locust, and a few others I couldn't identify. In late winter/early Spring we will plant hundreds of trees there. I'm planning to start with Green Ash & Red Oak, and some evergreens. We are planning a "tree party" in the Spring too ... have a bunch of friends over and ask them to bring a tree to plant. I'll probably bushhog once more next Summer and try to miss all the saplings. Not sure if we will bushhog any more after that. And thanks Barb! The kids and my wife are really enjoying the property.

Here's a shot of the field now that it's done being bushhogged. You can just barely see a few of the volunteer trees we left. On the left and back of it is woods, on the right is just a grown up fencerow.
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Congrats on your new property! Looks like a great place to raise kids. We have 10 acres also but not as many trees. I wish we had more. I've got you beat on rocks though - We have lots of those. lol
Missouri has a similar program with low cost tree seedlings for landowners here and it's a great deal. Ours come in bundles of 25 and there are a couple variety packs that are nice. If you can get them through the first year, they're on their way. One of the forum members here, Johnstaci, has been planting hundreds. He has posted questions in the Tree Forum so you might want to check there for info. I have ordered a few bundles myself. Some of them were native shrubs which I also got through the Missouri Department of Conservation. I tried to plant some fruiting/berrying things for the birds such as gray dogwood, wild plum, spicebush, hawthorn, and deciduous holly - and hazelnuts (for me).
I don't have a deer problem here but do put plastic tree protectors on my little trees in the winter to keep them safe from rabbits. I watered mine in July and August when it was hot and dry (hooked several hoses together and ran water from house) but maybe most would've made it through without my help. I wasn't as successful with evergreens but I'm not sure why.
Good luck with your project.

Thanks Christie! I wish we could get more than 10 acres too, but we are close to a metro area of over 1 million (Nashville) and land is really expensive around here. We weren't planning to buy for another year or two but ran across this land for sale, the price was right, so we went ahead and got it. Unimproved farmland is going up in value around 20% a year around here. I grew up on over 1,000 acres in Kentucky so it's really nice to finally have some space. It's going to be a good thing for the kids and my wife as well.

We are planning to order seedlings soon from the county soil conservation service. They have a wide selection of evergreens and hardwoods, and sell in blocks of 125, 500, and 1000. They don't sell variety packs but I'll try to get some variety through other channels. Thanks for the heads up on Johnstaci's posts, I read them and several of my questions were answered.

We do have a lot of deer here and they will probably cause some damage to whatever we plant. Our 10 acres is on a country backroad off a main road, and it's surrounded by a couple larger wooded farms so there is alot of deer and wildlife. I've planted lots of trees on my parent's farm in the past (with a dibble bar) so I've got some idea of what I'm getting into. We won't be able to water these at all so I'm going to try to plant them at the best time possible ... probably late February.

Eric

Deer, rabbits, and field mice can turn a dream to a nightmare. Planting bigger caliber deters the rabbits and field mice, but deer will keep browsing the tops of the short trees. I thought I had a plan and planted 6-8 ft tall cottonwoods along a stream and they managed to clip them down to 4 feet. But willows and poplars are choice browse trees for the vegetarians. Plant less desirable trees should help some.
I have resorted growing my trees in a backyard nursery until they gain size. If you don't plan on living on the place, the wildlife pressure will be worse, so make sure you plant only the fastest growing species. I have some slower growing species that withered under the grazing pressure.
Also, look into bamboo. Some of running bamboo can create a forest of their own, such as cold-hardy varieties like Phyllostachys rubromarginata http://www.lewisbamboo.com/rubromar.html
http://www.lewisbamboo.com/habits.html
Supposedly, deer don't like to eat bamboo as much as other stuff. I'm start trying different bamboo varieties this year and so far deer haven't bothered them. Some rabbits have nibbled on them. Running bamboo tends to get bad press from people planting it in their backyards and letting it spread onto their neighbors lawn, but in a natural environment it may have a niche.

A place where I decided to plant bamboo. Trying to stop ditch
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I've also read that deer don't eat pear seedlings as willfully as other tree browse. Possibly because they don't like the taste or maybe because of their sharp branch spurs. So I'm growing pear seedlings in the nursery and may transplant them out next year.

Is there a natural depression where a little pond can be built. They can add character to a little piece of land.
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There seem to be a lot of deer there based on how many rubs and scrapes there are in the woods, and I've seen them several times. I saw lots of rabbits while bushhogging the field, and have seen mice running around in the barn. There are also lots of wild turkey over there and one morning I saw 3 coyotes. The deer have eaten on some of the pine seedlings over there. But we really do want the wildlife and will try to work around it. I was thinking of planting white pine, green ash, and red oaks to start this reforesting project. The orchard shouldn't be a problem because we plan to plant relatively large nursery bought trees in late winter.

Very interesting pictures. In the place where you are going to plant the bamboo, is that rain runoff only or does water flow there all the time? There are 3 different places on the property that would be a good spot for a pond, and we've already decided on one of them. The bulldozer is actually coming over Saturday morning to start. We are also going to use the dozer to fix the road and smooth some rough spots in the fields too. (Road onto the property was never ditched properly and has eroded a little) Might even take out one of the fencerows with the dozer.

