Would like to add and correct a few things here: 1. Pure water without any dissolved solids does conduct electricity pretty well, (try to put 110 or 220 volt in recipient with 100% pure and distilled water and put your hand in there!) the difference is that, the more dissolved solids that are dissolved in the water, the higher the conductance of the water. 2. Lots of talk has been done about PPM conversion rates that are based on electrical conductivity EC reading of mS/cm but converted to various PPM rates, mainly 500 or 700. Do they correspond to actual PPM of any nutrient solution, or not, are they related directly or not, how comes etc. I guess many people haven't understood why and how it is. It's simple: The actual ppm value of a specific sodium chloride solution is very close to half of its conductivity value (in microSiemens/cm), That is why these "TDS" meters display the conductivity as an equivalent NaCl amount (1000/2= 500). The 700 conversion rate is derived from a specific potassium chloride (KCl) solution instead. Important: both ppm readings of either conversions used here are not related directly to YOUR or ANY nutrient solution or their actual and total PPM content in all elements. Hence, never think that a ppm reading of any TDS meter expresses any actual ppm of your formula or solution nor can be compared to any ppm recommendations for single elements as in N= 180 ppm, or P= 250 ppm etc. BUT it happens that the reading of a 500 conversion rate TDS-meter is quite close to most nutrient solutions, generally the reading is 10-25% higher as the actual content in ppm. It varies with components used as in the actual composition of the nutrients. Fortunately or unfortunately, however - do not confuse the ppm reading of any TDS meter with the exact content in ppm of elements in your nutrients or the total dissolved solids it contains. 3. As for the use of ppm readings and data (of a so called TDS meters), you may pretty well state ppm readings and data in forums as long as you know and TELL the conversion rate that goes with it as well.

I think you're all correct. It must be a crapapple tree. I am sure it's not thundercloud but thunderchild. Hubby must be mistaken! I spent the entire evening looking at crabapple trees and the one we have could be a Flowering Thunderchild Purple Prince. Now that all makes sense. Hubby kept telling me that we needed the "thundercloud" so our real apple tree would be fruitful. Our real apple tree didn't do too well this year. Ironically the crabapple tree exceeded our expectation. Maybe I should use the crabapples to make jam and apple juice instead. LOL Thanks all! Al

My thanks to all of you who posted comments, both good and bad. I can't begin to tell you how feedback about my florals opened my eyes, so I was able to change things for my next set of photos. I'd never think that removable "props" would turn someone off. I also have to say that you're taking it well and seem to appreciate the feedback. Those of us selling can now see our house through strangers eyes and what a potential buyer might think when seeing our house online. How the photos look will dictate whether they take the time to actually walk our houses. The last time our house was for sale we did not get any feedback, so I'm very thankful for this forum and hope that the feedback you got helps you. I noticed that the wallpaper in my home got some of the most frequent and critical remarks and it's left me wondering about something. Is wallpaper no longer in vogue in new or remodeled homes or is it that my particular wallpaper is not to the liking of most of you? I've walked a lot of new communities with model homes and can say that here they are still using wallpaper but not in all of the rooms. You might pick the nicest rooms to keep the wallpaper. I love the foyer wallpaper but not with the door color and not with the flooring. You might think to leave some of it up and paint other walls, using it as an accent. Back entrance wallpaper - I would take it down. Half bath - I like the wallpaper but not with the light fixture. Study - I've seen similar paper used in homes I've walked. Utility - dislike the walls - would sheet rock & paint 1st floor master - would paint 1st floor master bath - I like the paper but not for a room like this. I would paint and think about putting up beadboard 2nd floor master - while I like the top paper, I think it would look better painted. The wood on the door is much too dark. I'd also think about putting up a scarf on the windows, then opening the blinds for the photo. While I like pink, others do not :( Second floor vanity/dressing area - this paper you could get away with leaving. Bath 2, second floor - I would try to lighten this room up or leave the picture out. Living Room - I would paint this I also realize that the paneled family room is dated but my thoughts on that is to either paint the paneling a neutral color or rip off the paneling, put up sheetrock and then paint. I also want to install engineered wood flooring in that room and perhaps extend it in to the foyer where, I admit, the tile color is also dated. Another area of critical comments was due to my home having so much carpeting. Has carpeting also gone out of style or do I just have too many rooms with carpet? We just did this in the master bedroom. I would sheet rock. The carpet wouldn't bother me here. I'm one of the weird ones that actually likes carpet, especially for my bad back. Walking on wood floors kills me. BTW, the Saint Bernard that appeared in at least one photo and brought about a comment or two that some people wouldn't even consider buying a home where a dog had been passed away on June 10 much to my hurt. I'm in the process of cleaning up all traces of his presence here. That is, everywhere but in my heart! Very sorry for your loss. After 22 years, I still miss our German Shepherd.

