Same for me - permanent failure, no such user.

Re: George Ball's OpEd piece. To quote him, "No one, and certainly no gardener, grows truly destructive invasive plants in his garden." He also says that kudzu, star thistle and purple loosestrife were accidental introductions. Sorry, Mr. Ball, but you are wrong. While some noxious weeds made their way here accidentally, a good many of them were purposely introduced as choice gardening plants, *including* kudzu (introduced to the gardening public in 1876 at the Centennial Exposition in Philadelphia, PA) and purple loosestrife (introduced early in our country's life as a medicinal herb for treatment of diarrhea, dysentery, bleeding, wounds, ulcers and sores, and as an ornamental, as well as an accidental contaminant in ship ballast). I'll give him star thistle - that was accidentally introduced in contaminated seed in the 1800's.

As for that first quote, it hasn't been that long ago that gardeners in Oregon could purchase English ivy, now a quarantined noxious weed. It can still be spotted growing in many gardens. That puts the lie to his statement and that's only one example.

Good grief. He should check his facts before inserting foot in mouth. It certainly doesn't raise my confidence in his ability to run Heronsburp. And it definitely shows that he won't take the care Dan did to not intentionally introduce a plant that could be our next noxious weed.

annukka, do you know if there was a response to his OpEd?

Yeah, it's pretty scary that someone in his powerful position holds such views. There were a couple of responses printed- I pasted them here since you have to be registered to view them

Published: March 26, 2006
To the Editor:

Re "Border War," by George Ball (Op-Ed, March 19):

No ecologist argues that all garden plants should be jettisoned. Rather, ecologists have documented the tremendous damage done to natural ecosystems, including rangelands and production forests, by a small number of garden species that escape their domestic setting, reproduce abundantly without human intervention and displace native species.

A recent careful estimate of the economic damage done by nonnative plants puts the cost at $35 billion a year. With this kind of impact, it does not seem to be too great a request to ask that gardeners give up the relatively few species known to cause problems and focus on the numerous species that can be enjoyed without worry and without guilt.

A good gardener doesn't sling mud.

Joan Gardner Ehrenfeld
New Brunswick, N.J., March 20, 2006
The writer is a professor of ecology at Rutgers University.

To the Editor:

Encouraging the use of native plants is not "radical," but wise. Natives generally thrive better with less care than introduced plants. And exotics that have escaped from the garden have become serious invaders, despite what George Ball says.

English ivy and Russian olive are just two examples of plants that are still promoted by some gardeners but have become serious management problems, competing for water, space and soil nutrition in very destructive ways.

As a member of the Washington Native Plant Society, I don't know anyone who says you should never plant a petunia. But encouraging people to replicate an English garden in the American West is rather foolish.

Exotics are a serious threat to the natural beauty of our country and our gardens. Mr. Ball would do better to promote responsible gardening.

Kathleen Learned
Seattle, March 19, 2006

Email address for Linda didn't work for me either.....
Mary

Invasive, exotic and native are terms that require separate deffinitions. Not all invasives are exotic. Not all natives are non-invasive. Just look what Salmon berries will do under the right conditions.

We should take care with what we grow and strive to discern the bad from the good. Dan had a statement in his catalog to the effect that, on the whole, tearing up the earth for a strip mall was more damaging than gardening and should be kept in perspective. Add that to his own vigilance investigating and trialing his discoveries and you get a good and thoughtful response.

jb

Good point, Juniorballoon! Even the local climate can make all the difference between merely exotic and exotic invasive. I can grow all the water hyacinths I please (Eichornia crassipes) in my little bathtub-sized pond without fear of them clogging local waterways. I consider it a warm year when the water in my pond gets above 60° F, and in Zone 7 I can reasonably expect low temperatures to drop below 20° F even in the warmest of winters. Water hyacinths don't survive the winter here, so I don't worry about the risks of growing them.

I DO avoid most perennial Centaurea species because so many of them have been designated noxious weeds in our area. I avoid all thistles (except cardoon and artichokes) for the same reason. In general, I am reluctant to try any plant native to the Russian steppes, because so many of them HAVE proved to be invasive exotics in our climate.

It's not just a matter of a plant being an invasive exotic SOMEWHERE in the United States: it's important to recognize that a perfectly well-mannered, lovely ornamental in Nevada might be a thug only an hours' drive away in California. And something that is definitely an exotic invasive in California's central valley might well perish in the dry, cold climate of Northern Nevada.