These photos of are a heavy snow melt in spring 2003. Snow melt or heavy rains 5+ inches usually cause it to swell into a gully washer. The stream usually runs all year, except when there is drought. Its quite a bit smaller than what these photos show.
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I have since put in a dropdown pipe so the ditch will not cut back farther. 50 ft upstream is property fenceline and I would rather not have a ditch ruin the fence. I have added dropdown pipes on all the other ditches,too. I have also planted 10 different bamboo to help hold the banks in the different locations.

Basswood natural regeneration after fenced out from cattle
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A spring 2000 planting of silver maple. Photo taken in 2003
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Also, sometimes direct seeding is used in high grazing pressured areas.

Here is a link that might be useful: direct seeding

Great pictures! I can see how the stream flows now. What type of trees are in the vicinity of the stream there? Thanks for the direct seeding link, very interesting.

There is a few acres of flat ground along this stream gully. Typical trees that grow along it are white/red elms, silver maple, cottonwood, willows, black walnut, and a lot of scrubby boxelders and white mulberries. I was thinking of clearcutting it and replanting with valuable wooded species such as more black walnut, red oak, hard maple, and some others. Or another possible thing to do, but would obviously be more expensive, is I could build dikes/dams along it and reintroduce the wetland that originally was here. Then maybe plant some bald cypress and have my own bald cypress swamp.:)

18' circumference eastern cottonwood above on neighbor's property along the stream.
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Make sure you take your kids out there and see the many interesting things in nature.
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Have fun with your little piece of paradise. :)

Are you sure you want to plant bamboo? It's very agressive, and if you decide you want to get rid of it, or keep it under control...it's a nightmare.

Also, I think you have a good opportunity to make little clearings here and there and make small prairies, which will attract even more wildlife. You have a beautiful property, and I hope you enjoy it as much as I enjoyed looking at it! April

Is that bamboo question directed towards me? As you can see from my pics, running bamboo with their extensive root system is the only plant that is going to stop the gully.

Bamboo is only invasive locally. It flowers intervals are so long that seed production is something that isn't counted upon.

ahughes798, can you elaborate further with your personal experiences you've had with this plant.

Is cane an option? It's native in this area and there is wild river cane in many places on my parent's farm in Kentucky. It almost always grows on stream or creek banks and is good at stopping erosion. Here's a short article about someone using native river cane on their farm:

http://www.watersheds.org/farm/johncash.htm

I have fought running bamboos in north Florida and can tell you that they may only be locally invasive but they take up a large area of their locality and are hard to stop once established. It took two to three years of cutting and spraying to kill ten-year old colonies here. It is obvious that you have a serious problem but there is always more than one way to deal with any problem. Like a lot of easy solutions, running bamboo might cause you more problems in the long run. Riprap (if you have rocks or logs available), native cane, willows, river birch and other native streamside plants can do a similar job although it may take more money and time in the beginning. The native plants will fit into your ecosystem and support native wildlife better than an exotic bamboo, too.

Yes, native cane(Arundinaria gigantea) could be a good one for erosion control and wildlife habitat. It is a little more restricted in growth habit than a lot of the asian phyllostachys. If your parent's have it, then I guess its possible you can dig it up without any expensive costs associated with buying the plant. People on the bamboo forum can tell you when the best time to dig it up is, and what tools are necessary. Thanks for sharing that article, hadn't seen that one, yet.

Interesting running commentary here.

Eric: you've got an exciting project ahead of you. Let's hope your kids inherit your passion for land stewardship.

lkz5ia: your posted history of investigating vigorous non-native species may cause these sentences to blow off with the prairie winds, but maybe you could consider them "invasive comments" and try sowing them as a simple experiment >%-D

Resolving the issue of an undesirable gully situation is likely going to take much more than planting bamboo species, vigorous or not, native or not. You may have already researched stream dynamics; if so, then this will be a limited primer for those who haven't yet.

Above, it was mentioned that these images represent a former wetland. Due to past land use practices (assuming Iowa, assuming field agriculture, assuming grazing/cattle, assuming tiling/drainage "improvements", assuming land division irrespective of natural systems) there may not be any chance to recreate that condition. Neighbors upstream are your biggest allies in your endeavor, or maybe your worst enemies. Slow down the water flow, if you want to stabilize and improve the gullying situation.

As far as I know, Iowa has relatively low gradients when it comes to topography. It also has few canyons. To get gullies like you are showing here, with rapid advancement upstream, you have an increased flow situation combined with lack of normal vegetation for the site (that formerly held soils in place). Normal vegetation for Iowa includes quite a few woody riparian species (you've mentioned many in your posts, with vigorous root systems ideally evolved to hold soils together in this kind of situation) as well as many herbaceous species (prairie style) with very deep root systems.

I think this is where the gap occurs. Bamboo plants (in my limited use experience) aren't necessarily known for depth of rooting, more so for vigorous spreading in horizontal directions. In an erosive condition as you've illustrated, soils will likely wash away underneath and the support systems fail. Deeper rooted species, adapted to YOUR site, combined with some structural (engineered) stabilization offer a better scenario. Yes, this can be a costly solution, but isn't always.

