Yup thats it, thank you! That page describes it so well. "can form impenetrable thickets", lol..that was the back 1/3 of my yard! Thank you! Daniella

I love species roses! I have numerous CA native species and have seen others elsewhere. R. gymnocarpa at Rancho Santa Ana Botanic Garden near me I've never seen get over 2 1/2 to 3 feet tall. Short and bushy. Not a climbing habit. I didn't notice it suckering. I grow R. pinetorum 'Beatrice Howett' from RSABG. It is also a small rose. I haven't had it all that many years in my garden, but it hasn't suckered. However at RSABG it is well-established and suckering happily. It's more a lax grower there and doesn't look big enough to climb a fence unless it was a very short one. RSABG grows selections of R. californica from different parts of the state, and they do indeed have a variety of habits, from short and sparse to bushy to climbing, some even completely thornless. All of them I've seen sucker from moderately to A LOT. The one I grow that is capable of climbing (with support) is R. californica 'First Dawn'. Canes are long and pliable, it has only moderate thorns, and is in the moderately suckering category. It has the best rebloom of any R. californica I have yet seen. RSABG also has R. nutkana. It suckers pretty wildly, and the ones I've seen have gotten maybe 5 feet tall. Then there is R. minutifolia. At RSABG it has been growing for decades and it spreads rather than pops up in entirely new spots like the suckering champions do. I have numerous R. minutifolias in my yard. Two of which I am training to climb up Monterey Cypress 'Citriodora'. I decided to have fun and experiment since I like this rose so much, give it a challenge. It seems to be working with one of the plants already reaching around 6 feet up. Minutifolia tends to be an arching grower (but some plants are very shrubby), building big mounds that kind of spread like a fungus.;) R. minutifolia can become unhappy and die in areas with too much rainfall. RSABG also has R. spithamea. It is kind of short and bushy there (2 to 2 1/2 feet), but that plant hasn't been growing on the grounds very long so I don't know if it will end up getting much taller. I wonder though because they planted it right in front of a big educational sign and I would think they wouldn't if it was going to get huge. I haven't noticed it suckering, but it is probably too soon to say.

OK, thanks all. I'm in the process of finding a new home for it. Question: once this plant is in the ground, is it a pretty self-sufficient plant? In other words, should it do ok even for a non-gardener...and so long as the person waters the plant, along with the rest of their yard, on a daily basis in the summer? Or could mildew etc and lack of attention to it, kill the plant? I'm trying to find a 'gardener' type person to take it but not sure I'll be able to find such a person. I may have to give it to a person with little to no gardening experience....

Even if you only have containers the seeds of Epilobiums are spread by the wind. Yours is not the spectacular Chamaenerion (formerly Epilobium) angustifolium you might have found images of. It's one of the small flowered weedy species, possibly Epilobium parviflorum. The one in your picture has already begun to disperse its seeds. It will end up in other people's gardens too. Believe me, I am a plant lover and do not run a sterile garden with no room for self sowers, including wild plants. But this one is a nuisance in a cultivated setting and has little decorative or wildlife value and isn't edible. So I would class it as a weed when it occurs in a garden. Outside a garden setting it is a wild flower for me, but not for you. It is not native to North America and is classed as an invasive species in some states. It will also be hard to transplant as you'll find it has a considerable root mass and has a habit of breaking off leaving roots behind.