Without permission, I think that it is wrong.

One of the great things about plants is that they GROW. They will replace what you take. Therefore, I think the major questions for such public snipping are: 1. is there an owner whom you could ask permission of?; and 2. are you damaging the health or appearance of the plant?

> First- the front entrance to your neighborhood has some huge coleus plants

This one is a bit questionable. It would be preferable to ask the person who does the landscaping first. On the other hand, we all know that taking cuttings from coleus does not damage the plant, and often helps it to grow in a better shape. I don't think you'll go straight to hell if you are careful and considerate.

> Or- what about "ditch lilies" and other wildflowers growing beside roads that are not on a private individuals property and not the ones that the state plants by the highways. (im talkign about dividing, not taking the whole plant)

This is sometimes known as "rustling". Taking rose cuttings from waste areas is a favorite past-time of rose rustlers, and it has saved valuable old roses and other heirloom plants from extinction. Thousands of people across the nation see nothing wrong with this practice, and I don't either. Just be SURE that it's not private property, and as you said don't remove the entire plant or entire clump/colony.

> third- A public building (lets say a post office) has a beaustiful hardy prickly pear. is it wrong to pull some ripe fruits off it to try to collect some seeds?

Removing a few fruits doesn't hurt the plant at all -- and, in fact, the plant will be losing those fruits anyway. I wouldn't remove many fruits, and I would try to do it in an unobtrusive spot so as not to damage the appearance of the plant. If you are worried about it, simply go inside and ask one of the workers for permission.

I would advise much caution in all the above instances. Someone is buying, planting, and taking care of the plants at subdivision entrances. If you are seen take cuttings without permission, I can imagine problems. So far as taking any plant material from public places on state or federal property, there are laws against that, and I think even a small cutting could end up costing you a fortune.

Morally speaking, I personnally don't think it's bad. Like amazindirt said, they grow back. One big problem could occur if a lot of people did it. Everyone taking a cutting might not individually make a difference, but the cumulative effect could add up.

You won't see me taking cuttings or seeds from any public place like that. I am very careful to be inconspicuous. I am also very conscientious about not hurting the plant or the visual aspects of the area.

I wouldn't take anything from the property of ANY federal building...especially the Post Office! Can you say theft of federal property? Spending X-mas sharing bologna and crackers with my cellmate in the Atlanta Federal Penitentiary is not my idea of a nice holiday. All it would take is one anal employee to go "postal" on you.

Well I think the stuff in the ditch is fair game!

Who's ditch? Someone has to own that ditch. If it were my ditch and I had a shotgun....

I have a ditch and several shotguns but no flowers in either so I should be alright.

I'm not talking about in front of peoples houses, on the side of the roads! Around here the county mows and will mow down the flowers, cattails, etc. that are growing along the roadside.

Thank you jgwoodard!

Again, if it's my ditch I don't won't anyone taking my plants. Ditches belong to someone. If you steal things from someone's ditch, you might as well go up next to their house and dig up their flowers or shrubs.

Also, there are reasons for the laws against collecting from public places. I think you could look at it like the speed limit. If one person goes just a few miles per hour above the speed limit, it probably won't hurt. However, without the speed limit, the roads would become a very bad place to drive.

If you DO collect plant material from PUBLIC places, just be careful and make sure what you do, even if multiplied a few times (because you probably won't be the only one), doesn't hurt the plants or landscape.

The real problem comes in when someone, without common sense and with a little extra greed, starts collecting. I can think of one person that if let loose on the local post office would probably just leave a little mulch but not much else.

"If you DO collect plant material from PUBLIC places, just be careful and make sure what you do, even if multiplied a few times (because you probably won't be the only one), doesn't hurt the plants or landscape. "

I think this is the essential point. No collecting from private property without permission, and no collecting from public or abandoned property that damages the plant (or colony of plants).

There are plenty of public and/or abandoned spots with plants to collect. For instance, I know of abandoned roses in several locations around town that are routinely mowed down by road crews every summer. Some of them have survived, some have not. There are many similar situations with plants worthy of saving, all across the nation. Heck, there are whole societies of people -- like the Texas Rose Rustlers -- who are dedicated to saving such plants.

Then there is also collecting from development sites. But that's a whole different kettle of fish. ;-)

Many good points here. It really is about using caution and good judgement. Anyone who propagates a large variety of plants knows that it isn't harmful to take seed, and often it is really the only way to ensure that seed will germinate. Most people who have trade secrets and are engaged in breeding for commercial purposes, patents, etc. will take precautions and guard their materials. I am much more careful with genetic material that I feel is valuable for my hybridization programs than the "general" garden plants I grow. I would never plant special material in conspicuous places where passersby had easy access. There have been notable cases of people stealing pollen from private property of specialists, and that can be serious (See link below). Many of the plants sold by garden centers and nurseries etc. are propagated illegally. In many cases they even use the name of the protected cultivar when it is a seedling. They aren't physically going onto property, but it's the equivalent of making a copy of Photoshop and then selling it with the brand name attached. They could easily be sued, but most people don't bother.

I would never take something from property where someone has erected a residence though. Besides ethical and legal concerns, there are too many shotgun-weilding crazies in good-ole TN. ;-) I even worry sometimes about going for a walk in the woods these days (especially with my daughter!). I do it anyway, but do you know that there are literally places in Davidson County where people still hunt or have target practice with guns? Scary.