Usually, some "toe-of-slope" stabilizer must be installed to hold the base of the bank in place while the organic (plant matter) component is getting growing and extending roots throughout the soil profile that you want to hold together. This can be stone, logs, stumps, brush, or other things; one must understand the dynamics enough to know what sort of application to make. Filling behind the stabilizer and planting (sometimes with a stabilization or erosion control fabric, natural material or inorganic) comes next. Here's where you have the opportunity to be frugal. Species you've mentioned (willow, cottonwood, sycamore, etc.) are all great to use as LIVE STAKES, meaning you cut live branches/parts in the dormant season and simply drive them into the ground. Doubles as staking for erosion control fabrics, too. This is a way to "forest" a creek bank without prohibitive costs, and stay ahead of the hoofed and webbed-foot browsers. Apply the technique mentioned by Chester_Grant in the Trees forum to keep out deer (creating a raised grid of fallen timber, maybe some of the excess Ailanthus you are raising, or Pyrus) to extend the establishment time of the live stakes. There are many other species that work in this regard, especially shrubby species that are copious fruiters, so that you'll be supporting several system restoration components simultaneously (hydrology, soil stabilization, and faunal habitat).

Concurrent with the attempt to stem the advance of the gully, slowing water down upstream through several efforts will pay dividends in the stabilization and enhancement of the system and habitant. Using the same type of riparian species (live staked or whole plants) in the watershed above the gully will slow down water flow, and trap sediments. Additionally, placement of weir structures (soil berming, stone, logs, stumps, brush, etc.; I've used newspaper bales) to "dam" the flow periodically will reduce the rate of runoff and reduce the rate of erosion in the gullying area. Yes, this will raise the temporary water table or surface impoundment, and that's where I was going with the "neighbors upstream" comment. If this is unfavorable to their land management practices or concerns, then you may not be able to implement this range of alternatives.

Drop-down pipes solve short-term issues on site, and pass them on rapidly downstream to whomever's property comes next. You don't say how large/small a property you manage, or how big the watershed is that feeds it hydrology, but the management principles apply anyway. Slowing the water down higher up in the system pays dividends throughout, so working on the smaller "ditches" first that feed the larger stream maybe be the best approach.

Whew! Probably lost some readers in that slow-moving train of thoughts. FWIW. Good luck in the project; we will all learn something from the efforts related here.

I've enjoyed this thread a lot and have learned a great deal, not really ready for it to end yet :)

If I were trying to deal with the eroded area I might do the following in the Spring:

1) riprap
2) use a tractor and graderbox or whatever power tool or machinery is available to fill in some dirt around the riprap
3) plant lots of cane in the area and maybe a few cypress if there is enough light.

The key to stopping a problem like that is threefold: a) slow down the water b) spread it out over a wider area c) have the fastest moving part of the water hit 'stuff' that won't easily be dislodged such as large rocks or sturdy roots and stems

Thanks for the comments Viburnumvalley, I particularly enjoyed reading about the live stakes concept. I did quite a bit of bulldozing last weekend and will post pics when I get the chance.

Just so readers don't think this is some made-up idea....

Here is a link that might be useful: Live staking website from NCSU

Have you considered pussy willows as a creek side planting? They grow very fast, love wet feet and root easily. I put one on my creek bank (it was no more than a foot long piece that came in a flower arrangement and had started to root in the vase) and it is now eight feet tall and six feet wide. The past two springs I pruned it down severly, to within a foot of the previous year's cut, used some in flower arrangements and stuck the rest of the twigs in the creek bank. At least 75% of the twigs have rooted each year. Now I look forward to lots of pussy willows each spring and no more erosion.

Eric,
I would call the map libary at the University of Tennesee and find old aerial photos from the 1930's and 40's as well as old plat books from the 19th century. These will show if all your land is "old field" growth not true woodland and the old plats will also show area of woodland that might have occured on your property. Finally, a soil map will indicate if an area was woodland, wetland, prairie. Personally, I would like some grassland on my property along with the woods.

That's a good idea, I'll look into it. From the lay of the land you can tell to some degree where it would be logical for there to be woods or pasture. Some of the trees out there had to be around in the 30's and 40's (as well as some of the logging stumps) so that's a good indicator of where the woods were originally. But maybe more can be found out about the cleared areas.

A man down the road who has 181 acres gave me a little history of the property. He said the property and everything around it were originally part of a very large farm, which was sold off in smaller tracts in the 60's when the original owner died. My property is the smallest of those tracts, and is surrounded by much larger farms that have never been split up further.

It's definitely not wetland, although there is a creek at the front. Some very well could have been native prairie at some time. We have soil maps available on the internet through an extensive county GIS system, it's a very nice resource. I've gotten lots of high resolution aerial photography and other information from the website. I've also been able to plan all our projects from the maps, and with a little Photoshop work on the top.

Is this thread still active? It's really interesting but I can't see any of the pictures. Also, what does the property look like now?

Ericccc we need an update!