EC, PPM, pH meters Posted topics included in this FAQ are: Basics of EC PPM testing--is it necessary? Looking for a nutrient meter Basics of EC Posted by thedude27 (My Page) on Thu, Jan 12, 06 at 16:46 Hello, I'm new to hydroponics growing and have a basic question about mixing the nutrient solution. Currently I'm growing some sage in a homemade DWC system and was wondering if I'm mixing the nutrient solution correctly. When you are mixing to obtain say 1500ppm nutrient solution do you add the 1500ppm on top of the reading of your water without solution? So if I had water that was reading say 500ppm before adding anything would I then add solution to bring the reading to 2000ppm? Or could that provide your plant too much of a certain nutrient (obviously something is in there raising the count). Also at what point (well water) hardness would you consider using distilled/spring water? For me its not such a big deal since my grow (crop) is small for now, but it would be easier to just use tap water (or filtered tap water). Response: Posted by: hank_mili Z11 (My Page) on Fri, Jan 13, 06 at 17:40 The PPM in your tap water is the same whether you have a tablespoon or a gallon. The PPM of the solution from the nutrient concentrate will depend on the volume of water you mix with it. Need to keep in mind that PPM is always a calculated value not like EC (electrical conductivity) which is directly measured. This is why many prefer using an EC meter for measuring nutrient concentration versus a TDS (total dissolved solids) meter, which is an EC meter with a calculation algorithm built in. Unless otherwise stated on the label, the calculated PPM of the solution will assume mixing pure water with the concentrate. But to answer your question the final PPM will be additive and 2000 PPM would be correct. Posted by: thedude27 (My Page) on Sat, Jan 14, 06 at 23:29 Thanks a bunch Hank, that helped a lot :) I guess I should have gotten the EC meter instead of the PPM but I got a really good deal on a Newport DSPH-3 (dissolved solids/PH) that I couldn't pass up. Although I'd imagine I could just get the conversion formula from the company and reverse the calculation (although I suppose I'd need accurate temperature readings too). Thanks again PPM testing--is it necessary? Posted by Luckyleaf 7 TN (My Page) on Sun, Oct 10, 04 at 23:22 Is it necessary to use PPM testing if I will be growing some tomatoes in a bubbler? Also, if you say it is, what should the ranges be for the nutes in the veg stage and the fruit stage? Thanks! Response: Posted by: AdrianaG AL z7 (My Page) on Thu, Oct 14, 04 at 19:09 Only if you want healthy plants...and the meter you want is an EC meter, not a ppm meter. Posted by: hank_mili Z11 (My Page) on Sat, Oct 16, 04 at 2:53 Checking your pH and salts concentration of your nutrients is analogous to checking the fluids in your car. You can get away with not doing it but it is not recommended. It's extra work and expense but gives you important information on the condition of your nutrients. Product.....pH..............cF...........ppm Tomato....6.0 - 6.5...20 - 50......1400 - 3500 Posted by: Luckyleaf 7 TN (My Page) on Sat, Oct 16, 04 at 11:17 How do I get the PPM up to 1400-3500? Just add 2x the recommended dose of the nutes for the plants? The PPM of my water is ~50, so thats a far way to go Posted by: willard3 (My Page) on Sun, Oct 17, 04 at 9:58 It will make a difference how large your reservoir is to get nutrients up to correct ppm. Start keeping a log and how much and when to add and change nutrients will become much clearer to you. PPM and Ph are closely related so you should test and record Ph as well. Posted by: Luckyleaf 7 TN (My Page) on Sun, Oct 17, 04 at 15:49 Well I'm doing 5 gal bubblers, and I wont have a reservoir. It is usually like a tsp or something per gallon for each nute, but since tomatoes have different needs I would have to do something like a tbsp per gal? ...in general I would have to use more than the recommended dose Posted by: willard3 (My Page) on Mon, Oct 18, 04 at 8:49 All nutrients are different; all nutrients have different mineral concentrations. 