Digging something up (in some cases, even divisions) is a totally different story though. I draw the line there, and it is essential to go through proper channels for so many reasons. In some cases it is very simple. In Tennessee, permits for collecting on public lands (particularly some rare or threatened species) are fairly easy to obtain. There are simple restrictions and seasons. I believe that the fact they don't bother offering permits for collecting common species on public lands is that it simply isn't necessary, and in most cases they don't care. A simple and pseudo-legal solution would be to get a permit to collect ginseng from public lands and then collect other non-regulated things while there. National/state parks and other areas where it is expressly prohibited are exceptions. It is true, however, that those with a bit of an adventurous spirit and explorer's mindset will end up with lots of cool things in their gardens. And it doesn't stop with plants. You wouldn't have people like George Soros or Bill Gates if all people were averse to risks.

Here is a link that might be useful: Invasion of the pollen snatchers

I have been known to "snitch" seeds in public places, but I have not taken cuttings or dug.

This reminds me of a very entertaining story you will enjoy.

I was sitting in our car as my Mother was going into the Post office of a very rural town here in west TN. I was admiring the landscaping that had been planted in the spring. The 3 planters were about 3 ft high & about 6 ft wide & 10 ft long done in nice stonework. They were stuffed full of nice perrenials along with annuals for color. I was looking at the individual plants, because I really liked the way they had done the layout (texture, color sizes, etc.) Then I spotted it....WHOA it can't be.

I get out of the car to get a closer look. Yep it's what I thought it was. OMG I cannot believe this. Right smack in the middle of each planter was a thriving marijuana plant about 3 ft tall.

Mom came out of the PO & I showed it to her. She had never seen one, so she was doubting it was really one. No - I was not going to explain how I KNEW what it was - so I was pondering what to say next & out SHE came.

This angry old lady came flying out of the post office, sling a broom, screeching at me & Mom about stealing her precious plants. She informed us she was calling the cops since she figured out who was stealing her plants that she was babying & she wrote down my tag number.

I informed her that we were NOT trying to take anything & I was admiring the planters when I noticed these "plants" & I asked her if she knew what they were.

She informed me they were a rare type of Japanese Maple. I asked her where she got them - You're going to love this one.

She throws her chin up & informs us that her 16 yr old Grandson raised them from seed & these were just 3 of the smallest ones. She was just so proud of her grandson taking an interest in her gardens & evidently he has a green thumb.

I told her that she needed to get rid of them, because they were wacky weed - AKA marijuana. She didn't want to believe me. So, I told her to go ahead & call the police on me & my Mom, then we'd see. She didn't call the cops, but as I drove by the following day, I saw they were gone.

I chuckle every time I go by & see the lady tending those beds & I wonder if her Grandson is still gardening.

hosta_mom, I like that story!

It somehow reminded me of the time I visited the hydoponics store and noticed I was the only one not dressed in studded leather with colored hair.

Brandon are you sure you went through the correct door?
Norm who has pinched a few plants.

It's all a matter of balance. In my area (Rutherford County), where acres of trees and old pastures are torn down every day for new construction, I feel perfectly justified taking a seedhead or cutting here or there. If I don't, it's just going to get tilled under. I feel that I'm doing my small part to preserve the natural history of the area. (maybe I have a Robin Hood complex).

As for concerns about overdoing it, how many people do you suppose even notice the plants outside of the post office, let alone take a seed? Get some perspective, people. Most folks don't care about plants. They plop a few privets and Bradford Pears in front of the house and forget it.

That said, individual property rights should be respected. But how about having a generous spirit, ditch owners? Don't put your prized orchids in the ditch, and don't pull the trigger if someone takes a trumpet vine sucker.

tnnative, you have obviously never talked to someone that runs an arboretum or botanical garden. You should read all the stories on some of the other forums and you'd understand a lot better.

maternut, I was definitely in the right door. When I went in, I was just in my own little world. Illegal uses of hydroponics hadn't crossed my mind. I was just looking around at all the neat stuff and then noticed all the punked-out (if that's a word) people also looking. My first thought was how neat it was that someone so different than me was also interested in plants. Then I woke up and realized their interests in plants were much more focused than mine. LOL

This has got to be the best thread I've ever read. Hosta Mom your story is HYSTERICAL. Personally I have begged, borrowed and rustled a few cuttings and seeds in my day, but never STOLEN them ;-) I learned it from my Mom who learned it from her Mom who learned it from her's. Seriously. My mother remembers when she was a little girl, her grandmother pinched a cutting of a shrub at a cemetary and she was horrified that her Grandmother would STEAL. But she grew into it. I think most of us have enough respect for plants and for property that a little wrangling is not going to destroy the planet or anything! I don't walk onto other people's property uninvited any more than I would want them on mine (oh yeh I do figure they are armed too) and I would not take anything from a protected or posted area. But that still leaves a tempting number of opportunities. Like in most things, common sense and respect for others goes a long way.
signed,
a proud rustler, but not a theif ;-)

Speaking of public gardens --

The week after Bloomsdays this year, somebody came in and DUG UP some expensive young conifers from the UT gardens, AND walked off with about $150 worth of bog plants that had just been donated to the gardens. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR.

That is sad amazingdirt. It's a shame places can't use unusual and valuable things without fear of someone taking them. I believe in the alpine glass houses at Wisley the plants are wired to alarm systems.

That is funny hosta mom. I found a lone plant adjacent to our school here in Korea a few months ago. It was planted in fairly deep shade which shows the perpetrator wasn't very knowledgable. I showed it to people and got a kick out of it. Brandon, I'm a little surprised at what you described. Are you sure you weren't in a meth lab? I would have expected birkenstocks, jeans and a t-shirt... or perhaps a suit and tie. :-)

I was surprised too. The store looked so professional and well merchandised. I was there for about 20 minutes, and besides the sales clerk, I was the only one not in punk style.

Wisley looks very interesting! I bet it would take at least a full day for just a quick visit. Somebody buy me an airline ticket and pay for my hotel room so I can go see it in person.