Searched on "4 O'Clocks" and this discussion came up. Nice old discussion! In my area (Maritime NW) I have never seen 4 O'clocks in the nurseries and big box stores. I'm speculating that's because most of their flowers are sold in bloom, and 4 O'clocks bloom when larger. They probably don't bloom in little 6-packs or even in 1-gallon containers. I'm guessing about that. Also, if the flowers are not reliably open when the stores are open, people might not buy them. I bought seeds via the internet. Feeling nostalgic about gardening from my childhood, and these 4 O'clocks were part of that. I grew some about 10 years ago and as I recall they did OK here. I'm more into gardening now than I was then, so maybe they'll grow better. Plus I have a deer and rabbit problem, and maybe they'll be resistant to those animals. Maybe. I read start them 6 to 8 weeks indoors before the last frost, for cool climates like mine. They can also be planted in the ground, but maybe will start blooming later. A packet has plenty of sees, so I can try both. Nice discussion! I've lost the experiences of older gardeners in my family, and it seems there aren't a lot of gardeners in my neighborhood, so it's up to me to discover what works and what doesn't. Pass-along plants like these are worth preserving for the next generation!

I put mine in my garage last year, (I had 3) one took a while before it went dormant and was the first one to leaf out this year. One that came in late that was near the door died to the ground because some workers left the door open when it was snowing (the one day it snowed here) after I told them not to. And I had one freshly rooted plant that was small that did just fine. I have a shredded white that I bought last summer as a cutting and I kept it in the house last winter, it still has not grown!!! I also bought a small miners claiim that will come in the house with me. I don't think my family liked living in the jungle last year. Mary

I can safely say I will never bring a gift that has anything to do with cooking. I wish everyone would restrict their gift donations to gardening items. Books on gardening are good items, garden tools, garden hats, gloves, aprons, clogs, lotions, trugs, soaps, seed containers, garden accoutrements such as a garden totem would be nice. Food items are acceptable, but they should be substantial, for example a pie or a pan of brownies would be great, one or two slices of pie or brownies would not. Normally we save food items just for sharing though, so consider whether you would want to get a pie as a door prize. ( I think I would, but if I had a choice I might go for the garden tools first.) Anyway, use your imagination when selecting a door prize to bring and before you bring some old, dated, tattered item that you haven't been able to sell at your last three garage sales, remember that it will likely be the last item left on the table after everyone has chosen the "good stuff" and you may actually overhear the comment, "what a cheesy door prize" from the picker-upper. Personally, I like to bring something that everyone says, "Ooh, I want that!" IMHO-Cheryl

The other negative thing about them being inside: When outdoors watering takes about 15 minutes 2x a week with occasional daily wand watering of the mounties. When indoors that times increases to @1 hour on Saturday, @30 minutes mid-week and daily/multi-daily misting and/or dunking for the mounties. A little more effort required in winter, but luckily I usually have more free time to devote to the 'kids during the winter. Also, it is surprising how much larger some things got from when last indoors. Even though I've whittled down the collection a bit this summer, it seems to take even more space than last year, so I'll be practicing my dividing skills next spring. For example: I've got a Twinkle that needs divided this weekend, it must have 50+ growths, is 20"+ wide and is climbing all over itself, it's sitting on the side table until I can address the dividing (down to 3-5 good p-bulbs in a 4-5" pot) and put it back into the light. I've been moving more and more to compacts and minis, but a lot of the stuff I like doesn't come that way (most phals/phrags) and I still have remnants and favorites of other older plants that I don't want to 'ditch'. Bob