I was out at Sunshine a month or so ago, currently they have large fusiformis (only) and the price tag may curl your toenails. I was thinking they were something outrageous....
They said they'll have smaller ones in 2006.

Be very carefull about planting live oaks here. I lost a number of them while living in the Dallas area. Since live oaks retain their green leaves during the winter, they provide an excellent place for ice to accumulate during an ice storm. When one hits, it's not usually a matter of if, but when you will lose at least part of the tree. Since we (OKC area) get more ice than Dallas, I'd predict that they are even more susceptable. Beautiful trees yes, but there are reasons you don't see many in our area.

I'm sure ice could be a problem. ItÂs rough on pines, magnolias, and the other evergreens, but there are some very nice live oak trees here in Norman that have had no damage even with the two bad storms we have had in recent years.

I think the reason you havenÂt seen them as much here is that no one was selling them in our area. I had to purchase quite a few out of Texas years ago because no one stocked them.

randy

Well, there is probably a reason they don't sell them locally. I'm sure the nurseries would stock them if they thought they could make a return on sales.

And btw, Norman didn't get anywhere near the amount of ice that the surrounding areas recieved during the last two ice storms.

IÂve seen them selling them at Marcums, OÂhiggins, Lowes, Walmart, and Home Depot the last few years. There are some beautiful ones on the City of Norman complex that are quite old.

They are found native in the Wichita Mts. We are not that much farther north.

randy

First you say that no store sells them now all of them do. I'm just trying to offer my personal experiences so the original poster can make a fully informed decision.

Please don't take offense. None is intended. Perhaps IÂm not clear in what I wanted to say. I said "The reason you havenÂt seen them as much here is that no one was selling them in our area." IÂm talking about the last 15 Â20 years. You could not find them locally. I remember seeing some of the first being planted here on city property and asked what they were. I did some research and liked what I saw. Over the past 8-10 years IÂve planted a few on commercial property and sold a few to friends.

In the past 2-3 years, because people started noticing them and asking for them, retailers have responded by stocking them.

None of the ones IÂve brought in over the past ten years have suffered any winter damage, but time will tell.

You are right about ice. It should be taken into consideration. My parents live on the Arbuckle Lake. The ice there a few years ago was devastating. The thing IÂve noticed in that area is that deciduous trees were severally ravaged where many types of evergreens held up just fine.

No offense taken. Like I said, I'm just trying to communicate my experiences. I will say they are beautiful trees. I just see too much of a chance for damage in our area.

I've seen some planted in west OKC as far back as 1976. I've seen some hard winters cause them to lose their leaves, but the trees always bounced back. They just don't get as wide as what I have seen in Dallas and Austin.

They are a good medium sized tree with year-round foliage.

go to sunshine nursery, the trees at most outlets are going to be q. virginiana and not as reliably winter hardy. One of these days OKC is going to get as cold as it historically has. The last 6-7 years has been very mild. Just about long enough to lull people into a sense of complacency.

Norman has better growing conditions than most of OKC.

Paul

Regarding the Live Oak trees in Oklahoma City, Marcum Nursery (near South 119th and Western) had a fair selection of the trees last fall and very reasonably priced. I purchased one along with several from a local nursery, and have planted them in Western Oklahoma (Clinton). So far so good. They have indeed maintained their leaves through the winter. I have them on a drip irrigation system and am working like crazy to keep my soil pH down from the natural 8.0 in my area. Incidentally, there exists a rather large area of Live Oaks (I believe commonly referred to as Texas Live Oaks) just southwest of here in the Quartz Mountain Park area. They're abundant and appear to be thriving. These of course are the smaller trees.
Good Luck.

What is it with OKC gardeners and Live Oaks?

I hear so often. "Will Live Oaks grow here?"

I am in my mid 40's and have lived in OKC all my life and seen Live Oaks all my life. Though not common you can find one on most every block. Just look!

It's true this is about as far north that any older specimens can be found but they do indeed survive even the coldest OKC winter such as December of 1983. Far as ice they seem to hold-up well as any tree. Of course when I say Live Oak in OKC it's the Quercus fusiformis and not virginiana. Quercus virginiana will grow here but can be damaged or killed in the worst of bitter cold spells like December 1983. Quercus fusiformis had no problems in 1983 and is native to zone 7 Southwest Oklahoma.