I know the reason that plants get banned universally is because too many people don't, or won't do their homework. They don't care about the origins of a plant, or the climate where it is endemic. They don't ask themselves how the plant reproduces, and what that means for the potential of that plant to overwhelm native flora. They don't find out what the natural predators of a given plant are, or if they are present in their area. So we all pay for the lazy ones. Sigh...

OK--time is of the essence--It was just confirmed to me that Burpee plans to remove the specimen plants from the gardens to ship them to PA. This makes sense because many of these plants are the mother plants for propagation. For the same reason, it seems to me that it might be an uphill battle to try and retain these mature specimens.

Regardless of what people think about the financial aspects of the sale to Burpee and the foreseeability of this end, the destruction of a lovely and unique, world-class woodland garden should make everyone sad and angry. I wish we could count on the "greeen industry" heavyweights to value and protect America's gardens, but just the opposite seems to be happening here.

I've sent an e-mail to Linda Cochran to offer my support--no idea if the address worked, yet.

Sammie, are you at liberty to say how this information was confirmed? The man (Ball) is obviously an idiot, both as a businessman and a plantsman, but could he be making the decision to dismantle this gem?

I'm in so much pain over the closure alone, the destruction of the garden is almost too much to comprehend right now. I know that sounds ridiculously dramatic and I'm not a drama queen, but Heronswood has been my inspiration for so long, I feel like a friend has died this week.

That the specimens are going to be removed from the garden was confirmed by a man I know who writes the gardening column for the local area newspaper. I think his word is above reproach, so I believe this news.

Sorry about the email address for Linda Cochran -- it's plural (I should have known!) restios@gmail.com

annukka, thanks for posting the responses.

juniorballoon, thanks for pointing out the problems with generalizations. Personally, I'm not keen on either extreme of the native vs non-native continuum. As you wrote, "We should take care with what we grow and strive to discern the bad from the good." That was one thing I respected very much about Dan Hinkley. He was a plant lover but he also had a deep love and high regard for the natural environment. He shared his knowledge and strove to help us make informed choices for our own gardens.

Dan is on the radio right now: Mike Darcy 's KXL (750 AM) radio show today, Saturday, June 3. The interview will be at 11am. Call- in: 1 800 827-0750 or 503/417-7575.

Sad to see but just one more example of American corporate mismanagement.....the list is long and too many of the really good ones originated here in the NW. Pay-N-Pak, Eddy Bauer, Bon-Marche, Eagle Hardware.....the list is long.

Too few corporate egos understand that owning something unique has no relation to managing it and that if it works, molding it to look like the rest of the company will surely destroy it.

Burpee Pres. Ball said they gave it their best try.... corpospeak for "we didnt understand it, have no idea of what it really is so we're throwing in the trowel...and won't let anyone else have it either" .... murder / suicide mentality. Just wunnnnnnnnnderful.

Paul in Shoreline

Does anyone know about how much $ Hinkley and Jones were paid by Burpee for Heronswood?

No, but then I don't know what my new neighbor paid for her house either, and I wouldn't ask.

What your neighbor paid is part of a public record and you could look it up. If Burpee is a publicly held company that info should be part of the a public record as well.

jb

JB, I said wouldn't, not couldn't :)

A heartbreaking loss......

Cathy

I love plants and gardens as much as anybody and shuddered at the announcement. Yet, Hinkley & Jones sold their business to the highest bidder (maybe the only one too) at the right time, walked away rich, and now are able to pursue other dreams. Sounds like an American success story to me. I think it's a tough business to make a living at, and these guys achieved fame and fortune too. It means others can perhaps at least make a living doing what they love.

Is the price paid such a private matter? It's a big business transaction. That kind of stuff is published every day in the business section. It's the reason why Heronswood is closed. They paid Hinkley and Jones enough to walk away from something they gave birth to and loved. Must have been a big number. It's tough.

I hadn't realized he had walked, Eric. When I was there last month he was present and personally leading a tour of the gardens. I didn't join the tour, but browsed alone nearby ...all the same, I'm sure I sensed his delight and pride in sharing his 'treasures' still being very much connected to Heronswood. I'm not certain he was intentionally selling his dream as much as meaning to add to it.

Maybe those of us posting here would like to get together and charter a flight. With the added enticement of Dirr as the speaker, how could we not?

morz8:

It seems like what I'm saying offends you. Sorry. They sold it. They knew what they were doing. If I or any of us sells our house to someone who buys it because they say they love our gardens, and later they change their priorities, bulldoze it and put in extra parking, it's the same thing. You can hate them for it but it's their prerogative. If we don't want that possibility then we don't sell. Take it to the grave. I suppose they could have written a clause into the contract that the nursery could not be moved...but apparently they didn't. I took a class with Hinkley and think he's brilliant, well-rounded, generous with his knowledge, and humble. Now he's also rich and free to travel the world.

