Excellent... thank you, SO. I think chemistry was my worst subject in high school, so having you summarize that simply and plainly is much appreciated! No danger of getting our soils anywhere near 6, eh? lol We must have excellent buffering qualities (hope I'm using that term correctly), though, because the efforts to lower pH here seem to be sticking better than areas such as daninthedirt is speaking of (great username, by the way, Dan). I also have a rather easy time lowering water pH for our aquarium fish; half distilled and half dechlorinated tap water keeps it in a comfortable range for them without having to purchase adjusting chemicals. (We're now on the river water pipeline that goes into town; well water was much, much worse and I could only use a small amount mixed with the distilled.) We're rural in the Humboldt area, but we have family who is mixed farming the Young/Allan area. :) Prairie Garden Seeds is in Humboldt here and I met Jim and his family briefly when I picked up a seed order last year. Nice folks. I should ask for a tour of the seed gardens someday. One more question. Our garden has flooded before. How long does it take for the iron to then get back to an unavailable state after such an incident? So as not to hijack crabbygardener's thread any further (sorry about that), I'm going to spin off with a new post over in the soil forum regarding my question about zinc and copper. This post was edited by macky77 on Sun, Mar 16, 14 at 11:29

Justaguy, You stated awhile ago that you add vinegar to your watering. Do you also add Dolomite to your container mix? I used to until I realized what was happening in my containers due to the irrigation water being high in alkalinity (ph only 7.5). Now I split the total amount between lime and gypsum and in containers that drain onto soil where I have plants growing nearby I skip lime entirely and just use gypsum for the Ca and then use Foliage Pro which has Ca and Mg in it. I still use vinegar most every time I water though after seeing what soil tests indicated the tap water did to the native (ground) soil's pH over a few years and my own testing of container pH after a season. I will test things again after this season and see what's what. If necessary I will omit lime and just use gypsum + Foliage Pro. As it is I have 3 wine barrel containers that no longer have lime added as they drain onto the area my in ground blueberries grow.

Hi Turk, Although there is always an acidic taste with lactic acid fermenting the original flavor of the vegetable always comes through. I've grown several paprika types from Spain and have started a very highly recommended hybrid (Paprika Supreme) this year, but have not fermented any yet. I chose nylon tule for my weight bags because I believe it to be stable and food safe. And that is also the reason I chose the glass beads. A much more convenient solution to weighting would be a plastic bag with water and some air in it. More and more I find myself not using any weight whatsoever because the starters I use are so active. If your liquid kefir drink hasn't been pasteurized or treated with preservatives it should make an excellent starter. I would put a few ounces into a jar, add some whole milk and wait 3 or 4 days and see how it ferments. You should get a nice sweet, acidic smelling result. The grains (curd) will be very small for some weeks, but will gradually grow in size. They do not need to be large for the mixture to work as a starter. Both the curds and the more liquid whey work well as starters. I always use a mixture of both. For my sourdough starters I use 2 parts pure water to 1 part flour. There are some excellent sourdough threads on this forum. If you do decide to try fermenting, please let us know your results. Regards, jt

Ah, hex you want this to be so wrong. Sorry but you can look up the "no nutritional value" on hydroponics it's well documented. An yes your right the plants don't care what the source of those elements are. But we're not talking about the plants but what "feeds on them". But lets talk about something else. You mentioned a perpetual motion machine. Well, yes that's what life is. it's in the very air we breathe. The plants breathe in bacteria that has the nitrogen cycle living inside it. The plant nitrogen (waste) cycle is part of that too. Even in an anaerobic system that still goes on. I have apple and pear trees that are ten years old that have been flowering, fruiting as well. With no intervention from me other than water if I notice. That means no fertilizer either. The bucket design captures rainfall so that wasn't often. Oh, that's right there's another difference. Capturing the rain water is taboo for your form of hydroponics. I mean with all the measurements and such. Haven't needed to take a reading ph or other wise in more than 20yrs. As for growing something..a tomato. Really. Is that the hill you standing on. I'm showing Cashews, Macadamia nuts,, coffee, 3 kinds of Bio-Fuel. Apples, pears, Plums, peaches all growing happily in the system. I bring pictures of everything. There even Strawberries flowering this year that grow anaerobically. Let's just off the top of my head there are Norfolk pines, Fiddle leaf figs, Sago palms, cactus, White and Yellow Birds of Paradise, Orchids, Pony Tail palms, Citrus. All growing quite happily. Those pictures are already on here. As for water consumption on average each tight 5gal container holds about three an a half gallons. That water last between 45 and 60 days with out rain. If I get a good rain once a month I don't have to water at all.