1. Go buy an EC meter 2. add nutrients 3. Measure nutrient concentration Posted by: Hydro4me z5 IN (My Page) on Tue, Oct 19, 04 at 11:37 Hey there Adriana, I have the (brand name) Nutrient Meter, but it reads, "442", "KCL", and "uS" (which I believe is micro siemens). I have heard that the 442 is good for testing pond water with fish and plants, and KCL is potassium chloride. I have no clue which one to use for testing my Millennium nutrients. I try to keep the blinking LED's in the middle, but peppers or tomatoes require higher levels. Any advice from other hydro gardeners? Thanks, Jason Posted by: willard3 (My Page) on Wed, Oct 20, 04 at 21:25 Most published stuff on hydro is given in ppm. I have on that has been working fine for 5 yrs. RE: meters ppm (ec) and ph Posted by: NLG1 7b-8a (My Page) on Wed, Apr 27, 05 at 18:11 You can find meters for around $30.00. They work, but for how long is the real question. What you want out of a meter. 1: waterproof 2: warranty 3: replaceable probe 4: pH range 1-14 +/- .1 5: ppm range 1-1999 Posted by: willard3 (My Page) on Thu, Apr 28, 05 at 9:20 A good cheap meter is an oxymoron. You should get a good meter, no matter what it costs. Hydro goes sooooo much better if you know accurately and repeatable the Ph and EC of nutrient solution. $50/meter is what I paid and it's worth every penny. Posted by: HydroBotany Indoors (My Page) on Fri, Oct 28, 05 at 18:40 (HydroBotany suggests a double junction (DJ) product). That is the most important thing with hydroponics. A DJ meter handles the environment the best and last the longest. artisan also has a good meter and it can be used continuously if you want it to RE: meters ppm(ec) and ph Posted by: hank_mili Z11 (My Page) on Fri, Oct 28, 05 at 21:49 I tend to be biased toward (another product). Very reliable. No problems so far. RE: Looking for a nutrient meter Posted by marshallwilson z4 CO (My Page) on Sun, Sep 25, 05 at 9:27 New to hydroponics. Basic ebb and flow system. Using 2 part dry nutrients (from CK). Currently outside, will be moving inside under lights soon. I'm looking for an inexpensive way to monitor my nutrient level. Hoping for suggestions on meters. As an alternative; can I just change out the entire solution every 2 weeks (suggestion from the local hydro shop)? I do get a fair amount of evaporation during the 2 week cycle. Should I just top off the nut solution with plain water? Thanks Marshall Response: Posted by: propman Z10 CA (My Page) on Sun, Sep 25, 05 at 11:47 I just got a ppm meter for about $35. Before that I just used the recommended dose on the bottle per gallon of water. What I found when I tested the water was way too stong because my water has 150 ppm before I added nutrients. The meter is a good idea. Here is a link that might be useful: pictures of my lettuce Posted by: hank_mili Z11 (My Page) on Sat, Oct 22, 05 at 1:03 Hope you have a pH meter or strips. One can calculate ppm but you can only measure pH. RE: Looking for a nutrient meter Posted by: HydroBotany Indoors (My Page) on Fri, Oct 28, 05 at 18:03 Just top it off with plain water.