Thanks Tony I'm new to apples and wasn't sure what would happen, but what you say makes sense to me. Tree is only 14" high including rootstock, so I know flowering would suck the life right out of it. Pam in cinti

Ah, what a question! A good one for those who may be worried after the recent discussion of your shummard oak in Texas. First let me say that you should not be too worried about narrow branch angles. Yes they split sometimes, but I suggest that you go around for a few hours and observe as many mature trees as you can of different species and see what you find. I think you will find lots and lots of narrow angled branches on these trees that have not broken for years and years and they are good parts of the crowns of beautiful trees. Why? Well, trees have evolved with growth tendencies that work and help the tree survive. If you see a lot of these branches and they result from the natural growth tendencies of trees that have evolved successfully over many millions of years, they can't be that bad. Next, different branch angles are OK for one species and not for another. For example, one of the most wonderful trees in the world, unfortunately devestated by an imported disease, is the American elm. The most beautiful of these is the kind of typical form that once was common along streets in towns throughout New England. The best of these had a high arching form created by some very narrow angled branches. But these work well with American elms because to the kind of grain the wood has. OK there are species differences in what angle branches might take and still be strong. There are also individual factors within a species of tree that will make one branch at a 25% angle strong, and another weak. One of the specific things that happens, and I don't know why it happens, is that occasionally a branch will get bark pinched in the crotch where the branch joins the tree. This is called "included" bark. This results in a very weak joining with the trunk. Sometimes without included bark the grain of the wood suppoting a branch will be weak, and to be honest, I have no idea why. Another factor, and probably one of the most important, is the size of the branch--smaller branches with a narrow crotch angle do not catch so much wind, or ice, or whatever, and are less likely to split. Another factor is the structure of the joint--if there is a kind of rounded "bridge" of wood between the branch and the trunk, even if the angle is accute, the branch will be less likely to split. If the branch is joined to the trunk with a narrow "V" angle that seems almost to extend down into the wood itself, it will be weaker. Also branches of some kinds of trees sometimes form ridges on either side of the "V" joint with the trunk. Sometimes these can add strength if they are formed so they are rounded and do not protrude much. But if these ridges seem exaggerated and tend to flare out significantly--for example I sometimes see this with Northern red oak, it can be a sign of weakness. If these "flares" are larger than usual, it shows that the tree is struggling with some stress in this particular joint that could well split the branch off. Well, I think you get the idea--I could go on and on about this. The one thing that I would almost always worry about, unless I had some specific reason not to worry, is a narrow angled fork in the main trunk or leader of a tree (those with a "U" shape are not so bad). With the exception of elm trees, and a red pine, among some others I have not observed or have forgotten about, these spell disaster. And the reason is not only the weakness of the fork, but because of how the tree sways in the wind--the whole trunk can sway, and then each half of the fork can also sway. When these swayings work against each other the force tearing the tree apart can be absolutely terrific. I think the Shummard oak that we have discussed may have had some inherent weakness in the branch joint, but to some degree this swaying effect could have affected the splitting of this branch, if it was large enough. Well, I hope this helps. It would be nice if there were a neat rule, but there isn't. I think most of us who have been working with trees all our lives have a kind of sense when there is a weak fork developing, but even those of us with the most experience observing and trying to analyze the risk of a branch spliting off, will be right only some of the time. --Spruce

Hi Arauquoia, What they're saying is a load of adult male cattle rear-end product . . . it's all just media hype to help sell the plant and/or raise money for those proposing it. There's no verified evidence for Jurassic (or any other fossil) Wollemia; there are some fossils that show some limited resemblance, but nothing that can definitely be considered ancestral, or even clearly related. Neither is the claim of low light levels true, except for the parts of the continent that were then at polar latitudes; even if it did apply, there's no reason why plants that were adapted to growing in polar conditions then should not evolve to increased light as the continent drifted away from the South Pole. On Cunninghamia, it hasn't ever been growing in polar regions that I'm aware of; no reason why its foliage shouldn't evolve either. Of other plants, a lot of cycads have leaflets with similar light-gathering form to leaves of Cunninghamia or Wollemia (or several other plants) - compare a Cycas revoluta leaf with a Wollemia shoot. Yet cycads generally grow (and as far as is known, always have) grown in areas with often very intense semi-desert light. Resin

THanks hortster and Carol23for the help! I have been without power for a few days so didn't see your answers until now. I do have a buckthorn tall hedge that shows in some of the pictures. Is the other one a different species of buckthorn? How interesting. In many parts of the country, buckthorn tallhedge is an invasive; but, in my yard, the one I have is very well behaved (it's in the backyard). It looks like I have two little volunteers in the side yard where this picture was taken and I'll transplant them to the backyard and see if they like it there. In any case, the one I was trying to identify is pretty ugly and it's an ex-weed/whatever now. We had a bad storm this past Thursday and today, while cleaning up from it, I took a good look at the weed/whatever and removed it. I found another one in my front yard and it went to great beyond, with my help, as well. Thanks again. Barbara