I think as long as you think it is an attractive bush that's all that matters. I think it is a beautiful native shrub. Not only that, it is the host plant for the Spicebush Swallowtail butterfly - the spicebush caterpillars are one of the coolest things you will ever see.

I think they are quite attractive - especially the female bushes with their bright red berries. They aren't as showy as some other shrubs, like your alien ornamentals, but each plant has its own beauty and charm.

I like spicebushes enough to have planted 4 around my place in the last two years. I'm hoping at least one is a female.

FataMorgana

Grown and maintained (pruned & shaped) in a landscape setting, they can be an attractive shrub.
The "ugly shrub" comment was probably referring to some specimens found in the wild during winter, absent foliage, flowers or fruit, that can appear to be a bundle of switches and rather unruly in appearance. See the series of photos on the attached website.
Previously, I have passed them up on construction site rescues, because they appeared to be unworthy garden plants. I have since learned that a judicious pruning regime can rehabilitate even the most unattractive ones.
Of course, nursery grown plants will be previously groomed for sale and should not require anything more than occasional minor pruning. Hopefully they are labeled (M/F)correctly! :Q)

Here is a link that might be useful: Lindera benzoin

I've never seen nursery plants labeled male/female. Generally nurseries that sell them suggest you buy several to be sure of getting some of each.

Is there a way to tell the difference between M/F? Any places in IL that can tell the difference??

I don't want several as I have plans on planting other natives on my lot. Don't know what I would do with all of those extra's plus spending the $$ doesn't make sense if I do not have the room for them.

I sure wish I had more land than I do :)

Is it true that the fall foilage is yellowish?

Thanks for everyone's help!!!

Check out Possibility Place Nursery in Monee, IL.

Here is a link that might be useful: Possibility Place

Yup, on the yellow foliage. It's very yellow.

And the only way that a place would know the sex of a young plant or seedling is if it was a cloned plant (ex: a cutting or a graft) of some sort. Shrubs grown from seed would be an unknown. I've never found sexed seedlings.

FataMorgana

I have heard that when the plant is in flower, you can tell if it is male or female if you look very closely (and you may need a hand lens).

lovefornature,

esh_ga is correct about using the flowers to determine the sex. These are the 2 best resources for this I've found so far. In the link I've pasted here, the description section describes the differences between male and female flowers.

http://plants.usda.gov/plantguide/pdf/pg_libe3.pdf

The picture I've linked to using the Optional Link URL is pretty detailed.

Also, even though I've never heard of anybody else saying this, for years I only had a single large female spicebush. There must have been a male plant somewhere in the area even though I hadn't noticed any very close, because my plant had berries.

Lori

Here is a link that might be useful: picture of male and female flowers from NJ Native Plant Society

According to the document I linked to (see below) the spicebush can have perfect flowers (having both male and female parts). So it would be possible to have pollination without a male in some instances. (Gee, you learn something new every day!)

As far as sexing, many trees and shrubs don't flower/fruit until they have some age on them. I'm not sure what that is for the spicebush but I suspect that the seedlings you can buy in nurseries are too young to flower.

FataMorgana

Here is a link that might be useful: berry faq

If you are buying a nursery plant, I wouldn't buy a seedling. I would buy a small shrub that is in 5 gallon pot. By then the nursery should be able to tell you if its male or female. (Though I am not sure how much it matters for this particular shrub.) If you call the nursery that I linked above, they would be able to answer this much better.

FataMorgana,

Thanks. That's very interesting about spicebush having perfect flowers sometimes. I wonder where the people creating the FAQ page found the information though. I did a Google search, and didn't find another reference to that. People on GW tend to be pretty accurate, but I do like seeing confirmation.

Lori

It was the only place I found that mentioned as well. References are wonderful things when people include them! :)

FataMorgana

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, anyway...I don't care for a carefully trimmed and shaped bush. I want a bit more character than that!

Anyway, I always look forward to their bloom in spring, and they ALWAYS smell good...the leaves, the bark. I grab a piece to smell everytime I walk by. They were the major "shrub component" of the "Big Grove" woods at Urbana back in the "old days".

I definately do not plan on buying seedings, I want the plants themselves. I like to view things in person (if possible).

Hmmm, maybe I will just have to start with 3 of these and hope I get at least one female/one male. It seems awful hard (at least to my newbiee's eye) to tell the difference in the flowering on the pictures......

Does anyone plant anything special with their Spicebushes (around and underneath)? I know that a lot of people like to group things.

Thanks again all :)

Well if you get one in the fall when it still has berries on it then you at least know you've got a female. I lost my only male in the drought this year (he was young) and am now on the lookout for a male. I know he was male because I have four other plants and they all set fruit (and he didn't). I still hope that he might sprout back from the roots in the spring!

I just have native ferns scattered around the base of mine.

Esh Ga, so sorry you lost your male. I have been hearing about the major drought in GA and that some areas were under water restrictions.

Hope you find your male :)

I think it is already too cold here in IL to plant. :(

Fall is a great time to plant trees and shrubs. It's also a great time to get great deals at your local nurseries!

FataMorgana

Still time to plant in Illinois...although we are a lonnnggg state, and it will depend on where you are.

The Northern tip of Illinois had frost this morning...we were down to about 47...and I'll bet Metropolis was still in the upper 50's.

If you are thinking about planting more than a couple of Spicebush, and if you want to minimize costs, you could plant a whole bunch of seedlings, and plan to remove or prune back the males, leaving a majority of female bushes with enough males for pollination. In places where Spicebush is common it is not unusual to see tons of seedlings all over the ground.

I love my spicebush. It's full of bright red berries that can be seen from inside even though it's out by the road. My berries persist all winter. AND the shape of it is quite attractive.

lovefor, please do what joepyeweed said, and call Possibility Place. When I bought my Ilex verticillata there, they sexed them the year before. So I wouldn't doubt that they do it for the Lindera also. I wanted 2 Myrica pensylvanica this spring. I asked for a male and a female. When I picked them up and questioned Tristen on them, he assured me they were 1 male and 1 female. Guaranteed.

I bought my spicebush from Musser...10 bare-root plants for a few dollars. At least 6 survived and are doing well (and blooming a lot:).

I've had really good luck with the trees I've ordered from Musser and recommend them to others. I included a link to their website below.

FataMorgana

Here is a link that might be useful: Musser Forests

Hi Terry!

I got 7 shrubs and a couple flats of plants from possibility place this year and I've been really pleased. They are really helpful over the phone.

the woods in my backyard are chock full of the things. I wouldn't call them ugly in any way, though I never would have guessed they were actually in market demand. the twigs and foliage smell amazing when crushed.