Anyone who sells their company to a corporation knows their is a likelyhood of this sort of thing happening. Look at authors who sell the rights to their stories to movie companies. Look at Burpee's website. They mainly sell seeds and always have. What was Burpee thinking? Might as well have sold it to Petco.

The only gracious thing Burpee could do but won't do is sell it to a group who wants to run it like the old Heronswood. Burpee could keep the name but give up the property and the rights for it to be used as a nursery.

Being one of the final 7... I can add a few things.

#1 - Mr. Ball has no intention of dismantling the garden sammie. The reporters are getting mis-information I think.

#2 - Dan and Robert wanted some freedom as Heronswood became much more for them. They wanted a life to themselves I am sure.

#3 - Heronswood is still getting mail for Dan and Robert should anyone want to send them message. I will get that to them, as well as emails which can be sent to orders@heronswood.com for a while still.

I just hope too that someone can help to save the garden and that your thoughts are with everyone involved. We are all saddened by this news and very hurt by the way it happened. Should anyone know of jobs, please help those that are now unemployed - and should anyone be able to save the garden, please do!!

darrensprincess

darrensprincess:

Thank you for giving us this information. Our hearts go out to the dedicated Heronistas who all made it such an amazing place. When I visted I couldn't believe how immaculately maintained it was.

I hope there will be yet another twist to the story and perhaps a happier ending.

Thank you for the update, darrensprincess! If I hear of any (decent-paying) hort jobs in my area (Reno, Nevada), I'll post a link to them here. Sometimes the university where I work has some truly cool openings--not exactly the nursery biz, but at least dealing with plants and the natural world.

Thanks Darrensprincess - to hear from someone on the inside is a lot more meaningful than all of our speculation. I'm right here in Poulsbo - if there is anything I can do to help with the garden let me know!! I'll keep my ears open for local openings in hort. If you're skilled with roses, the Woodland Park Zoo has an opening you might look at.... but that sounds a lot less interesting to me than Heronswood.

I have put that pic of George Ball from the newspaper up on my brother's dartboard.

Perhaps Dan will organize a consortium of his moneyed friends to buy the property back. I heard a rumor that Martha was looking at property in Indianola. We can hope.

Let's start the action to save the gardens. Time is of the essence. Ideas?? We need an organized and concerted effort.

I wonder if Dan will issue a public statement. Perhaps his contract restricts him, but I am hoping to hear more of the story from those in the middle.

If you haven't been reading the other Heronswood thread there is an interesting letter from Tony Avent, Plants Dleights owner, that is worth a read.

jb

I thank you all very much! The dartboard is a great idea, I like that ian!! We are all hoping that it will be okay and I am sure Dan will talk when he is ready. Right now he needs some time to deal with his own thoughts and to help the others that are in need of employment and homes. We have been getting people interested in the property already, and they have all been plant people... so it may be a good thing in the end. I agree that Tony Avent's letter was great and should be read by all. There was a lot of information that even I did not know, but now makes a little sense out of all the events. We are learning a lot!!

darrensprincess

Darrensprincess, do you have access to the Heronswood mailing list? Maybe I can get rich selling George Ball 'voodoo dolls' and buy the property... LOL

I probably shouldn't have said that....

Hi
We too are so sad at the loss of Heronswood. Dan, Robert and the rest have enriched the Horticultural world beyond measure. It just won't be the same without them. Someone mentioned those who lost their jobs. To the Heronistas out there, if we can help, contact me.
Jens Molbak, jens@molbaks.com

Found this article while searching for any new news. An interesting read in light of the current standing.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/pacificnw/2002/0929/cover.html

It clearly tells how the nursery and the gardens had become a burden. You'll note that Hinkley says the gardens at tehir new place will never be public.

I hope the power of the Internet will help us in our efforts to boycott Burpee. I'm a regular participant in two nationwide gardening forums and have made the issue of Burpee's black deed well known. Just about everyone understands the Wal-Mart concept of big business replacing smaller, interesting, specialty retailers with the humdrum of mass produced, cookie cutter goods. People on these forums are responding overwhelmingly that they'll boycott Burpee. For a company the size of Burpee, I'm sure we're no big threat to their bottom line. But who knows...if enough buzz bounces back and forth across the nation, it may eventually have an impact.

I sent an email to Burpee's Customer Service Dept., addressed to George Ball. I had several points to make, but in the end told him this:

"Gardeners' interest in nurseries like Heronswood comes from the heart. Your actions come from the wallet and will harden the hearts of those you count on to fill that wallet."