Here is a link to prove they are a native tree growing in the same climate zone as Oklahoma City which is zone 7.
http://www.biosurvey.ou.edu/shrub/qufu.htm

How about some OKC Live Oak pictures to prove what I have said. Just open your eyes and look around town. Winter is a good time to spot where the Live Oaks are around OKC.

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I need to correct the location of that first Live Oak picture in the above post.

The NW 23rd & Rockwell Quercus fusiformis trees are just EAST and not WEST of NW 23rd & Rockwell.

Sorry about the mistake.

Agreed! Live Oaks (fusiformis) are probably more common that most of us realize. If you're in the area, a trip to Quartz Mountain will amaze you, but as mentioned, they can be found all around the city and appear to do quite well.

Hi Mark,

It has troubled me for so many years watching the bizarre behaviour I have seen with OKC horticultural professionals and the so called Live Oak. It could be just ignorance as often I have seen many horticulturalist not knowing fusiformis from a hole in the ground or perhaps they have something against the species. I have heard it said. "Live Oaks just don't belong here even if Live Oaks could be grown here." Then the nuts will say they know of no specimen north of Dallas. I just can't understand the defamed reputation Quercus fusiformis has undeservedly received when they performed outstanding during the wicked winters of 1983 and 1989.

I have been to Quartz Mountain many times and can exhaust myself checking out all those specimens up in the rocky hills.

Of notable OKC Quercus fusiformis specimens. Had you ever passed the large fusiformis in front of Hilldale Elementary School at 4801 NW 16th. I am sorry to say it was removed around 2002 for unknown reasons. I remember that fusiformis after December 1983 only having been defoliated. It was quite a Live Oak specimen for Live Oaks not being hardy here.

Thank's for the response!

Don,
Indeed! It's always amazed me how folks will take the word for any so-called expert and literally let that guide their planting, growing and landscaping. While there is certain legitimate dogma that exists, a man can do a great deal by soil adjustment (pH, mulch, drainage, shade, etc.). I can't tell you the times I've heard "You can't grow a pecan tree in Clinton!" Yet drive down West Frisco and Oak Ave and you'll see some of the healthiest and most productive in the county! There's a great responsibility in being an "expert"--glad I'm not one.
See ya,
Mark

Hi again Mark,

What's going on with your garden and landscaping?

Here are a few highlights of my doings.

On a Quartz Mountain trip of 5 years ago I pocketed a few acorns and grew a QM fusiformis.
It's been slow to gain size but seemed to speed up last summer gaining some size.
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I bet you have not seen a mature Italian Cypress (Cupressus sempervirens 'Stricta') for years
since that bitter winter spell of December 1983 killed every last specimen.
I planted my specimen from a 1 gallon container in 1990.
It's been very cold hardy surviving cold low as -3*f during a spell of Feb 1996.
I have started to spot Italian Cypress around town but none large as mine.
They are a nice landscape tree provided we don't have another 1983 like winter event.
Skyrocket Juniper is a rather poor imitation of the real thing Italian Cyperss.
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For years I have been dabbling with cold hardy palms.
The cold hardiest palm I have found through years of experience is the Rhapidophyllum hystrix common name Needle palm.
Back in the bitter cold winters of those terrible 1980's Needle Palm would withstand below zero without any damage.
The specimen pictured below has really gained size over the years.
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The link below is a short video showing a long row of hardy sabal palms I planted 15 years ago.
Just click the link and a video will play.
Row Of Sabals Video Click Here

Don,
My landscaping project is in its early stages (past four years). I'm attempting to attach photos of three Live Oaks (Quercus fusiformis)that were transplanted about a year ago. I have also been stratifying about a hundred various oak seeds (acorns) many of which are now two to six inches tall. These are mostly Red Oaks, Bur Oaks, etc. While it's probably more effecient just to buy these, I've enjoyed the process and have learned a few things along the way.
I installed a drip irrigation system last year which irrigates nearly 100 trees and shrubs--it's the best thing I've ever done for the property.
I'll keep ya informed on the Oak seedlings.
See ya,
Mark