I can certainly live without Mr. Ball's marigolds, petunias & green beans.

Patrick

For a recent letter from G. Ball...

Thats very interesting perspective. Sounds like the ball is in the public, or private industry, or corporate endowments court. Thank You for updating us BBoy.

Just as a further update, there is a very active local consortium of avid plantspeople and former Heronswood associates that are dilligently working on putting together a non-profit organization to preserve the property as a teaching facility and botanical garden. They are just completing all the paperwork and filings that goes with forming a non-profit, establishing a website and setting up a bank account for donations. They are meeting regularly, both with Dan and Robert and with a number of very interested, deep pocket local horticultural movers and shakers to get the ball rolling (sorry for bad pun) and get the gardens saved for posterity and the public.

And despite George Ball's feelings to the contrary, $11 million is a LOT of money for that property, considering real estate values comparable in that neighborhood.

Stay tuned, folks. More information of efforts to save Heronswood will be forthcoming here on GW and your support will be greatly appreciated. The website is not active yet, but keep checking weloveplants.org for further information.

In case anyone missed the July 24 Commentary he was responding to, as I did, here it is....

The last I had heard from Mr. Ball (and no, I don't know why I would still be on his mailing list) was an email where he proudly said he was greatly improving the packaging for shipping (?) and was going to treat us to a lovely color full photo catalog of 300 plants soon. Thank you very much, but I'm still displaying 12 years worth of plain text only catalogs, packed full of useful information, on my library shelves.

Quote from George Ball: "No one, and certainly no gardener, grows truly destructive invasive plants in his garden."

Guess Mr. Ball never heard of himalayan blackberry, english ivy, purple loosestrife, all of which escaped from PNW gardens.

Amongst the many reasons I ordered from Heronswood was that they did not need to bare root their stock to ship to CA. I contacted Burpee asking if moving the plants to the east coast meant that plants would now need barerooting to send to states with strict quarantine rules, and the reply was "we're looking into that now". Idiots. Do they really think those delicate woodland plants Heronswood is noted for are going to survive having soil washed off their roots and being packed into a container for a week to be shipped cross country? If Burpee cant even ship tough nursery stock without it arriving dead, what chance anything from Heronswood would survive? They just lost a significant part of their customer base, without even thinking about this little detail first. Unbelievable. If I'm going to have to nursemaid traumatized plants, I'd rather order from Plant Delights Nursery, which at least knows what they're doing and their plants have a decent chance of survival.

Davissue, I did order the plants I'd expected to pick up during a Heronswood trip this summer from Plant Delights - they arrived in beautiful condition on the third day from shipping. Lovely plants.

So... what's the latest news on saving Heronswood???

It is listed on the Coldwell Banker real estate site. Interesting. Never knew that it was "oriental".

The Pacific NW Horticultural Conservancy is doing its very best to keep it from being sold and developed.
I ran into Lucy Hardiman at the HPSO sale in Hillsboro this past weekend and she was getting lots of signatures.

Hi:

What are the signatures for? Should be collecting money.

Is there a way to contact people? I'd be happy to sign a petition or donate a bit of money. I've also wondered if anyone's been caring for the garden, watering and weeding isn't a trivial job.

Here ya go......I understand they are still filling the requirements of the 501c filing and maybe not yet be quite ready to accept contributions but the contact info is there and I'm sure the group would be happy to respond.

If a well off couple seriously interested in gardening just bought the place and moved in, continued on with occasional openings that would be adequate. Someone able to pick up the tab would probably be able to improve the property, as well. English gardening magazines are peppered with stories about couples over there buying places and making really nice gardens on them - although I've not sure I've read one where the previous owners were a corporation that had the place priced to sell to developers! It's too bad we don't seem to share this kind of tradition and level of interest.

...we have our 'Arboretum Bulletin'(!) carrying a piece warning homeowners not to make fancy gardens because it will scare away prospective buyers.

You're kidding! I guess it would tend to "sort" the prospective buyers a bit. Wow, to be so fortunate as to move into a place that had a lovely, established garden.

I wish I was. Same writer has gone on to become garden columnist. Local newspaper(s) now has multiple locally written garden columns in some issues. Provides plenty of opportunity to read other dum...er...uh...interesting comments. Must mean this area has become a hort. hotbed, anyway. Certainly like that idea. Do see some fun gardens, here and there. Not so much up my way, as in parts of Seattle. Big part of problem likely 60 percent rental occupancy, means 6 out of 10 yards not owned by occupants. Landlords may not want renters to improve property, even when renters take an interest.

Especially if they've read that piece in 'Arboretum Bulletin'.